Two new Lumin Network Music Players released today

**Mike** · June 12, 2014, 11:20 AM

Originally Posted by nfnc

The local dealer said as much. Some prospective customers were not prepared to consider the A1 because it was too "cheap", regardless of its sound quality. In their minds, without a 5 figure price tag, it is not good enough.

I heard the same thing over and over again. Yet, when friends brought their DAC's over (including the DAC2X), they all went away admitting the Lumin was a superior overall performer. It isn't perfect by any means, but it has beat out all comers - so far.

I think we are starting to see more companies go away from DAC & Mac and towards network music players. If memory serves me correct, I believe the new CH Precision is a streamer/network music player, but does also offer some more traditional DAC features. But the point is, there is a trend. I've also been in contact with a certain manufacturer who told me a network music player is next up for them.

IMO - network music players are just superior. Initial setup takes a little patience - but I will put the Lumin A1 up against any computer/software + DAC costing a total of $7200 - all day long.

**NorthStar** · June 12, 2014, 04:21 PM

Originally Posted by nfnc

The local dealer said as much. Some prospective customers were not prepared to consider the A1 because it was too "cheap", regardless of its sound quality. In their minds, without a 5 figure price tag, it is not good enough.

I just don't get it, I don't get that kind of people's mentality.

There are some great digital DAC/Music servers from $1,000 to $5,000 and maybe someone is missing a very pleasant sailing boat ride somewhere.
Yes, features that we like, build & part quality, and particularly sound that we love. ...Easy access, operation, quick music finding, and even suggestions made according to the type of music we like to listen to.

Me, I want a Music/Discovery server. One that is not afraid of exploring the world music scene and in high-res (DSD X and 352kHz/32-bit). ...DAC integrated, of course (so you can use it with any other playback source). ...Freedom and Discovery.

Just my own two cents, without first-hand listening experience on all the digital music servers of the world, and irregardless of price. Price shouldn't be part of the equation but reality takes care of that all by itself. Man has no control but on his own disposable income, and that at the end means no more than what it truly is; the financial mechanism of audio delight in the business world we live in. ...And all that fun jazz.

**CharlesL** · June 14, 2014, 10:52 AM

Originally Posted by Mike

I heard the same thing over and over again. Yet, when friends brought their DAC's over (including the DAC2X), they all went away admitting the Lumin was a superior overall performer. It isn't perfect by any means, but it has beat out all comers - so far.

I think we are starting to see more companies go away from DAC & Mac and towards network music players. If memory serves me correct, I believe the new CH Precision is a streamer/network music player, but does also offer some more traditional DAC features. But the point is, there is a trend. I've also been in contact with a certain manufacturer who told me a network music player is next up for them.

IMO - network music players are just superior. Initial setup takes a little patience - but I will put the Lumin A1 up against any computer/software + DAC costing a total of $7200 - all day long.

Interesting "compatible" observation by Alan Taffel: Comparing SACD to a DSD Download: A Follow-Up Report | The Absolute Sound

**Mike** · June 14, 2014, 11:27 AM

Interesting Charles and no surprise. I ran my own tests. I don't care what PC you use (Mac or Windows or some CAPS or E, A, B or Z machine) or what USB cable you use (free one that comes with your printer or a $1000 one from Company X) - the weak link is the computer and the USB cable. DAC's and Mac's are inferior to network music players. Not many battled the digital demons like I did (over 20 DACS, dozens of USB CABLES, Mac, Windows, CAPS, whatever) - they all left me disliking my digital.

Now no more....

This article is no surprise to me.

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**Elescher** · June 14, 2014, 01:09 PM

I am curious......in an implementation like the Lumin what type of connection is made from the chip that processes your music files to the internal DAC. I am thinking it would have to be some variation of a USB cable, no? Or maybe I am missing the whole picture!

**Mike** · June 14, 2014, 01:53 PM

Originally Posted by Elescher

I am curious......in an implementation like the Lumin what type of connection is made from the chip that processes your music files to the internal DAC. I am thinking it would have to be some variation of a USB cable, no? Or maybe I am missing the whole picture!

It's all on the same board and he's certainly not using a cable which was designed for printers and other peripherals!

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**soundqcar** · June 20, 2014, 09:47 AM

First review of the S1...

6moons audio reviews: Lumïn S1

EDIT: I apologize. I should have read the "review" first.

