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  1. #51
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    So, what do you think of your Hattor? I am absolutely loving mine!
    Hattor; T+A; Bel Canto; McIntosh; Rega; Technics; SimAudio; Magnepan; Rythmik; Astell & Kern; HeadAmp; Abyss

    "You are entitled to your opinions but you are not entitled to your own facts"

  2. #52
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    Hi Randy,
    from the sound of hattor with AMRG resistors I'm excited, it's natural, transparent, with a lot of space, for me the ultimate choice. With a power amp understand impedance (the input impedance of my power amp is 94k), with a DAC as well, all connected by XLR cables.

  3. #53
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    Yea, I use XLR from my DAC and out to my AMP, both the T+A pieces. I use RCA from the tuner and phono stage and out to the SubWoofer. Oh, I do have XLR from the Oppo spinner, but I never spin disks...
    Hattor; T+A; Bel Canto; McIntosh; Rega; Technics; SimAudio; Magnepan; Rythmik; Astell & Kern; HeadAmp; Abyss

    "You are entitled to your opinions but you are not entitled to your own facts"

  4. #54
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    užívat si

  5. #55
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    Enjoy !

  6. #56
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    I have been playing a lot of vinyl lately and the Hattor is sounding wonderful so I was giving much of the credit to the new vinyl setup. Last night I played some digital and it has never sounded better so I got to give a lot of the credit to the Hattor as well! What a wonderful sounding pre-amp with all the inputs and outputs I could ever use. I could not be happier at this point!
    Hattor; T+A; Bel Canto; McIntosh; Rega; Technics; SimAudio; Magnepan; Rythmik; Astell & Kern; HeadAmp; Abyss

    "You are entitled to your opinions but you are not entitled to your own facts"

  7. #57
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    I decided to move some cables around a bit. I had read that the Hattor really could be made even better with certain cables on the outputs. I moved my AQ Amazon, (pure silver 1M in length) between the Hattor and the amp. I moved the AQ Anacondas (silver covered copper, 1.5M length) in between the DAC and the Hattor. So the better and shorter cable on the outputs. I had to adjust cable runs and slight gear equipment positioning to do this.

    It was worth it! More open, more impact on both vinyl and digital. Amazing improvements in sound stage, deeper, tighter bass. Very nice indeed!
    Hattor; T+A; Bel Canto; McIntosh; Rega; Technics; SimAudio; Magnepan; Rythmik; Astell & Kern; HeadAmp; Abyss

    "You are entitled to your opinions but you are not entitled to your own facts"

  8. #58
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    Hi Randy,
    I tried more xlr cables between Hattor and power amp, silver (VDH, XSymphony, AQ), hybrid and copper, I think it plays best with a cheap shielded copper cable star quad Canare (Neutrik XX gold-plated connectors) in the length of 0.8 meters. Enjoy

  9. #59
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    I am sure it is the synergy between various cables. I do believe the output cables appear to make a large difference. I think shorter is better (in my system anyway). Silver sounded better but that vary well might have been because the cables were also shorter. I do know that exchanging these cables made a very nice improvement. I also know the Hattor is an amazing line-stage!
    Hattor; T+A; Bel Canto; McIntosh; Rega; Technics; SimAudio; Magnepan; Rythmik; Astell & Kern; HeadAmp; Abyss

    "You are entitled to your opinions but you are not entitled to your own facts"

  10. #60
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    Another update experiment. A little background... with the Wyred 4 Sound STP-SE Stage 2 there was so much output that I could barely move the volume control without it getting far too loud. I know EJ says there is no gain until getting to the active stage, which honestly, is so loud that I never approached this. I used my Rothwell attenuators to bring the volume a little more under my control. It added the 10db attenuation without any negative sonic affects. They achieved their purpose and did what I desired.

    Last night I tried the Rothwell's on the DAC to bring my digital more inline in output to the phono stage. It did bring the outputs to similar level with the vinyl, however there was a huge caveat. I noticed very quickly that the performance was dragged down a few notches. Everything was lifeless, and much less dynamics. I noticed no sound quality difference when using these with the Stage 2.

