MSB Select II

[pdub]

Love the Aurender Conductor (but 90% of my listening is Tidal/Qobuz rather than files on HDD) ... Also, love the play/pause buttons on Aurender and the way volume can fade out/fade in if one so chooses, which makes stopping/starting in the middle of a cut to take a call much more pleasant. Really glad to hear that some have found the Aurender not to be at a sonic disadvantage.

[Mike Lavigne]

Hi Battles,

I will chime in with a perspective regarding regarding the Aurender N30 and the Taiko Extreme. To be fully transparent, I do not own either. However, I did have the opportunity to hear both in the same system during a 3 or so hour session.

The system consisted of both the Taiko Extreme and the Aurender N30. The DAC was the MSB Select II with Boulder Pre and Power Amps driving a pair of Vivíd G1 Spirits.

In this particular system, to my ears, my preference was with the Aurender N30. Why? I thought the presentation with the Aurender had better pace , rhythm and realism. Violin strings sound had a wonderful texture that was not present in the Taiko. Piano notes were more realistic. And, I felt the Taiko had a little bit of grain that was not present in the N30’s presentation. Was this a huge problem? No, but doing a back to back listening of the same music highlighted the differences to me.

Also, this may/may not be important to you but the Aurender seemed easier to use and it has the large screen with album art. We had some challenges getting the Taiko and Roon to work. The Aurender operation was flawless.

Lastly, this is my perspective as a result of a single session. Clearly, both are top notch machines.

can you provide some details about this compare? how long ago? was it at a dealer? do they represent both products? which server was resident? which was the visitor? if it was hard to get Roon to work it's logical the Taiko was the visitor.

was this files? streaming? USB? Ethernet? which interface was used on the MSB Select II? Pro USB? Renderer v2? did the Taiko have the new USB card? i'm assuming there was no listening to the TAS music management system. was streaming Tidal only? Quboz only? or both? MQA?

assuming the same power cord and Ethernet or USB cable was used for both?

shelf situation the same for both?

just trying to understand as set-up with a server is pretty critical. most people involve Taiko remoting into their network for optimal set-up.

to be clear; your comments stand fine on their own, but any details help me to understand better.

[Ritmo]

Mike,

The listening sessions was held within the last 45 days or so. It was held at a dealer that represents and sells both brands. There was no bias of one brand vs the other.

The process was pretty straightforward. We listened to the same set of songs on both devices. The source was Qobuz. I can’t recall the brand of the cables used. The connection to the Select II was made via USB; once we finished with the Taiko, we disconnected it and used that same USB cable for the Aurender. All components were set on a Critical Mass rack.

The Taiko had recently been upgraded with the new USB board and had the latest software level; don’t know the version but was discussed at the dealer.

I visited this dealer previously, and as you mentioned, a Taiko representative was on the phone and was making some configuration changes by remoting into the Extreme. I was glad to see their engagement with their product to ensure proper setup.

Thx!

[Alpinist]

Thanks Mike and Jim for your comments on your head-to-head shootout of the Taiko Extreme and the Aurender N30SA. Using both servers on the MSB Select DAC with Pro USB and identical components and cables makes this a very important comparison, which I have not seen before. I look forward to doing the shootout myself.

Best,
Ken

[still-one]

Mike,

The listening sessions was held within the last 45 days or so. It was held at a dealer that represents and sells both brands. There was no bias of one brand vs the other.

The process was pretty straightforward. We listened to the same set of songs on both devices. The source was Qobuz. I can’t recall the brand of the cables used. The connection to the Select II was made via USB; once we finished with the Taiko, we disconnected it and used that same USB cable for the Aurender. All components were set on a Critical Mass rack.

The Taiko had recently been upgraded with the new USB board and had the latest software level; don’t know the version but was discussed at the dealer.

I visited this dealer previously, and as you mentioned, a Taiko representative was on the phone and was making some configuration changes by remoting into the Extreme. I was glad to see their engagement with their product to ensure proper setup.

Thx!

Yep, as Mike noted it was almost exactly 4 weeks ago. All in all a very straight forward comparison If there was any bias going in I would have to say I in the past I was never a fan of Aurrender.

[Darryl R]

It looks like what I read about Optimized was incorrect. Why isn't the above in the owners manual and on the MSB website? And why doesn't MSB give this info to the MSB reviewers? (If they do, my apologies but it would be incumbent on them to make sure Optimized vs. Native is understood and reported correctly)

Hello Fellow MSB Owners:

It's been a while, but this was one of the first places I came to get info about MSB. It's still my favorite piece(s), my favorite manufacturer, and dare I say Michael is my favorite dealer :O

Regarding the above question, I researched this last year, and based on all I could find, including a somewhat generalized response from MSB, I concluded "Optimized" was an internal PCM conversion. But now having read @DSMSB here, I like his elaboration. In retrospect, I think the answer is MSB doesn't want us to know exactly what's going on, but just to have the options.

In my system, Native DSD sounds great, but PCM is just fabulous. Being a lover of classical music, with so many Asian sources invested in DSD, DSD is something I continue to use heavily. The few quad DSD I have sound fantastic. One thing I haven't done is compare DSD256 and DXD, but I suspect the MSB would favor DXD.

