MSB - The Discrete DAC

**joeinid** · July 22, 2020, 05:07 PM

Oh my goodness.

Mike is letting me demo an MSB Discrete DAC. It was going on it's way back to him when he offered, so I jumped at the chance.

It has the dual Discrete power supplies, XLR outs, spdif and optical digital inputs along with the Renderer module.

I love my RME ADI-2 and Audio Mirror Tubador SE III dacs but this is absolutely amazing.

I've had a few of the recent past higher end dacs but this Discrete dac is absolutely wonderful.

Huge soundstage, very natural vocals, tremendous detail with ZERO harshness. Absolutely smooth and sweet, a bigger in my room presence that is undeniable. I'll need it to let it settle down for another day or so, but I am loving this dac like no other.

This thing just brought up the performance of my Avantgarde to a whole new level.

I don't know when I'll be able to afford one but I'm hooked.

White-Discrete-DAC-Front-900px-1.jpg

IMG_2980.jpg

2Up-Discrete-Power-Supply-Front-200px.jpg

**joeinid** · July 22, 2020, 05:52 PM

System Finished: MSB Technology Discrete DAC

**Alpinist** · July 23, 2020, 12:27 AM

Originally Posted by joeinid

Oh my goodness.

Mike is letting me demo an MSB Discrete DAC. It was going on it's way back to him when he offered, so I jumped at the chance.

It has the dual Discrete power supplies, XLR outs, spdif and optical digital inputs along with the Renderer module.

I love my RME ADI-2 and Audio Mirror Tubador SE III dacs but this is absolutely amazing.

I've had a few of the recent past higher end dacs but this Discrete dac is absolutely wonderful.

Huge soundstage, very natural vocals, tremendous detail with ZERO harshness. Absolutely smooth and sweet, a bigger in my room presence that is undeniable. I'll need it to let it settle down for another day or so, but I am loving this dac like no other.

This thing just brought up the performance of my Avantgarde to a whole new level.

I don't know when I'll be able to afford one but I'm hooked.

White-Discrete-DAC-Front-900px-1.jpg

IMG_2980.jpg

2Up-Discrete-Power-Supply-Front-200px.jpg

Hi Joe,

Congrats and welcome to the club! Membership has its privileges. Glorious lifelike sound!

Enjoy,
Ken

**joeinid** · July 23, 2020, 12:41 AM

Hi Ken,

I can only imagine what the Select II brings to the table. I admit that I was hesitant to try it because I honestly felt they are great DACs. Damn.

**UltraFast69** · July 23, 2020, 09:08 AM

Joe / now look what you got your self into, pun intended

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

**joeinid** · July 23, 2020, 10:08 AM

I know, I kept saying “no thank you” many other times. I guess curiosity got the best of me, sadly. I’ll need to experiment a little more and I know for sure that I can tweak my network for better sound right now. That will close the gap some more. Will it be enough to hold me for a while? I hope so.

Originally Posted by UltraFast69

Joe / now look what you got your self into, pun intended

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

**Ritmo** · July 23, 2020, 02:42 PM

So Joe, you made a huge mistake. Having been a victim of Mike’s offerings, you know the MSB is very likely to stay in your system. Resistance is futile...

**Oly** · July 23, 2020, 03:04 PM

Joe - time to sell a kidney

**veindoc** · July 23, 2020, 03:18 PM

Have it, love it(KISS) approach.

**Alpinist** · July 23, 2020, 03:44 PM

Originally Posted by Ritmo

So Joe, you made a huge mistake. Having been a victim of Mike’s offerings, you know the MSB is very likely to stay in your system. Resistance is futile...

Yup, Mike sent over some AudioQuest Dragon source power cords to give a listen, just to see if I liked them. That was six months ago and they’re still here.

Ken

**joeinid** · July 23, 2020, 04:44 PM

I did.

I've been trying different configurations and inputs and honestly think it the best dac I've heard/owned.

Originally Posted by Ritmo

So Joe, you made a huge mistake. Having been a victim of Mike’s offerings, you know the MSB is very likely to stay in your system. Resistance is futile...

**joeinid** · July 23, 2020, 04:45 PM

Originally Posted by Oly

Joe - time to sell a kidney

Ha!

That wouldn't be good.

**joeinid** · July 23, 2020, 04:46 PM

Originally Posted by veindoc

Have it, love it(KISS) approach.

I agree, it would provide better sound, more flexibility and a cleaner system.

**joeinid** · July 23, 2020, 04:47 PM

Originally Posted by Alpinist

Yup, Mike sent over some AudioQuest Dragon source power cords to give a listen, just to see if I liked them. That was six months ago and they’re still here.

Ken

Too bad he's like my drug dealer. Gives me a taste, then I'm hooked.

