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  1. #1
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    M400 Multi-Monoblock configuration heard at a Music Matters event

    I am sorry that I don't have a picture of this configuration (I am sure I will eventually see one out there from the event and will add it here), but I had to put a short blurb on it as I didn't even know that it was supported/available.

    My wife an I went to "Music Matters" event in Seattle event this week and saw Four (4, count them) M400 Monoblocks setup two per channel such that each M400 covered the positive or negative portion of the waveform. (Talk about a monster push-pull configuration!)

    Right M400 #1 : Right Channel Positive portion of the waveform
    Right M400 #2: Right Channel Negative portion of the waveform
    Left M400 #1: Left Channel Positive portion of the waveform
    Left M400 #2: Left Channel Negative portion of the waveform

    That's 1000W/channel into 8 ohms (2000W/channel into 4 ohms) if you are keeping score.

    The rest of the system consisted of a Clearaudio "Understatement" TT, dCS Vivaldi full stack, D'Agostino Preamp and Phono, Wilson Audio Alexx, Transparent Audio Gen 5 cabling.

    My wife and I own DAG stuff, so we obviously are biased that direction in amplification. In our opinion, the entire system sounded magnificent.

    To keep this really short, I will just say that this amplifier configuration doesn't lose any of the wonderful finesse, delicacy, accuracy, and musicality of what (we believe) you get in the standard M400 Monoblock configuration and gives you a ton more muscle if your system needs any more.

    So, for you DAN guys and girls out there that wished the M400 had more juice (not sure you would need more, but I have heard some people want more); this is an option. And what a killer option it is in our humble opinion.

    Mike (from DAG) stated some of his customers use this configuration for their systems already.

    Thanks.
    Front End: MSB Select II DAC, MSB Reference Transport, Magnum Dynalab MD107T, Aiwa AD-F990
    Amplification: Dan D'Agostino Momentum HD Preamplifier & Momentum M400 MxV Monoblocks, Crown XLS 2502 (x3) (subwoofers)
    Speakers: Scaena La Maitresse Ultime Loudspeaker System
    Cables: Shunyata Aeros Aurora-SP, Shunyata Aeros Aurora-IC, Jungson Golden Dragon
    Power: GigaWatt PC-4 EVO+, GigaWatt LS-2HCEVO, Jungson Pure Power, JPS Labs AC+, Transparent HPPC
    Miscellaneous: ​Bohmer/Legacy Audio Wavelet DSP/Room Correction

  2. #2
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    Re: M400 Multi-Monoblock configuration heard at a Music Matters event

    Quote Originally Posted by laynesaddiction View Post
    I am sorry that I don't have a picture of this configuration (I am sure I will eventually see one out there from the event and will add it here), but I had to put a short blurb on it as I didn't even know that it was supported/available.

    My wife an I went to "Music Matters" event in Seattle event this week and saw Four (4, count them) M400 Monoblocks setup two per channel such that each M400 covered the positive or negative portion of the waveform. (Talk about a monster push-pull configuration!)

    Right M400 #1 : Right Channel Positive portion of the waveform
    Right M400 #2: Right Channel Negative portion of the waveform
    Left M400 #1: Left Channel Positive portion of the waveform
    Left M400 #2: Left Channel Negative portion of the waveform

    That's 1000W/channel into 8 ohms (2000W/channel into 4 ohms) if you are keeping score.

    The rest of the system consisted of a Clearaudio "Understatement" TT, dCS Vivaldi full stack, D'Agostino Preamp and Phono, Wilson Audio Alexx, Transparent Audio Gen 5 cabling.

    My wife and I own DAG stuff, so we obviously are biased that direction in amplification. In our opinion, the entire system sounded magnificent.

    To keep this really short, I will just say that this amplifier configuration doesn't lose any of the wonderful finesse, delicacy, accuracy, and musicality of what (we believe) you get in the standard M400 Monoblock configuration and gives you a ton more muscle if your system needs any more.

    So, for you DAN guys and girls out there that wished the M400 had more juice (not sure you would need more, but I have heard some people want more); this is an option. And what a killer option it is in our humble opinion.