    I can only concluded that the Hattor has moved the entire system to a much higher level in reveling the music. I believe it is more in tune with other changes in the system and forms great synergy with other components. It is so accurate and revealing that small changes elsewhere in the system are instantly apparent.

    I can honestly say I have never encountered another component that shows changes elsewhere in your system as much as the Hattor. Rather amazing in my view!
    Hattor; T+A; Bel Canto; McIntosh; Rega; Technics; SimAudio; Magnepan; Rythmik; Astell & Kern; HeadAmp; Abyss

    "You are entitled to your opinions but you are not entitled to your own facts"

  11. #61
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    to equalize the vinyl and digital source volumes, you might try moving the dac8 dsd analog out slide switch to "VRLB" from "FIXED" and then use the volume controls as a means of lowering the output level to be more in line with that of your vinyl.

    i have not noticed any SQ impact of using the VRBL setting on the few occasions i have tried it.
    kanjiroba yak + roon rock > t+a dac8 dsd > almarro a318b > viking acoustics berlin r mk2 | alp-tone audio analog cables
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  12. #62
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    Yea, I know I can do this, and have thought about it. I have been using it in FIXED mode which literally stops the signal from even going through the volume circuit. I know it probably will make no difference in performance because of how good T+A is, but I figured they designed it to by pass the circuit entirely for a reason. The McIntosh has a similar control on the rear of the unit.

    The Hattor is so revealing that small changes become instantly apparent. I was actually surprised at how obviously the Rothwell affected the sound. I have never heard a difference in performance using the Rothwell's before .

    ... ok, I gave this a try. As suspected T+A always does things the right way! I did not notice a quality depreciation using the built in circuit within the DAC 8 DSD.

    I did a very good comparison between digital and vinyl I might add. I used Shelby Lynne Just A Little Lovin for this comparison. I have the DSD download, one of the absolute best examples of DSD in my view, and ran through Roon and HQ Player at 24.6 Mhz. I also have a 200g 45 RPM pressing for the vinyl in the comparison. Again absolutely fantastic!

    They were very close. Overall I am going to give a very tiny advantage to the vinyl, with a small caveat. The bass was slightly tighter and the top high end was ever so slightly more present. Very small subtle differences, but also some surface noise (ever so slight pops and clicks) and of course the cleaning factor. Also flipping/exchanging the album every 2-3 songs. To me they are both fantastic but different and this even more proved the point. Deal with the caveats versus ease for an incredibly subtle change/improvement.

    I really enjoy my vinyl setup. I have been enthralled building a reasonable size collection of albums and learning many of the subtleties... however at this I believe that digital will probably start getting much more playing time. I will still spin an album, but I think I am moving to a new phase where digital will once again be very important!
    Hattor; T+A; Bel Canto; McIntosh; Rega; Technics; SimAudio; Magnepan; Rythmik; Astell & Kern; HeadAmp; Abyss

    "You are entitled to your opinions but you are not entitled to your own facts"

  13. #63
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    great to hear you did not experience any SQ degradation when engaging the t+a volume circuit.

    i had a look at the rega phono MC specs -- and while the output voltage is not explicitly specified, it does say: ...designed to amplify the signal from a moving coil cartridge to a level which can feed into a 200mV line level input on a standard hi-fi amplifier. so, i suspect the rega puts out quite a bit less voltage than the t+a which for fixed output lists 2.5V for single-ended and 5.0V for balanced.

    no wonder you were hearing such a large difference in volume between your analog and digital sources.

    so, what's this new digital phase you are embarking upon? :-)
    kanjiroba yak + roon rock > t+a dac8 dsd > almarro a318b > viking acoustics berlin r mk2 | alp-tone audio analog cables
    core audio designs
    plyKraft 3L | hifi racks ltd podium t5-iii

  14. #64
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    Hehe, nothing in particular. I have been listening to primarily vinyl for the past several months while building an album collection and learning everything that has changed since I was last into vinyl. So I will probably be giving more time to digital moving forward now that I think both sources are solidly where I want them to be .
    Hattor; T+A; Bel Canto; McIntosh; Rega; Technics; SimAudio; Magnepan; Rythmik; Astell & Kern; HeadAmp; Abyss

