Thread: New preamp in-bound: First Sound

Just an update for the gang...

Just got word from Emmanuel Go that my First Sound preamp will ship out next week.

The model is the First Sound Presence Deluxe MkIII-SI, a 2 chassis unit
w/ the Paramount Special Edition upgrade using Audio Cap copper capacitors.

The First Sound preamps are essentially "bespoke" preamps, each one crafted and tuned specifically for the owner's system and system components. The design is a true dual-mono design, two preamps in one main control chassis with the PS transformer and PS capacitors housed in an external chassis to maximize performance while minimizing the impact of noise and vibration on the main circuit. Additionally, there are two chassis in one, with an inner chassis comprised of copper-plated steel to function as a Faraday cage to further reduce the impact of external noise.

Special care is also provided to provide vibration-damping and even the fasteners were selected based on comprehensive, long-term, listening tests.
Notable are hand-assembled volume controls, utilizing individual exceptionally high-quality metal film resistors at each gain position and a massive power supply, exceeding the power supply capacitance and "stiffness" of many high-end power amplifiers.

Emmanuel is presently "crafting" it to match perfectly with the other components in my specific system.

I'll post photos of it when it arrives.

Wow, congratulations on an absolutely superb piece of kit. When I first got back into the hobby 15 or so years ago I heard First Sound gear at a shop in Seattle. You could build a system around that piece as you’ll have the cornerstone for remarkable sound. Nice choice — I very much look forward to hearing your thoughts as you get acquainted. I predict miles and miles of smiles and smiles!

Originally Posted by Bobvin

Wow, congratulations on an absolutely superb piece of kit. Nice choice — I very much look forward to hearing your thoughts as you get acquainted. I predict miles and miles of smiles and smiles!

Thanks, Bob. I've had one on loan here for some months, so I know well how superb these preamps are.

Originally Posted by joeinid

Congratulations, please keep the updates coming. I’ve always wondered about the First Sound gear. I’ve never read a bad word and only seen universal praise.

Thanks, Joe, will do. I can safely say the First Sound I've had on loan from a friend is the finest-sounding preamp I've ever heard. So, making a decision to get my own was an easy, well-informed one.

Originally Posted by Ritmo

Great news indeed, congratulations Stephen! Hard to believe you are moving away from CJ.

Thanks, Mike. Kinda hard for me to believe, too. The design philosophies of both companies are very, very similar: simple circuits and use the highest quality parts and construction techniques. The CT-5 and First Sound are very close and comparable tonally and in overall character (which is to say very transparent and neutral). But with fewer design compromises, the First Sound is notably quieter, more layered, 3-dimensional, and fully and finely articulated than the CT-5...its a lot like what the CT-5 would be if you went "all out" in the direction of say, the dual-chassis ART2 with an external power supply. With it's larger, external power supply, higher quality volume controls, dual-mono design, sophisticated grounding system, etc., etc.

So, I don't think of it as a moving away from CJ, but rather, moving to an "unconstrained" CT-5 or ACT2.

The First Sound preamps are essentially "bespoke" preamps, each one crafted and tuned specifically for the owner's system and system components.

Does that mean that you are locked in to your present set of components?

The only drawbacks of the FirstSound pre-amps, IMHO, was the volume control for each channel is a separate unit which means you get to set the volume twice each time you make a change, and no remote control is offered. I understand the purist approach, but personally appreciate having a remote.

Those design and implementation of the volume controls is really something!

Puma, has this changed in any way?

Originally Posted by Speedskater

The First Sound preamps are essentially "bespoke" preamps, each one crafted and tuned specifically for the owner's system and system components.

Does that mean that you are locked in to your present set of components?

No, not at all. If I ever changed components, I could send the First Sound back to Emmanuel for "re-crafting/refinement". But I don't ever see upgrading my power amp or phono stage. The one I have on loan from a buddy was "dropped in" to my system and...it is AMAZING. So, no, I don't lose sleep about these things.

