Thread: What do you hear different using Balanced XLR Cables?

I have never had gear that utilized Balanced XLR connections until now. My Luxman has one input and the Rotel 1572 has both RCA and Balanced XLR outputs.

Is there a big difference or is it a preference?

For me the quality of the cables makes a larger difference than Balanced vs Unbalanced. That being said, all of my cables are balanced and so is my gear to take advantage of them. I do prefer the clicking connectors with balanced, too.

noise rejection is one of it attributes for sure, I run them on my IC's from my linestage to my amps(12' run). But if the topology of your components being connected are not balanced and your cable runs are short I don't know that there is any real benefit.

I am not sure you will be able to tell the difference between a one meter balanced or a unbalanced cable from the same category from a manufacture.

What needs to be clear here is whether or not the OP actually has balanced gear or if he just has a pair of XLR inputs/outputs on his gear for convenience. If the circuits aren't truly balanced, there is nothing to gain by using the XLR inputs/outputs.

Originally Posted by mep

What needs to be clear here is whether or not the OP actually has balanced gear or if he just has a pair of XLR inputs/outputs on his gear for convenience. If the circuits aren't truly balanced, there is nothing to gain by using the XLR inputs/outputs.

I just looked up the specs of both the Rotel and my Luxman and both say Balanced XLR. I don't think I will drop a bunch of cash to find out so maybe I can find someone to loan me a pair for a test first.

Well in my Bryston BHA-1 Headamp, using L/R Bal or a stereo XLR instead of the normal jack, I get more wattage to my hard to drive phones. Just the way it was designed per Mike at Bryston.

"The big advantage of using the balanced outputs on the BHA1 is the doubling in output voltage, because you have two class A amplifiers driving the output rather than one. This doubling in voltage actually results in a 4 times increase in power, since power is proportional to voltage squared."

The first time I used XLR, was to see if there was any difference I could hear.

I replaced a pair of 1.8M Shunyata Altair RCA with Altair XLR between my then Krell SACD player and my ARC LS25 line stage. The only thing I noticed was that the volume was louder at the same setting on the LS25.
I have amps that only use XLR and have continued to use XLR for all connections in my system.

Originally Posted by Shadowfax

I just looked up the specs of both the Rotel and my Luxman and both say Balanced XLR. I don't think I will drop a bunch of cash to find out so maybe I can find someone to loan me a pair for a test first.

The specs might say you have a pair of balanced XLR connectors, but neither of your pieces of gear have truly balanced circuits.

Hi-fi manufacturers that do not use differentially balanced circuits typically might offer a XLR input/output for convenience but I doubt any audible difference could be heard between the two as the only difference is the connecter.

So are we saying that both the Lux and the Rotel have Balanced connections but not Balanced circuits?

I guess both MFGs just added them in case tho opposites component only has XLR connections.

Originally Posted by Shadowfax

So are we saying that both the Lux and the Rotel have Balanced connections but not Balanced circuits?

I guess both MFGs just added them in case tho opposites component only has XLR connections.

yes and for the noise rejection ability if and when longer IC runs are needed

Originally Posted by mep

What needs to be clear here is whether or not the OP actually has balanced gear or if he just has a pair of XLR inputs/outputs on his gear for convenience. If the circuits aren't truly balanced, there is nothing to gain by using the XLR inputs/outputs.

This is incorrect. Several posts in this thread conflate balanced inputs and outputs with balanced internal amplifier circuitry.

Balanced inputs and outputs, when designed properly to AES48, have advantages over single ended interconnects even if the underlying amplifier circuitry is not balanced.

Balanced I/O doesn’t use the cable shield as an audio return. This prevents ground current induced hum between different pieces of gear. By being balanced, interference impinging on the cable will be cancelled out by the balanced input circuitry of the receiving piece of gear. Most XLR connectors offer a locking mechanism not present in RCA connectors.

Balanced internal amplification circuitry has additional advantages in that certain types of distortion are cancelled out.