    "You are entitled to your opinions but you are not entitled to your own facts"

  15. #65
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    Quote Originally Posted by Randy Myers View Post
    Hehe, nothing in particular. I have been listening to primarily vinyl for the past several months while building an album collection and learning everything that has changed since I was last into vinyl. So I will probably be giving more time to digital moving forward now that I think both sources are solidly where I want them to be .
    Junkie Hattor Pre-amp Inbound


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  16. #66
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    Quote Originally Posted by aKnyght View Post
    great to hear you did not experience any SQ degradation when engaging the t+a volume circuit.

    i had a look at the rega phono MC specs -- and while the output voltage is not explicitly specified, it does say: ...designed to amplify the signal from a moving coil cartridge to a level which can feed into a 200mV line level input on a standard hi-fi amplifier. so, i suspect the rega puts out quite a bit less voltage than the t+a which for fixed output lists 2.5V for single-ended and 5.0V for balanced.

    no wonder you were hearing such a large difference in volume between your analog and digital sources.

    so, what's this new digital phase you are embarking upon? :-)
    With the Moon 310LP the XLR outputs can be set at 72 db gain. When by-passing the volume circuit on the T+A the levels between digital and vinyl are close. I think there is more variance from album to album now then between the two sources now. I like having it as pure as possible and the way T+A allows to set the signal to not even go through the volume circuit is nice.

    One other thing I noticed that surprised me, setting the Hattor to dual mono mode (and having to use both volume controls on the front of the unit) did actually improve the sound. Thank God that the remote allows for controlling both volume sections simultaneously!

    Attachment 28302Attachment 28301
    Hattor; T+A; Bel Canto; McIntosh; Rega; Technics; SimAudio; Magnepan; Rythmik; Astell & Kern; HeadAmp; Abyss

    "You are entitled to your opinions but you are not entitled to your own facts"

  17. #67
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    One of the strange things about this hobby is that far too many folks won't even consider a piece as competition against some of the very best without the enormous price tag to go with it. Case in point, slap a $20k price tag on the AMRG version of the Hattor line stage and many would be raving about it.

    While I have not owned a $20-$30k pre-amp, I have heard a few. I have owned more modest priced versions from ARC, McIntosh, a Stage 2, among others, all of which were 2-4 times the price of the Hattor. I can say, without reservation that the Hattor is in a different league. Since there is no buffering, and other things included with most other pre-amps it does not carry the insane pricing. Being made in Poland by a one man outfit with no advertising and very low overhead, etc., also does not add to the pricing.

    However it is built very very well, Arek does also offer an optional tube output stage which doubles the price of the unit. I would confidently put it against other line stages at 10x its price. I think it would hold its own very nicely.

    Hopefully that sums up how good I feel the Hattor truly is!
    Hattor; T+A; Bel Canto; McIntosh; Rega; Technics; SimAudio; Magnepan; Rythmik; Astell & Kern; HeadAmp; Abyss

    "You are entitled to your opinions but you are not entitled to your own facts"

  18. #68
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    I just order the matching Tube Active Stage for my Hattor passive pre-amp. It allows for passive mode or active/buffered mode adding either +6dB or +12dB gain using tubes. It is the perfect add on for the Hattor pre-amp and should take it to an even higher level.
    Hattor; T+A; Bel Canto; McIntosh; Rega; Technics; SimAudio; Magnepan; Rythmik; Astell & Kern; HeadAmp; Abyss

    "You are entitled to your opinions but you are not entitled to your own facts"

  19. #69
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    That sounds like what my Vac has. The buffered passive mode is nice at night or when you want a little volume without the slam.
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  20. #70
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    Hey Brian,

    That sounds cool. I am looking forward to it. I love my Hattor passive pre-amp and I think/hope that the tube active stage will take to an even higher level! Arek does an amazing job with his gear; builds them like tanks, exceptional performance but also reasonably priced. So when the unit arrives, the Hattor will actually become a three box pre-amp!
    Hattor; T+A; Bel Canto; McIntosh; Rega; Technics; SimAudio; Magnepan; Rythmik; Astell & Kern; HeadAmp; Abyss

    "You are entitled to your opinions but you are not entitled to your own facts"

  21. #71
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    hi, I also bought my passive Big Hattor Dual mono AMRG Trans with the active phase OPAMP (+ 3, + 6, + 9dB). Honestly - I only listen in passive mode, the active phase is not so clear sound.