**Alpinist** · July 23, 2020, 05:49 PM

Originally Posted by joeinid

Too bad he's like my drug dealer. Gives me a taste, then I'm hooked.

Joe,

The Discrete is a terrific DAC. You should go for it. It will cure the desire for any further source upgrades.

Best,
Ken

**Mike** · July 23, 2020, 05:57 PM

The face Joe made when he realized I was right about the MSB DAC.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

**joeinid** · July 23, 2020, 06:15 PM

Originally Posted by Mike

The face Joe made when he realized I was right about the MSB DAC.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

EADFC282-9B61-4A55-A87A-13B9D13AFB13.jpeg

**KeithR** · July 23, 2020, 08:27 PM

welcome to the club! better late than never

someone suggested I sell my MSB to retain my Ampzillas and I laughed

**joeinid** · July 23, 2020, 08:58 PM

Good move that you still have the MSB.

I didn’t realize until now how many of you guys have MSB DACs. Nice!

**aKnyght** · July 23, 2020, 10:23 PM

Originally Posted by joeinid

...I've been trying different configurations and inputs and honestly think it the best dac I've heard/owned.

dang -- really, really wish you had not said that!! hmmmm, maybe mike will let me try it after you ...or is it staying put?

**joeinid** · July 23, 2020, 10:34 PM

I’ll be sending this one back and ordering new.

I’m really happy with it.

Originally Posted by aKnyght

dang -- really, really wish you had not said that!! hmmmm, maybe mike will let me try it after you ...or is it staying put?

**RDSChicago** · July 24, 2020, 12:28 AM

Jeff Fritz loves this DAC but loaded his up with options which doubled the price of the DAC. Mike, how would the DAC alone sound and what options if any do you believe are a must?

**BlueFox** · July 24, 2020, 12:34 AM

Originally Posted by RDSChicago

Jeff Fritz loves this DAC but loaded his up with options which doubled the price of the DAC.

Yes. That is basically what happened in the review Joe posted.

**Alpinist** · July 24, 2020, 12:45 AM

Originally Posted by joeinid

I’ll be sending this one back and ordering new.

I’m really happy with it.

That’s terrific news, congrats Joe! From your comments, I wasn’t sure if you would pull the trigger. I’ve never for one minute regretted purchasing my MSB DAC.

Enjoy,
Ken

**joeinid** · July 24, 2020, 01:02 AM

Hi Ken,

I wasn’t planning on spending nearly this much for a dac, at least not right now. But it’s easily worth it and so versatile as well. I’ll just need a little more time to save up. I just ordered some Wireworld cables and the bill is due at the end of the month. Mike has been spot on about them too. So much for being good, bills add up quickly all over, ugh.

I honestly thought I’d be able to demo the Discrete and send it back, done. Now as I live with it, I can’t unhear it so I have to get one.

**Billion$Baby** · July 24, 2020, 06:54 AM

Originally Posted by joeinid

Hi Ken,

I wasn’t planning on spending nearly this much for a dac, at least not right now. But it’s easily worth it and so versatile as well. I’ll just need a little more time to save up. I just ordered some Wireworld cables and the bill is due at the end of the month. Mike has been spot on about them too. So much for being good, bills add up quickly all over, ugh.

I honestly thought I’d be able to demo the Discrete and send it back, done. Now as I live with it, I can’t unhear it so I have to get one.

Stop spending my inheritance!!

**Mike Lavigne** · July 24, 2020, 07:31 AM

Originally Posted by Alpinist

That’s terrific news, congrats Joe! From your comments, I wasn’t sure if you would pull the trigger. I’ve never for one minute regretted purchasing my MSB DAC.

Enjoy,
Ken

i'll add my congrats to Joe.

to me the MSB approach of bit perfect allows for all digital formats to be at their best, higher rez performance optimized, and the modularity allows inevitable network streaming performance to evolve with changing interface technology. not only are you getting MSB quality, but a knowledge your investment is protected.

i own some great turntables and enjoy them, but even with such a commitment to analog i'm still 65% to 70% a digital listener and loving it. it's a great time to have a top dac.

enjoy!

**joeinid** · July 24, 2020, 09:21 AM

Originally Posted by Billion$Baby

Stop spending my inheritance!!

We are going to have to talk son,

**joeinid** · July 24, 2020, 09:22 AM

Thank you very much Mike.

Originally Posted by Mike Lavigne

i'll add my congrats to Joe.

to me the MSB approach of bit perfect allows for all digital formats to be at their best, higher rez performance optimized, and the modularity allows inevitable network streaming performance to evolve with changing interface technology. not only are you getting MSB quality, but a knowledge your investment is protected.

i own some great turntables and enjoy them, but even with such a commitment to analog i'm still 65% to 70% a digital listener and loving it. it's a great time to have a top dac.

enjoy!