    Mike (from DAG) stated some of his customers use this configuration for their systems already.

    Thanks.

    Wilson Audio have multiple pairs of M400s. After spending a couple of days with the bridged ones at Definitive, we may have to send a couple pair of ours back to be reconfigured. They truly are very special.

  3. #3
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    Re: M400 Multi-Monoblock configuration heard at a Music Matters event

    Anthony ,

    What is Dan running them in .. Fully balanced line configuration .... ?

  4. #4
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    Re: M400 Multi-Monoblock configuration heard at a Music Matters event

    Quote Originally Posted by a.wayne View Post
    Anthony ,

    What is Dan running them in .. Fully balanced line configuration .... ?
    I believe so since the standard M400 is fully differential balanced and in this configuration they just split off the positive and negative phases and fed them to separate amplifiers. So, they were pushing/pulling the positive/negative between the amp pairs instead of just doing it fully differential balanced within a single M400.
    Front End: MSB Select II DAC, MSB Reference Transport, Magnum Dynalab MD107T, Aiwa AD-F990
    Amplification: Dan D'Agostino Momentum HD Preamplifier & Momentum M400 MxV Monoblocks, Crown XLS 2502 (x3) (subwoofers)
    Speakers: Scaena La Maitresse Ultime Loudspeaker System
    Cables: Shunyata Aeros Aurora-SP, Shunyata Aeros Aurora-IC, Jungson Golden Dragon
    Power: GigaWatt PC-4 EVO+, GigaWatt LS-2HCEVO, Jungson Pure Power, JPS Labs AC+, Transparent HPPC
    Miscellaneous: ​Bohmer/Legacy Audio Wavelet DSP/Room Correction

  5. #5
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    Re: M400 Multi-Monoblock configuration heard at a Music Matters event

    It takes 4 amplifiers to run full balanced line stereo , so it does appear thats what DAG is doing , PS Audio Paul McGowan disagrees with me and others on this , mostly because most run pseudo Balanced line input and call it Full balanced operation , but that is not true balanced operation IMO ..


    What DAG is doing with the 4 M400 amps is true balanced line operation ...

    Regards

  6. #6
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    Re: M400 Multi-Monoblock configuration heard at a Music Matters event

    While I still don't have a picture, of the setup here is what Bill McKiegan (DAG President...I mistakenly called him Mike above) said about the amplifier configuration.

    "At Music Matters this year, we are featuring something unique that we have never displayed at an event before. We will be using a double stack of our Momentum M400 mono amplifiers. As a balanced design, the Momentum M400 has separate signal paths for the positive and negative signals. In this special setup, we combine these two circuit paths into one, perform the same modification to another Momentum M400 and then couple them together to complete channel. We then duplicate this combination for the second channel. The resulting amplifier stack outputs over 1,000 watts into an 8 Ohm load!. It should be a very compelling presentation. "

    Thanks.
    Front End: MSB Select II DAC, MSB Reference Transport, Magnum Dynalab MD107T, Aiwa AD-F990
    Amplification: Dan D'Agostino Momentum HD Preamplifier & Momentum M400 MxV Monoblocks, Crown XLS 2502 (x3) (subwoofers)
    Speakers: Scaena La Maitresse Ultime Loudspeaker System
    Cables: Shunyata Aeros Aurora-SP, Shunyata Aeros Aurora-IC, Jungson Golden Dragon
    Power: GigaWatt PC-4 EVO+, GigaWatt LS-2HCEVO, Jungson Pure Power, JPS Labs AC+, Transparent HPPC
    Miscellaneous: ​Bohmer/Legacy Audio Wavelet DSP/Room Correction

  7. #7
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    Re: M400 Multi-Monoblock configuration heard at a Music Matters event

    I have met one of Larry's customers at Paragon who had Dan stack four M300's a couple of years ago. Sound like the same thin you sew at this event. I understand it sound great.
    Jim

    D'Agostino Momentum M-400's MxV’s & HD Pre-amp
    Wilson Alexandria X2 Series 2 speakers
    Digital: dCS Vivaldi APEX DAC, Clock & Upsampler
    Analog: SME 20/3 with Esoteric E-03 Phono
    Transparent Opus Speaker Cable & Interconnects & Opus Power Cords
    Power Cords on Digital: Shunyata
    Power Conditioner - Shunyata Everest

  8. #8
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    Re: M400 Multi-Monoblock configuration heard at a Music Matters event

    REALLY!!!!!