  22. #72
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    I was wondering how you liked the OPAMP. I believe other components, such as speakers and amplifiers being used will be factors. I choose not to get the OPAMP because I determined that if I wanted to add the active stage I wanted to add the third box tube section. The Tube Active Stage is priced the same as the top AMRG Trans itself. I hope and believe it will be a nice option. We will see.

    I other pre-amps that I have had that offered passive, SS active and tube active I did prefer it with either the passive of tube active. Not so much the SS active. I believe this will add a little tube sweetness to the unit.
    Hattor; T+A; Bel Canto; McIntosh; Rega; Technics; SimAudio; Magnepan; Rythmik; Astell & Kern; HeadAmp; Abyss

    "You are entitled to your opinions but you are not entitled to your own facts"

  23. #73
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    Heard from Arek that the Tube Active Stage will be shipping the early part of next week. I am looking forward to adding this unit into the system.
    Hattor; T+A; Bel Canto; McIntosh; Rega; Technics; SimAudio; Magnepan; Rythmik; Astell & Kern; HeadAmp; Abyss

    "You are entitled to your opinions but you are not entitled to your own facts"

  24. #74
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    The new tube active stage arrived! It can be used either pure passive or tube active. The tube stage adds +9 dB gain but more importantly it adds some nice tube sweetness! More air, more open with added dynamics. Tube goodness! One of the best preamps I have heard, but much more involved now that it is a full three box preamplifier!
    Hattor; T+A; Bel Canto; McIntosh; Rega; Technics; SimAudio; Magnepan; Rythmik; Astell & Kern; HeadAmp; Abyss

    "You are entitled to your opinions but you are not entitled to your own facts"

  25. #75
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    Congrats Randy. Every Class D amp I have owned benefited from a tube stage in front of it.
    Main - JVC QL-Y7/Denon DL-301 Mk II, Gold Note PH-10, Nuprime CDT-8, Auralic Aries G1, Aqua La Voce S3, Supratek Chardonnay, PS Audio BHK 250, Verity Otello, (2) Rythmik F12SE, Audio Envy IC's & PC's, Triode Wire Lab SC, PC's & USB , PS Audio Stellar P3, Timbernation rack

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  26. #76
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    Thanks Jack. It definitely has some breakin in to go, but so far very impressive. A bigger difference than I was expecting and it should get even better. Arek sent the tube stage in a flight case as he had done with the pre 😊.

    Very nice improvement!
    Hattor; T+A; Bel Canto; McIntosh; Rega; Technics; SimAudio; Magnepan; Rythmik; Astell & Kern; HeadAmp; Abyss

    "You are entitled to your opinions but you are not entitled to your own facts"

  27. #77
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    The more I listen to this pre-amp setup the more I like it. It seems to really bring out the dynamics so much more! the RCA NOS tubes were a noticeable improvement and the NOS CBS are supposed to be here this week. Looking forward to listening to those! The Bel Canto amp sounds so much better than it did without the tube stage! The classic McIntosh amplifier sounds very good with it also.
    Hattor; T+A; Bel Canto; McIntosh; Rega; Technics; SimAudio; Magnepan; Rythmik; Astell & Kern; HeadAmp; Abyss

    "You are entitled to your opinions but you are not entitled to your own facts"

  28. #78
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    The 1957 CBS-Hytron tubes arrived. Amazing! The RCA clear tops sounded wonderful but these CBS take it to a whole new level!
    Hattor; T+A; Bel Canto; McIntosh; Rega; Technics; SimAudio; Magnepan; Rythmik; Astell & Kern; HeadAmp; Abyss

    "You are entitled to your opinions but you are not entitled to your own facts"

  29. #79
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    Re: Hattor Pre-amp Inbound

    Excellent Randy!
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