EDIT: now for the real reason I'm here, Aurender v. Taiko. Very interesting! I read the manufacturer write-up on the N30SA, and they've done some very cool engineering. I like the less bulky, two-chassis configuration. The only downside I see is paying for things I don't need. I think the real breakthrough for MSB owners would be if someone could make a server expansion card with the proprietary ISL interface, ridding us of the universal interface altogether.

[Backpacker]

It sounds like Roon was used on the Taiko. However, the Taiko player is reported to sound much batter than Roon. Innuous now has their own player as well and it is also supposed to sound much batter than Roon. Aurender has always had their own app.

[Mike]

It sounds like Roon was used on the Taiko. However, the Taiko player is reported to sound much batter than Roon. Innuous now has their own player as well and it is also supposed to sound much batter than Roon. Aurender has always had their own app.

See post #150 for clarification.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[still-one]

It sounds like Roon was used on the Taiko. However, the Taiko player is reported to sound much batter than Roon. Innuous now has their own player as well and it is also supposed to sound much batter than Roon. Aurender has always had their own app.

Nope, although I prefer to use Roon it was not used in this comparison.

[Alpinist]

Hi Mike Lavigne,

I always wanted to ask you, what do you consider to be the anchor component of your system? In other words, if you could keep only one component, which one would you choose to build a new system around?

Thanks,
Ken

[Mike Lavigne]

Hi Mike Lavigne,

I always wanted to ask you, what do you consider to be the anchor component of your system? In other words, if you could keep only one component, which one would you choose to build a new system around?

Thanks,
Ken

hi Ken,

read your question, and thought about it, thought about it some more, trying to decide. there are a couple of choices.....depending on where i started. it's hard to imagine starting anywhere but in my current room. if we were re-booting on the room, then i might go a different path.

in my current room the speaker <-> room relationship trumps all other things. so it would start there. Evolution Acoustics MM7's. i've put so much sweat-equity into room tuning. that would be the one thing to retain and build upon.

the dart 468 mono-blocks are the heart of the system, and would likely be most essential if i were starting from scratch in a new dedicated room. there is just nothing like them. they would work great with any sources, in any room and with any speakers.

lastly if i were to downsize to a smaller home, maybe with a single 'great room' shared with my wife, then it might be digital only with the MSB Select II as the center piece. could even be headphones. the Select would be outstanding in any space. could still have vinyl with the Select II as it has the analog inputs.

btw; as i near retirement and dream about my priorities all these scenarios have crossed my mind.

[Alpinist]

hi Ken,

read your question, and thought about it, thought about it some more, trying to decide. there are a couple of choices.....depending on where i started. it's hard to imagine starting anywhere but in my current room. if we were re-booting on the room, then i might go a different path.

in my current room the speaker <-> room relationship trumps all other things. so it would start there. Evolution Acoustics MM7's. i've put so much sweat-equity into room tuning. that would be the one thing to retain and build upon.

the dart 468 mono-blocks are the heart of the system, and would likely be most essential if i were starting from scratch in a new dedicated room. there is just nothing like them. they would work great with any sources, in any room and with any speakers.

lastly if i were to downsize to a smaller home, maybe with a single 'great room' shared with my wife, then it might be digital only with the MSB Select II as the center piece. could even be headphones. the Select would be outstanding in any space.

Great and well thought out answer Mike, thanks!

[Bobvin]

Having had the good fortune to hear Mike’s rig, I can understand the speaker <-> room component, and if it were in another space I can appreciate the DartZeel point-of-view. I had the good fortune to have the Dart NHB-108 v2 in my system for a couple weeks, and it is an amazing sound. It played very, very well into both Diesis and Alsyvox. I can appreciate anyone’s affinity to DartZeel. Awesome components!

[Alpinist]

Reposting this in the appropriate location.

If you’re wondering why MSB hasn’t made any hardware updates to the Select II DAC it’s because they haven’t been able to improve on any of the individual areas of its modular design.

According to the company, the greatest improvements in recent years have been on its digital input modules. The logical next step for them is to develop a purely optical connection (no USB) from the music server to its Pro ISL (optical) digital input module.

This could be done in a collaborative effort between Taiko and MSB with Taiko’s Extreme model or by developing their own music server in house. This final step would enable the Select II DAC to realize the last bit of its full potential.

Ken

[The Sandman]

hi Ken,

read your question, and thought about it, thought about it some more, trying to decide. there are a couple of choices.....depending on where i started. it's hard to imagine starting anywhere but in my current room. if we were re-booting on the room, then i might go a different path.

in my current room the speaker <-> room relationship trumps all other things. so it would start there. Evolution Acoustics MM7's. i've put so much sweat-equity into room tuning. that would be the one thing to retain and build upon.

the dart 468 mono-blocks are the heart of the system, and would likely be most essential if i were starting from scratch in a new dedicated room. there is just nothing like them. they would work great with any sources, in any room and with any speakers.

lastly if i were to downsize to a smaller home, maybe with a single 'great room' shared with my wife, then it might be digital only with the MSB Select II as the center piece. could even be headphones. the Select would be outstanding in any space. could still have vinyl with the Select II as it has the analog inputs.

btw; as i near retirement and dream about my priorities all these scenarios have crossed my mind.

Great answer. I would suggest that the word anchor is not the best word to use in this regard. I would call it a keystone... the central principle or part of a policy, system, etc., on which all else depends. And I don't think you chose a keystone - I think it chooses you.