    SOB

    I love my M400's but . . . . .

    Anybody compared this setup compared to the lowly 2 M400 setup?

    Does this work in the M250 stereo amp setup? Or is that a stupid question since the M400 monos are sorta the M250 doubled - sort of speak????? I confuse my self with this voodoo . . . . . . . . .
    Jock

    If you have integrity, nothing else matters. If you don't have integrity, nothing else matters.

    ---------

    House: Naim ND555/2PS, Naim 552, Naim 500, Studer A80/Doshi V3, Magico M2s, 2 Magico Q-Sub 15s, Lumina IC/SC, Shunyata Everest and Omega PCs.

    Workshop: Naim ND555/2 PS, VAC Master Pre, VAC Sig 200iQ, Border Patrol pre/power, Avant Garde Duo Mezzo XD, 2 Magico Q-Sub 15s, Shunyata IC/SC, Shunyata Typhon QR/Triton V3/Sigma PCs.

  9. #9
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    Re: M400 Multi-Monoblock configuration heard at a Music Matters event

    I nicked this off a Stereophile post on this event showing the M400 setup.

    Attached Images Attached Images
    Front End: MSB Select II DAC, MSB Reference Transport, Magnum Dynalab MD107T, Aiwa AD-F990
    Amplification: Dan D'Agostino Momentum HD Preamplifier & Momentum M400 MxV Monoblocks, Crown XLS 2502 (x3) (subwoofers)
    Speakers: Scaena La Maitresse Ultime Loudspeaker System
    Cables: Shunyata Aeros Aurora-SP, Shunyata Aeros Aurora-IC, Jungson Golden Dragon
    Power: GigaWatt PC-4 EVO+, GigaWatt LS-2HCEVO, Jungson Pure Power, JPS Labs AC+, Transparent HPPC
    Miscellaneous: ​Bohmer/Legacy Audio Wavelet DSP/Room Correction

  10. #10
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    Re: M400 Multi-Monoblock configuration heard at a Music Matters event

    Quote Originally Posted by the professor View Post
    REALLY!!!!!

    SOB

    I love my M400's but . . . . .

    Anybody compared this setup compared to the lowly 2 M400 setup?

    Does this work in the M250 stereo amp setup? Or is that a stupid question since the M400 monos are sorta the M250 doubled - sort of speak????? I confuse my self with this voodoo . . . . . . . . .
    I do not know if they offer this setup for the M250.

    As far as comparing this setup to a standard pair of M400s, it is somewhat tough for me to accurately give a detailed opinion since the music that was played during my listen was totally unfamiliar to me.

    What I can say is that I didn't feel that any of (IMHO) the strengths of the M400 (microdynamics, musicality, timbre, separation of instruments within the soundstage, etc.) were exaggerated or compromised with additional power. I might argue that the transient attacks of cymbal hits, initial thrust of air of the pipes (on the pipe organ tracks), and other items in that "instantaneous microdynamic aspect" were produced with more ease. I might also argue that the low-end seemed to flow with more authority and oomph in the system. However, again, I didn't know the music and hesitate to make any conclusions based on what I heard. Although, both my wife and me were very happy with the sound and the fact that "going big" with the 4 stacked M400 didn't lose any of the strengths or finesse of the standard pair setup. In our humble opinion, sometimes when you try to "go big", you might gain a bunch of speed or dynamic aspects, but you throw away either musicality or finesse of the smaller system.

    We did not feel any of the musicality or finesse was lost in this setup. And that, to us, was a big deal.