To make things more interesting;
You could have an amplifier with single ended inputs and balanced internal circuitry.
You can also have a situation where a truly balanced amplifier has poor common mode rejection, making it no better than a single ended amplifier in this regard.

As to which works or sounds better, it’s more how these circuits are implemented by the manufacturers than the actual configuration of the gear and weather you use a single ended or XLR connection.

LOL, glad I asked. I am now more confused than when I posted the question. Almost sounds like it is personal opinion and or preference more than anything. I won't sweat it, I will just keep using my old Synergistic Research Kaleidoscope ICs that I have been using for years. Thanks for all the input!

Originally Posted by nicoff

In other words, XLR cables are better.

sometimes ...........

If all my gear wasn't balanced, I wouldn't be using balanced cables. Pinning your hopes on an unbalanced piece of gear that happens to sport a balanced input or output connector being wired to AES48 standards and providing you with any sonic benefit when using a balanced cable is a crap shoot at best.

Originally Posted by stereogeek

My system sounded better when I used single ended between my Ayon player and Cary SLP-05 preamp. When I re-read the Stereophile test on the preamp it showed better performance using single ended, go figure.

I own an SLP-05 as well and initially found the same thing. Single ended inputs and outputs were preferred. That was, until I had the "Ultimate Upgrade" completed by Cary. Since then I have compared single ended to balanced (both inputs and outputs) and have completely switched my thinking. Maybe it is system synergy as I have changed a few components, but balanced is now clearly superior.

Originally Posted by nicoff

Are you saying that if you use well-built balanced (XLR) cable you don’t need to spend a lot of money on interconnect cables?

why 'do you need' to spend a lot on IC's to begin with ? Granted it depends on ones definition of 'a lot' !

I got a chance to try a pair of Balanced cables. I have no idea the make or quality. A friend who does recording work and video depositions loaned me a 8 foot pair to try.

I did not spend any time A-B'ing them yet but initial impressions are more bass and a bigger overall sound. I will play around as I have time but at least I finally got to try a pair to see for myself.

Brian, be sure to level match any comparison between single ended and XLR, otherwise a complete waste of time !

Originally Posted by Mikado463

Brian, be sure to level match any comparison between single ended and XLR, otherwise a complete waste of time !

I think I have my answer. Yes more gain and louder overall. But what I have noticed is more detail, mostly top end but hearing it everywhere.

I added a pair of Nordost White Lightening Balanced XLRs. Still need more time to adjust, big change.

Originally Posted by Shadowfax

I have never had gear that utilized Balanced XLR connections until now. My Luxman has one input and the Rotel 1572 has both RCA and Balanced XLR outputs.

Is there a big difference or is it a preference?

IMO, the biggest difference (I only use 1M pairs) is that the single-ended output is around 2v while the balanced output is around 4v. That translates to higher volumes including slightly more impacting dynamics, etc at the speaker. However, there are some who think the more a signal is amplified the more any associated distortions are also amplified. I'd guess there's probably at least some truth to that.

BTW, I use balanced.

I have now had a month with a pair of Nordost White Lightening XLRs. Out of the box they were really bright and harsh despite being "Burned In" with the Nordost Vidar. Lots of speculation on various sites when it comes to Cable Burn In and I would have expected the brightness and harshness to have been eliminated if already Burned In before regular use.

Anyway, at first I noticed the increase in volume, extra detail in the upper end, and what appeared to be a loss in bass. But like I previously said, they sounded bad at first. Now, a month later, either I got used to the original sound, or they have mellowed and settled in a bit. I do not find the sound to be harsh anymore and the extra detail has remained. Bass seems to have come back but it is very critical of each different recording. Some disks sound like the bass is suppressed while other disks have plenty of good bass.

Something else I noticed is all the controversy over RCA cables being Directional, while XLR cables appear to be made Directional since the Source and Target use a different connector which eliminates the debate. Is that all the time?