Originally Posted by Bobvin

The only drawbacks of the FirstSound pre-amps, IMHO, was the volume control for each channel is a separate unit which means you get to set the volume twice each time you make a change, and no remote control is offered. I understand the purist approach, but personally appreciate having a remote.

Those design and implementation of the volume controls is really something!

Puma, has this changed in any way?

Hi Bob,
I don't know the design history of the volume attenuator since when you heard the First Sound. Originally, Holco resistors were used, but for the model I'm getting, the III-SI with the Paramount Special Edition upgrade, the resistors are Vishay resistors. As for a remote, my listening space is so small, its not a problem to get up and change the volume. And I listen at the same gain setting for 90% of my content, so the percent of time I need to change volume is minimal.

So, here's some more detail on the First Sound preamp I'm getting:

Basic Model: Presence Deluxe Mk III

Dual Mono Construction using Copper Plated Steel Chassis
• Step Attenuators, Ladder Type using individual resistors (see below), designated as LTH 92
• SPS 2.0 External Power Supply w/ detachable umbilical cord

The First Sound on loan from a friend...standard silver face plate and knobs.


Interior of chassis (photo from a review)


MkIII-S upgrade
• MPDA (multi-phase differential array) developed by Shunyata Research. A sophisticated and innovative proprietary power line noise reduction filter array. Uses advanced 30 element surface mount components that significantly reduce power line noise.
• PSDS (power supply delivery system) An advanced system utilized for the power supplies..
• Upgraded main circuit boards
• Upgraded power supply circuits boards
• Additional 500 extra steps in the craftsmanship of this upgrade
MKIII-SI Upgrade
• As above with the addition of proprietary component filters that isolate electrical noise.
Paramount Special Edition upgrade
As the Presence Deluxe MKIII-SI with the addition of:
• LTV 92 Step Attenuators, Ladder Type attenuators using naked Vishay Resistors
• Upgraded (Stage 3) Capacitors using AudioCap copper capacitors
• Expanded power supply capacitors
• Special Edition grounding topology

Volume attenuator


Interior copper chassis


My unit will be a black chassis with gold knobs, for an MBL-vibe.

Originally Posted by Randy Myers

It looks great! It must be a great sounding unit.

It's fantastic...best preamp I've ever heard.

I'm happy you've refreshed my memory... should the day come I part with my ARC REF10, FirstSound would be on my shortlist. Black with Gold should look terrific, it is already a very aesthetically pleasing design. Whomever loaned you one must be a true friend!

Originally Posted by Randy Myers

So even the inputs are selected separate. That is unique . I don't know if I have ever seen a line stage where the inputs are selected separately for each channel.

Yes, it is unique. Emmanuel designed this as a "no-compromises" preamp.

And I don't think I've ever seen a line stage with separately selected line input either, but this is because it is literally is two completely separate, mono preamps contained within in a single exterior box.

No, I haven't heard a GAT, I would love to, but I also don't have $20K for a GAT S2.

The ET-6 is an ET-3 with WBT RCA jacks, other than that, it is virtually identical to an ET-3. This was confirmed to me by a friend that was in the market for a new CJ pre and called and spoke directly to Jeff, the principal owner at CJ, and asked what the difference between the ET3 and ET6 was. Jeff said the chassis for the ET6 is taller because the size of the WBT jacks mandated a taller chassis. I've heard the ET-3 and it was really very nice, but...it was not as good as my Pr17LS, and the CT-5 is clearly superior to the Pr17LS.

Originally Posted by XV-1

Not sure what the retail price of the First Sound is, but the ET7S2 would be the similar model I would assume - a lot closer to GAT than ET6.
personally I could not live with 2db volume steps and no remote

enjoy the new preamp.

IIRC, An ET7 S2 is $12,000.

Originally Posted by XV-1

personally I could not live with 2db volume steps and no remote

enjoy the new preamp.

It's not a problem, I almost always listen at the same level and I only sit about 7 feet in front of the audio rack, getting up to change the volume is not a problem.

The many upsides the First Sound preamp brings outweighs any slight inconveniences.