**Billion$Baby** · July 24, 2020, 11:39 AM

How many days did you take off from work when this arrived???

**joeinid** · July 24, 2020, 11:53 AM

Originally Posted by Billion$Baby

How many days did you take off from work when this arrived???

Ha! Only one, cough cough. I wasn’t feeling well

All better now, thank goodness.

**veindoc** · July 24, 2020, 12:10 PM

GLWS- I mean congrats excellent choice. GLWS referred to what you lose to win this wonderful prize of supreme listening..

**joeinid** · July 24, 2020, 12:15 PM

Originally Posted by veindoc

GLWS- I mean congrats excellent choice. GLWS referred to what you lose to win this wonderful prize of supreme listening..

LoL, this might be a great time to clean out some gear/cables that I’m not using to fund this addiction.

**Alpinist** · July 24, 2020, 01:21 PM

Hi Joe,

This thread has really cheered me up. Thanks for starting it!

Ken

**joeinid** · July 24, 2020, 01:29 PM

I’m happy to read that. Glad I could help.

I remember you telling me how much you love your MSB, now I understand why.

Originally Posted by Alpinist

Hi Joe,

This thread has really cheered me up. Thanks for starting it!

Ken

**still-one** · July 24, 2020, 02:55 PM

Congratulations Joe!! MSB has been knocking it out of the park with the Select, Reference and Discrete DAC's. Have fun with the new unit.

**FDPDK** · July 24, 2020, 03:41 PM

Congratulations Joe with the new MSB Dac am sure it is sounding wonderfull , at least i can happily say its not even possible to get to hear it here in Denmark

although i would love to hear what it sounds like.

**rbbert** · July 25, 2020, 04:22 PM

Joe, what source(s) and input(s) are you using? Any ideas which upgrades you will be getting?

**joeinid** · July 25, 2020, 04:52 PM

Originally Posted by rbbert

Joe, what source(s) and input(s) are you using? Any ideas which upgrades you will be getting?

I use my modified Sonos Port into the coax spdif and my Roon Rock server into the network port. I’m considering adding the USB port for hooking up a computer.

I’m going to try and hook up the Discrete directly to my amp and hear how it sounds that way.

**aKnyght** · July 27, 2020, 10:15 AM

joe -- i see in another thread you are selling your lumin u1 mini. not sure of your upstream digital infrastructure but just thought i would mention the MSB pro ISL module + pro USB converter as an alternative to the network renderer module.

from reading info on the MSB website, a USB feed from a streamer/server/computer/etc is converted to an MSB pro ISL signal. what is unique to MSB is that the USB conversion process employs error detection and correction. all other USB based inputs i am aware of do not utilize error correction. the MSB pro ISL is a light signal and, thereby, completely eliminates all upstream electrical noise. hence, the DAC is delivered a bit-perfect data stream free of any electrical noise that can modulate the D > A conversion.

the MSB process here makes a USB signal functionally equivalent to fiber ethernet ... not sure why MSB does not offer a straight fiber ethernet input module (as does the lumin x1) but i suppose they have their reasons.

the network renderer and the pro ISL cost exactly the same amount. more info here and here

anyway, just though it was worth mentioning.

**Alpinist** · July 27, 2020, 10:31 AM

Originally Posted by aKnyght

joe -- i see in another thread you are selling your lumin u1 mini. not sure of your upstream digital infrastructure but just thought i would mention the MSB pro ISL module + pro USB converter as an alternative to the network renderer module.

from reading info on the MSB website, a USB feed from a streamer/server/computer/etc is converted to an MSB pro ISL signal. what is unique to MSB is that the USB conversion process employs error detection and correction. all other USB based inputs i am aware of do not utilize error correction. the MSB pro ISL is a light signal and, thereby, completely eliminates all upstream electrical noise. hence, the DAC is delivered a bit-perfect data stream free of any electrical noise that can modulate the D > A conversion.

the MSB process here makes a USB signal functionally equivalent to fiber ethernet ... not sure why MSB does not offer a straight fiber ethernet input module (as does the lumin x1) but i suppose they have their reasons.

the network renderer and the pro ISL cost exactly the same amount. more info here and here

anyway, just though it was worth mentioning.

The reasons MSB’s Pro ISL Module is designed this way is for electromagnetic isolation and the ability to run an optical cable longer distances. The negative with the Pro USB Module compared to the Renderer V2 is that you cannot control the DAC’s analog volume adjustment through Roon via the IPad. You have to use the MSB remote.

Ken

**joeinid** · July 27, 2020, 10:48 AM

Than you so much for the recommendation. I was thinking about that option too.