I guess there is more to come....not an official review.

**nicoludio** · June 20, 2014, 10:07 AM

Just a teaser...

Good comments about Kenneth Lau's PSU for Lumin though.

**Geoffrey** · June 20, 2014, 01:07 PM

Originally Posted by nfnc

Just a teaser...

Good comments about Kenneth Lau's PSU for Lumin though.

I didn't get that from 6 Moons partial review. What I drew from partial review is acknowledgement that DIY power supplies have been available for Lumin A1 and Lumin provide a more sophisticated power supply for their S1. Reviewer left any improvements wrought by S1 and/or DIY power supplies for we-shall-see review follow up.

**nicoludio** · June 20, 2014, 02:45 PM

Different take, I guess. Quote from preview:

"Certain DIYers in Hong Kong had demonstrated significant audible improvements by attacking Lumïn's power supply. I was able to test and then acquire two upgrades over the stock A1 power supply from a true fanatic called Kenneth Lau who also builds external power supplies for other digital gear. Paying attention to these efforts, Lumïn have now endowed the S1 with a far more sophisticated power supply design which should boost the deck’s overall performance."

So, certain DIY PSUs demonstrate significant audible improvements over stock A1 PSU. Joel tested and must have liked the improvements enough to buy 2 versions of KL's PSU. Compared to the A1 PSU, the S1 PSU has been upgraded. How the S1 PSU compares to the KL PSU has been left unsaid, pending further reveals of the review. He has privately mentioned to me his initial impressions, and it would be interesting to see what his final findings will be (if he does make the comparison) once the full review is published.

Then again, all this discussion may be moot depending on Lumin's policy on what upgrades, if any, will be made available to existing A1 users.

**Mike** · June 20, 2014, 03:10 PM

Definitely not a review. My S1 review sample should be here next week. I'll let it burn in for a bit and then the fun begins.

It's nice to see the Lumin doing so well. It's a wonderful product that as the article said, produces more hours of listening enjoyment.

The SABRE chipset and new PS in the S1 will be interesting to evaluate.

For those considering a Lumin, IMHO, on paper, the T1 is a terrific value. It's the same as the A1, except it is housed in a metal box instead of a much more expensive aluminum one.

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**Geoffrey** · June 21, 2014, 01:27 PM

Originally Posted by nfnc

How the S1 PSU compares to the KL PSU has been left unsaid, pending further reveals of the review. He has privately mentioned to me his initial impressions, and it would be interesting to see what his final findings will be (if he does make the comparison) once the full review is published.

Then again, all this discussion may be moot depending on Lumin's policy on what upgrades, if any, will be made available to existing A1 users.

Good points. I usually wonder about warranties if buyer ventures outside OEM parts/ancillaries for a product. Be good to know Lumin policy on non-Lumin power supplies with their network players. Will look toward upcoming part II of 6 Moons review and any insights that may be found therein. In audio I've learned more expensive/better does not necessarily equate to improved SQ and no amount of marketing or enthusiastic reviews can change this.

**wklie** · July 30, 2014, 12:13 AM

Originally Posted by CPP

Hum 1TB, I wonder if you can upgrade that hard drive ? To say 2 or 4 TB. Any way this is looking very interesting.

2TB model of L1 should be available, and is supported by the L1 firmware. For anyone who wants to upgrade from 1TB to something larger, it should be noted that the current L1 1TB model is physically designed to hold a 9.5mm height 2.5" SATA HDD (for now, could change in the future). To fit a 12-15mm height HDD, brass spacers of a different length may be required.

**joeinid** · July 30, 2014, 01:46 AM

Welcome to the forum wklie.

Thank you for joining!

**wklie** · July 30, 2014, 03:52 AM

Originally Posted by volks

Anyone know how much the D1 is or will be?

Consider getting a T1 instead of waiting for D1. LUMIN Music Facebook statement on July 14: "We don't have a definite release date for LUMIN D1, so we felt it is best to wait until every detail is finalised before promoting it."

https://www.facebook.com/luminmusic

**Mike** · July 30, 2014, 07:43 AM

Originally Posted by wklie

Consider getting a T1 instead of waiting for D1. LUMIN Music Facebook statement on July 14: "We don't have a definite release date for LUMIN D1, so we felt it is best to wait until every detail is finalised before promoting it."

https://www.facebook.com/luminmusic

Makes sense. The T1 is essentially the A1 in a normal metal (instead of aluminum) case.