All product design is a set of functional compromises and feature tradeoffs, and Emmanuel Go tries to make as few compromises as possible with respect to seeking the absolute best possible sound quality.

If you ever heard a First Sound pre, you'd understand. Emmanuel just wrote me today to ask if I ever used the Tape Outs as he can improve the performance further by disabling them.

Originally Posted by UltraFast69

KingRex runs this preamp, it’s certainly a contender.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Heheheh, if ya haven't heard one, ya don't know the half of it!

Originally Posted by Randy Myers

So Puma, when is this piece coming in? Looking forward to your thoughts after it has settled into your system.

Arrives Tuesday.

So, my First Sound preamp arrrived yesterday, and I have installed and started burning it in. I just did the first "cap forming" discharge/re-charge step that Emmanuel recommends after about a day of playing continuously. Emmanuel recommends doing this 2-3X a day to help with the cap forming as part of the burn-in process.

This unit arrived as a First Sound Presence Deluxe 4.0 MkIII-SI version with 2 external power supplies, Shunyata Research umbilicals, and the "super special edition" upgrade, so Emmanuel really delivered with this beautiful product.

The power supply has 145,200 uF of capacitance/channel for a total of 290,400 uF of power supply capacitance.

Will post some pics in the next day or so when I have some real light in the room.

Just another 13 days or so of continual playing with 2-3 cap forming sessions/day to go!

Originally Posted by Randy Myers

Awesome, congratulations! Enjoy some music while breaking it in also. I love hearing the differences as a new piece breaks in .

Oh, I've been listening to it every evening for about 4 hours. I'll have it also when I am working on building up my little AmpCamp amp.

Some first pics....

Control unit front panel...definitely an MBL vibe...


The two massive exterior power supplies, one for each channel; these connect to the main control unit with umbilicals by Shunyata.

Originally Posted by Randy Myers

That is great. I think I like the black better then the white one! I definitely see the MBL vibe ....

Thanks, Randy. My system components were already a mish-mash of gold tone and silver, so the MBL vibe is fine. Just happy to have the preamp.

Congratulations Puma. I have had my First Sound for about 4 or 5 years. It started as a basic Mark 3. Emmanuel came to my house and set it up. After a couple days I said something sounded off. He came back to my house with a handful of power cords. One by one he started removing the mishmash of cords in my system. At first I said it was sounding flat. He thought it was going in the correct direction and asked to go on. I forget what the last component was he changed the cord on but we both looked at each other dumbfounded. It all clicked. In short, Emmanuel was the first person to teach me about tuning and what to listen for. Amazing person to spend time with me like that.

Over the years I have followed all the updated Emmanuel offered. I even bought the duel power supply. I think the only difference between our units is mine has Clarity caps.

It really is a foundation piece in my system. One that I can't see ever replacing. It is by far the best sounding out of the Rogue, Airtight and McIntosh I use to own. Its rock solid. Never ever had an issue. And its so gentle on tubes. I must have 10 or 12 thousand hours on my Telefunken E88cc. Try those tubes. I hate to say it but Upscale has good tubes. But they last. The Siemens is also very good. Dont screw with the OA2. It will explode if you try the nos on ebay.

I have never worried about the volume. I set it and pretty much forget it. It does what it is suppose to do so well you feel little to no need to get up and fiddle with it. Only when charging album. Or your just ready for a big change.

His power cord is alright. I find a nice copper 12 awg is great. It does not need any Noise Reducing or filtering equipment in front of it. Strait to the wall or into a power strip that is only a multi outlet power supply. Nothing else.

The power supply dont seem to care what they are on. The main housing does. Play around a little. Ultrafast brought stillpoints over one day and they sounded excellent. But its all system dependent.

Enjoy.