    I am not sure if the store will keep this setup for a few days after the show, but if they do; my wife and I would certainly like to bring source material we are familiar with and give it a go.
    Front End: MSB Select II DAC, MSB Reference Transport, Magnum Dynalab MD107T, Aiwa AD-F990
    Amplification: Dan D'Agostino Momentum HD Preamplifier & Momentum M400 MxV Monoblocks, Crown XLS 2502 (x3) (subwoofers)
    Speakers: Scaena La Maitresse Ultime Loudspeaker System
    Cables: Shunyata Aeros Aurora-SP, Shunyata Aeros Aurora-IC, Jungson Golden Dragon
    Power: GigaWatt PC-4 EVO+, GigaWatt LS-2HCEVO, Jungson Pure Power, JPS Labs AC+, Transparent HPPC
    Miscellaneous: ​Bohmer/Legacy Audio Wavelet DSP/Room Correction

  11. #11
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    Re: M400 Multi-Monoblock configuration heard at a Music Matters event

    Quote Originally Posted by still-one View Post
    I have met one of Larry's customers at Paragon who had Dan stack four M300's a couple of years ago. Sound like the same thin you sew at this event. I understand it sound great.
    If I am not mistaken Jim, the person to whom you refer's system was the first time it was done.

  12. #12
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    Re: M400 Multi-Monoblock configuration heard at a Music Matters event

    Quote Originally Posted by metaphacts View Post
    If I am not mistaken Jim, the person to whom you refer's system was the first time it was done.
    Bill, you are correct.
    Jim

    D'Agostino Momentum M-400's MxV’s & HD Pre-amp
    Wilson Alexandria X2 Series 2 speakers
    Digital: dCS Vivaldi APEX DAC, Clock & Upsampler
    Analog: SME 20/3 with Esoteric E-03 Phono
    Transparent Opus Speaker Cable & Interconnects & Opus Power Cords
    Power Cords on Digital: Shunyata
    Power Conditioner - Shunyata Everest

  13. #13
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    Re: M400 Multi-Monoblock configuration heard at a Music Matters event

    Thanks

    Quote Originally Posted by laynesaddiction View Post
    I do not know if they offer this setup for the M250.

    As far as comparing this setup to a standard pair of M400s, it is somewhat tough for me to accurately give a detailed opinion since the music that was played during my listen was totally unfamiliar to me.

    What I can say is that I didn't feel that any of (IMHO) the strengths of the M400 (microdynamics, musicality, timbre, separation of instruments within the soundstage, etc.) were exaggerated or compromised with additional power. I might argue that the transient attacks of cymbal hits, initial thrust of air of the pipes (on the pipe organ tracks), and other items in that "instantaneous microdynamic aspect" were produced with more ease. I might also argue that the low-end seemed to flow with more authority and oomph in the system. However, again, I didn't know the music and hesitate to make any conclusions based on what I heard. Although, both my wife and me were very happy with the sound and the fact that "going big" with the 4 stacked M400 didn't lose any of the strengths or finesse of the standard pair setup. In our humble opinion, sometimes when you try to "go big", you might gain a bunch of speed or dynamic aspects, but you throw away either musicality or finesse of the smaller system.

    We did not feel any of the musicality or finesse was lost in this setup. And that, to us, was a big deal.

    I am not sure if the store will keep this setup for a few days after the show, but if they do; my wife and I would certainly like to bring source material we are familiar with and give it a go.
    Jock

    If you have integrity, nothing else matters. If you don't have integrity, nothing else matters.

    ---------

    House: Naim ND555/2PS, Naim 552, Naim 500, Studer A80/Doshi V3, Magico M2s, 2 Magico Q-Sub 15s, Lumina IC/SC, Shunyata Everest and Omega PCs.

    Workshop: Naim ND555/2 PS, VAC Master Pre, VAC Sig 200iQ, Border Patrol pre/power, Avant Garde Duo Mezzo XD, 2 Magico Q-Sub 15s, Shunyata IC/SC, Shunyata Typhon QR/Triton V3/Sigma PCs.

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M400 Multi-Monoblock configuration heard at a Music Matters event

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