**CPP** · July 30, 2014, 08:56 AM

Originally Posted by wklie

2TB model of L1 should be available, and is supported by the L1 firmware. For anyone who wants to upgrade from 1TB to something larger, it should be noted that the current L1 1TB model is physically designed to hold a 9.5mm height 2.5" SATA HDD (for now, could change in the future). To fit a 12-15mm height HDD, brass spacers of a different length may be required.

Thank you for the information. Will the Samsung 2TB Spinpoint MT9 ; 9.5mm x 69.85mm width x 100.35 mm Length fit ?

**Mike** · July 30, 2014, 09:02 AM

Originally Posted by CPP

Thank you for the information. Will the Samsung 2TB Spinpoint MT9 ; 9.5mm x 69.85mm width x 100.35 mm Length fit ?

I was discussing this very thing with someone yesterday. If it's a 2.5" drive, it should fit....but you won't really know until you try it.

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**CPP** · July 30, 2014, 09:53 AM

Originally Posted by Mike

I was discussing this very thing with someone yesterday. If it's a 2.5" drive, it should fit....but you won't really know until you try it.

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Wow great minds at work

**Audioseduction** · July 30, 2014, 12:52 PM

Why would one want a noisy mechanical hard drive in their player. Will effect the SQ in a negative way.

**Mike** · July 30, 2014, 01:05 PM

Originally Posted by Audioseduction

Why would one want a noisy mechanical hard drive in their player. Will effect the SQ in a negative way.

George - it's external....like a NAS drive.

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**wklie** · July 30, 2014, 01:23 PM

Originally Posted by Audioseduction

Why would one want a noisy mechanical hard drive in their player. Will effect the SQ in a negative way.

The L1 is a music server that contains a HDD (somewhat similar to NAS). The S1 / A1 / T1 are music players that do not contain HDD inside (although one may attach a USB HDD if a standalone music server is not used).

**wklie** · July 30, 2014, 01:25 PM

Originally Posted by CPP

Thank you for the information. Will the Samsung 2TB Spinpoint MT9 ; 9.5mm x 69.85mm width x 100.35 mm Length fit ?

I believe a 9.5mm drive should fit. However, to simplify things, one may simply order a 2TB version of L1.

**Audioseduction** · July 30, 2014, 01:26 PM

I see. If I had to choose it would either be S1, A1 or T1 but not the L1.

**Mike** · July 30, 2014, 01:29 PM

George - the L1 is just a "drive in a box" for people who don't want to set up a NAS. Think of it as an external drive designed just for "plug & play" with the Lumin S1, A1 or T1.

http://www.luminmusic.com/lumin-l1.html

**Audioseduction** · July 30, 2014, 02:04 PM

"very LUMIN Music Player requires a server to store your music collection on. Previously, that meant using a computer or a NAS (Network Attached Storage), but now there is another option.

LUMIN L1 was developed to be the simplest way to store music for LUMIN. It is compatible with UPnP standards and requires zero configuration. Simply plug it in to your computer, drag and drop your music, and then connect it to your network.
"

How cool is that! Nice turnkey storage solution with plug&play simplicity.

**the professor** · July 30, 2014, 02:37 PM

If it truly as simple as this, it will make computer audio a possibility to people like my dad. This will be great.

Originally Posted by Audioseduction

"very LUMIN Music Player requires a server to store your music collection on. Previously, that meant using a computer or a NAS (Network Attached Storage), but now there is another option.

LUMIN L1 was developed to be the simplest way to store music for LUMIN. It is compatible with UPnP standards and requires zero configuration. Simply plug it in to your computer, drag and drop your music, and then connect it to your network.
"

How cool is that! Nice turnkey storage solution with plug&play simplicity.

**CPP** · July 30, 2014, 03:09 PM

Originally Posted by Audioseduction

Why would one want a noisy mechanical hard drive in their player. Will effect the SQ in a negative way.

Never hooked a scope up to measure the noise from a hard drive, my ears still hear the music

**Audioseduction** · July 30, 2014, 03:25 PM

Originally Posted by CPP

Never hooked a scope up to measure the noise from a hard drive, my ears still hear the music

You can't hear Electrical noise but it does have a negative impact on electronics. Your will hear better music without a mechanical hard drive. Also the EMF from the HD will effect it.