Originally Posted by Kingrex

Congratulations Puma. I have had my First Sound for about 4 or 5 years. It started as a basic Mark 3. Emmanuel came to my house and set it up. After a couple days I said something sounded off. He came back to my house with a handful of power cords. One by one he started removing the mishmash of cords in my system. At first I said it was sounding flat. He thought it was going in the correct direction and asked to go on. I forget what the last component was he changed the cord on but we both looked at each other dumbfounded. It all clicked. In short, Emmanuel was the first person to teach me about tuning and what to listen for. Amazing person to spend time with me like that.

Over the years I have followed all the updated Emmanuel offered. I even bought the duel power supply. I think the only difference between our units is mine has Clarity caps.

It really is a foundation piece in my system. One that I can't see ever replacing. It is by far the best sounding out of the Rogue, Airtight and McIntosh I use to own. Its rock solid. Never ever had an issue. And its so gentle on tubes. I must have 10 or 12 thousand hours on my Telefunken E88cc. Try those tubes. I hate to say it but Upscale has good tubes. But they last. The Siemens is also very good. Dont screw with the OA2. It will explode if you try the nos on ebay.

I have never worried about the volume. I set it and pretty much forget it. It does what it is suppose to do so well you feel little to no need to get up and fiddle with it. Only when charging album. Or your just ready for a big change.

His power cord is alright. I find a nice copper 12 awg is great. It does not need any Noise Reducing or filtering equipment in front of it. Strait to the wall or into a power strip that is only a multi outlet power supply. Nothing else.

The power supply dont seem to care what they are on. The main housing does. Play around a little. Ultrafast brought stillpoints over one day and they sounded excellent. But its all system dependent.

Enjoy.

Hi Kingrex,
I am powering my FS with two Shunyata Alpha NR v2 power cords connected to my Shunyata Everest power distributor. It sounds fabulous.

If the 2 led are too bright, take a little cotton and push it in the hole with a tooth pick. Shrednit a.little and fluff it. You will find the correct density to cut the intensity but let you know its working.

Originally Posted by Kingrex

If the 2 led are too bright, take a little cotton and push it in the hole with a tooth pick. Shrednit a.little and fluff it. You will find the correct density to cut the intensity but let you know its working.

Thanks for the tip, the LEDs are fine.

I ran mine from a Denali for a week. It adds a nice energy and air. I do have some Addpower units that seem to mimic some of the effects I got from the shunyata gear.

Hope you enjoy it. I love mine.

Originally Posted by Kingrex

I ran mine from a Denali for a week. It adds a nice energy and air. I do have some Addpower units that seem to mimic some of the effects I got from the shunyata gear.

Hope you enjoy it. I love mine.

Thank you! I am already enjoying it very much.

More pics coming up!

Thought the gang would like to see some pics of the interior of the First Sound.

Top view without the covers; there are only two tubes, a 6DJ8 and OA tube per channel. The preamp is a true dual-mono design; two mono preamps mounted in a single chassis.



Just some, but not all of the power supply capacitance...and yes, that blue and brown wire is Shunyata Research OFE wire connecting everything. Emmanuel Go and Caelin collaborated on incorporating several Shunyata technologies into First Sound preamps. The 6DJ8 triodes can also be seen in this photo. These tubes are super-durable, with mean life over 100,000 hours.



The back panel shows input jacks, wiring and huge copper bus bars for making and grounding connections. Note that there is no ground wire for each RCA jack, only a single + connection. There is also no insulation on the wires so as to not have any dielectric effect from various insulation materials; the dielectric in this case is air. The entire copper bus bar serves a ground for all inputs. There is also a switch (little red box) for each channel that lets me float the ground in the advent of any ground hum (there isn't; this preamp is DEAD QUIET).


A close-up of the volume attenuator with individual metal film resistors.


There are also large, heavy, copper bus bars for chassis-grounding.


AudioCap copper capacitors.



A view of the front panel and part of the chassis interior...

Get rid of that preamp tube in a couple weeks. Its shocking how good this preamp gets with a nos tube. You haven't heard anything yet.

Originally Posted by Kingrex

Get rid of that preamp tube in a couple weeks. Its shocking how good this preamp gets with a nos tube. You haven't heard anything yet.

Which NOS tube specifically do you recommend?