Before I pull the trigger, I want to find out if I can get both XLR and RCA modules so that depending on amp(s) I can have the appropriate output without the need for adapters.

I was actually thinking about getting both the USB/ISL modules so I’ll be ready for anything. I know only one rca/xlr module at a time but I think both Network and ISL modules can fit in at the same time.

Originally Posted by aKnyght

joe -- i see in another thread you are selling your lumin u1 mini. not sure of your upstream digital infrastructure but just thought i would mention the MSB pro ISL module + pro USB converter as an alternative to the network renderer module.

from reading info on the MSB website, a USB feed from a streamer/server/computer/etc is converted to an MSB pro ISL signal. what is unique to MSB is that the USB conversion process employs error detection and correction. all other USB based inputs i am aware of do not utilize error correction. the MSB pro ISL is a light signal and, thereby, completely eliminates all upstream electrical noise. hence, the DAC is delivered a bit-perfect data stream free of any electrical noise that can modulate the D > A conversion.

the MSB process here makes a USB signal functionally equivalent to fiber ethernet ... not sure why MSB does not offer a straight fiber ethernet input module (as does the lumin x1) but i suppose they have their reasons.

the network renderer and the pro ISL cost exactly the same amount. more info here and here

anyway, just though it was worth mentioning.

**aKnyght** · July 27, 2020, 11:01 AM

Originally Posted by joeinid

Than you so much for the recommendation. I was thinking about that option too.

Before I pull the trigger, I want to find out if I can get both XLR and RCA modules so that depending on amp(s) I can have the appropriate output without the need for adapters.

I was actually thinking about getting both the USB/ISL modules so I’ll be ready for anything. I know only one rca/xlr module at a time but I think both Network and ISL modules can fit in at the same time.

seems we are doing research along the same lines... i have been thinking hard on maybe going all-in on digital rather than maybe adding an analog source -- in that scenario MSB is certainly very high on the list, so i have been doing a similar investigation of all their input / output modules.

**joeinid** · July 27, 2020, 11:31 AM

Please keep the information coming. I think it’s time for me to jump back into the dac pool again. Some of the streaming music I enjoy almost needs a computer so that’s where the usb/isl comes in. I was also told that Audivana (?) and a computer is one of the best/better combinations.

**aKnyght** · July 27, 2020, 11:57 AM

Originally Posted by joeinid

Please keep the information coming. I think it’s time for me to jump back into the dac pool again. Some of the streaming music I enjoy almost needs a computer so that’s where the usb/isl comes in. I was also told that Audivana (?) and a computer is one of the best/better combinations.

have not tried audirvana in several years but i remember liking roon much better at the time. it was much more developed / built-out -- both have free trials so you can decide what's best for your use case and preferences.

in terms of hardware upstream from my DAC, i went with this solution. combine this with the MSB proISL and i don't think it is possible to get a cleaner signal to the DAC ...or a more cost effective way.

**KeithR** · July 27, 2020, 01:41 PM

Originally Posted by joeinid

Than you so much for the recommendation. I was thinking about that option too.

Before I pull the trigger, I want to find out if I can get both XLR and RCA modules so that depending on amp(s) I can have the appropriate output without the need for adapters.

I was actually thinking about getting both the USB/ISL modules so I’ll be ready for anything. I know only one rca/xlr module at a time but I think both Network and ISL modules can fit in at the same time.

just get an Innuos and use ethernet the entire way with the renderer. easy peasy. MSB is fully balanced at least on the Premier on up so I'd get XLR output and use adapters as needed (then you get full potential of the dac if you have a balanced preamp)

i've demo'd all the iterations of MSB and the "extras" - here is my continuum of improvements

1) dual mono p/s
2) clock
3) powerbase

the "value point" is just getting the first

good luck!

**GSOphile** · July 27, 2020, 03:16 PM

Is the Discrete also a fully balanced component or no?

**CPP** · July 27, 2020, 03:18 PM

Just awesome Joe. Ya know once Mike gets ya, he turns into 'The Pusher', and keeps feeding ya those little bites of audio . that reminds me I need to play Steppenwolf 'The Pusher'

**joeinid** · July 27, 2020, 04:25 PM

Ha!

We’ve been talking about it for a long time. Once my demo dac was on its way, I realized I was in trouble. After a few days of letting it settling in, then going back to my DACs, I pretty much knew I was done.

**CPP** · July 27, 2020, 05:41 PM

Originally Posted by joeinid

Ha!

We’ve been talking about it for a long time. Once my demo dac was on its way, I realized I was in trouble. After a few days of letting it settling in, then going back to my DACs, I pretty much knew I was done.

You will be selling that RME before long once the MSB has taken over the SS side of the DACS.

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