**j3brow** · July 31, 2014, 11:03 AM

I understand that concept. However, in reality, there is no real consequence of a properly designed internal hard drive in a player. Case in point, Aurender. I own the X100L. I have 6TB of internal storage. Two 3TB drives. I have it resting on symposium 2+ rollerblocks on Quadraspire SVT Bamboo rack. Connected to McIntosh MCD1100 DAC via WW Platinum USB cable. The ease of install/use, aesthetics, and app are wonderful. The sound is sublime. Beat my optimized MacMini (SSD), JRiver, WW USB, Berkeley BADA, and Transparent Reference AES set up. FWIW, Chris Connacker reviewed both Lumin (first) and Aurender W20. He declared the Aurender the best server he has heard. It also has 2 large internal hard drives. Clearly, world class sound can be achieved with internal hard drive storage especially when solid state drive is utilized for playback.

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**Audioseduction** · July 31, 2014, 11:02 PM

I guess if you implement all of the compensations for the additional RF noise, vibration and heat generated by the drives while accessing the data that would be acceptable. I see Aurender uses large heat sinks for a passive cooling and the heat sink also acts as a RF noise screen. The hard drives are mounted to a special support frame with rubber pads, which mechanically decouples the two. Also the unit copies the playlist "music files" from the HD to the SSD and then turns off the HDs and plays the files from the SSD.

I feel why do all that just to have local storage when you can have your file storage on a remote device and not have the vibration & RF issues in the first place.

I have JRiver set as a memory player which means it streams the files form a remote storage device, processes the music file entirely and place the processed data in a 1GB buffer before it starts playing the track. This way there is no issue with latency, vibration, RF or heat generated from mechanical HDs. I can say the playback is sublime x2.

I think if you have used a Windows OS platform for your music server you would had a better outcome.

**Geoffrey** · August 5, 2014, 02:17 PM

I have room and noise compromises in my "senior years" listening space, yet top of my wish list is Lumin S1 power supply for my Lumin A1. Have pile of audio spending money burning hole in pocket yet Lumin wants none of it! (v:

**Mike** · August 5, 2014, 02:33 PM

Originally Posted by Geoffrey

I have room and noise compromises in my "senior years" listening space, yet top of my wish list is Lumin S1 power supply for my Lumin A1. Have pile of audio spending money burning hole in pocket yet Lumin wants none of it! (v:

Geoffrey - the S1 PS on the A1 isn't a big difference. I'm happy to send you my Kenneth Lau PS for the A1 to try. Now THAT PS is a difference, Now that I'm using the S1, I don't need it.

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**Julot** · August 5, 2014, 03:59 PM

Originally Posted by Audioseduction

Why would one want a noisy mechanical hard drive in their player. Will effect the SQ in a negative way.

It's not been my experience and I suspect things are not that simple. On my Antipodes server, the drive is included, and playing from it is superior to playing via ethernet with any NAS or shared disk that I've been able to try. And the drive is not even shielded or mechanically isolated. I've had HDD and SSD drives, and while the latter is better, internal HDD sounded better than SSD from a NAS or a Mac. Conversely, using the Antipodes server as a NAS for a Linn streamer (a very expensive option) was not as good as the server by itself (using the same DAC for both from the digital output of the Linn) but was the best result I could get with the Linn.

Yes Mike, I still haven't been able to listen to a Lumin here -- except during the Munich show, and it wasn't very good, but this is not a proper way to listen to music or quality gear.

I'm also wondering if there's not something intrinsically problematic with using an Ethernet network for real time music. Again with my Antipodes servers, streaming (even from QoBuz) never comes near playback from the internal drive.

**wklie** · August 19, 2014, 11:40 PM

Originally Posted by soundqcar

First review of the S1...

6moons audio reviews: Lumïn S1

Updated.

**Mike** · August 19, 2014, 11:51 PM

Great review! Coincides with my own findings. The Lumin S1 is a outstanding world class digital source.

**MDP** · August 20, 2014, 10:50 AM

Well................crap !

**MacFly** · August 20, 2014, 04:23 PM

Originally Posted by MDP

Well................crap !

Whats wrong Mark you have the top of the line Lumin right ?

Thread: Two new Lumin Network Music Players released today

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