Thread: Gryphon Audio. Probably the best gear in town?

Sometimes in this insane hobby , you come across things that make you wonder how much more zany things can get . I was seriously interested in purchasing a Gryphon system. Discussions with Flemming Rasmussen yielded the following Twilight Zone/Catch-22 moments of hilarity.

"No, we have no US distributor. However we have US Service facilities"

" No, we will not factory-direct sell a product for the North American market"

" No, we will not permit European dealers to order 110V product intended for the NA market"

" You may purchase a new or used 220V product in Europe , then ship it to us for 110V conversion at the factory but we will not ship it to NA, only back to the original dealer in Europe"

Hard to think of an unfriendlier , commercially-oblivious and downright bizarre organization than Mephisto even by the low standards of this industry. Love their stuff but even love has its limits, life is too short for this kind of self-inflicted nonsense.

Gryphon's website has the following information posted -

"Country
USA

Distributor
USA DISTRIBUTOR INVITED

Gryphon is seeking a well established, experienced distributor only.

Please contact: sales@gryphon-audio.dk
Service of Gryphon products is available in USA. Please contact: service@gryphon-audio.dk for support.
Gryphon Audio Designs do not sell factory direct."

I personally admire Flemming Rasmussen & his amps, though I think they are being overly restrictive in this case by not offering to atleast refer you to the next nearest convenient Distributor/Dealer to sell you a factory-set 110v product when it's not a territorial issue. I don't know if Flemming reads audio forums, but this isn't good feedback for them.

They've had that notice on their website for at least 4 years , so presumably no-one meets their exacting standards . Artistic license and attitude are one thing but emails that border on the rude / arrogant and an unreasonable attitude are something else altogether. What they're implying in a contorted way is that someone determined (crazy) enough to wade into this morass should buy a new or used Gryphon product from Europe or Asia, then arrange to ship it to Gryphon for voltage conversion , then back to the Seller for onward shipment to NA. Let's hope that the Asian buyers who've enabled this ridiculous attitude keep buying.....

There appear however to be chinks in this armour. A Seller on Audiogon has been (desperately) trying to offload a pair of 110V Mephisto amps which belonged to Andy Payor at Rockport. So presumably , depending on the capriciousness of Mr. Rasmussen , 110v NA-spec units can sneak into the US depending upon the moon-phase .....

Originally Posted by Bobolaclune

Sometimes in this insane hobby , you come across things that make you wonder how much more zany things can get . I was seriously interested in purchasing a Gryphon system. Discussions with Flemming Rasmussen yielded the following Twilight Zone/Catch-22 moments of hilarity.

"No, we have no US distributor. However we have US Service facilities"

" No, we will not factory-direct sell a product for the North American market"

" No, we will not permit European dealers to order 110V product intended for the NA market"

" You may purchase a new or used 220V product in Europe , then ship it to us for 110V conversion at the factory but we will not ship it to NA, only back to the original dealer in Europe"

Hard to think of an unfriendlier , commercially-oblivious and downright bizarre organization than Mephisto even by the low standards of this industry. Love their stuff but even love has its limits, life is too short for this kind of self-inflicted nonsense.

I'm sorry , I really dont see the issue , you purchase from one of their Euro dealers , the dealer then sends the amplfier back to Gryphon , who converts it to 110v then ships it back to the dealer who in turn ships it to you ...

Sounds fairly straight forward and reasonable to me , Gryphon dont want their dealers doing the conversion and it also means they cant sell directly to the US without the factory knowing about it...

BTW its better to run the amp and your system in general at 240v, i wouldnt convert the amp, convert your wall outlets instead ...,

I guess I'm being fussy insisting on local Dealer support , avoiding a circuitous shipment system ( Gryphon to Dealer to Gryphon to Dealer) with attendant costs (any idea what their gear in wooden crates weighs?) not to mention incremental costs ( you pay for two power supplies). Since few European dealers sell for much less than list the overall landed cost for what is already expensive gear would be prohibitive. No pleasing me I guess....

Bob,

Im not discounting your concerns , i just dont find the procedure unreasonable, its actually pretty easy to resolve as the dealer is the one doing all the leg work , if you buy from a dealer close to the factory you will save on freight and if you take the 240v version , its pretty straight forward and no different from buying any speciality item where you are the importer.


Regards

Actually, buying from an European dealer is a pretty good idea as non EU customers can ask for exclusion of the VAT, which at Gryphon prices is not a small amount.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Value-...nion_countries

Also running a dedicated 240V circuit for your audio toys is a good idea. If I remember correctly Boulder's big amps are 240V only.

Originally Posted by Anatta

..Also running a dedicated 240V circuit for your audio toys is a good idea. If I remember correctly Boulder's big amps are 240V only.

..Or you could just move to Australia where we have standard 240v power

We have it here too Buddy , less not forget we invented it ..

From Shodhan's experience, sure sounds like the Company is not motivated to enter the Canadian/US market. Shooting themselves in the foot it seems, as i imagine there are other potential buyers that are uninterested in running 240v systems or tracking down dealers to ship back and forth. Agree that VAT free pricing can be attractive but US landed pricing to a distributor would likely be much less so they have a worthwhile margin.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I've heard an all Gryphon system twice for an extended listening session. Once was when the system was in front of Martin Logan Summit X speakers that I was auditioning, the other was the Kharma Classique speakers. Gryphon gear is exceptional & has everything going for it, imo. I also heard the Kharmas through a Pass XP 20 pre-amp as well, I bought a Soulution preamp

Originally Posted by Mike

Their website says:

"Distributor
USA DISTRIBUTOR INVITED
Gryphon is seeking a well established, experienced distributor only."

If this is true, why hasn't any "well established U.S. distributor" picked them up?

I remember years ago reading about very long wait times for Gryphon gear. Perhaps this has something to do with a lack of interest from a well established U.S. Distributor?

From Jaws comments above, it could be a case of once bitten, twice shy . I personally admire Flemming Rasmussen and his creations & hope he can find a good partner in the US. We have an Oz distributor, though my Dealer doesn't carry their gear.

I first saw and heard Gryphon at the 1990 Chicago CES, i thought then as now how beautiful crafted and built their products looked , it was the era of Apogee and Krell , Apps were everywhere and if you wanted to sell amplifiers you better can drive them.

Gryphon if memory serves me were using Duntech Sovereigns , a speaker also favored by Manny Huber (FMA) as he had also used them himself for show Demo's, they were Huge and expensive , BTW did i say it was the era of Apogee ..


There was one famous reviewer who like to or could hold manufactures ransom and did at times , fortunately we now have the internet or companies like Gryphon would have faded away, the gate keepers cant swing that bat like they used to ...




Regards

Garth with respect, the Product and the Business-Marketing plan are two entirely separate things. "Well above home made" ?? This stuff is built to the nth degree , better than anything else I've come across in terms of attention to detail, build quality , component usage , etc. This is world-class gear pretty much at the pinnacle of what's being done. And a one-year non-transferrable warranty ? Pretty much standard operating terms I think. Very few manufacturers offer Pass or Bryston-like transferability....certainly no-one at the Gryphon quality level. Vitus, VAC , Magico, Esoteric, dCs..... zero transferability. And service FYI is available in NA for anyone that owns Gryphon product - either Legacy models or voltage-converted units.

Originally Posted by Bobolaclune

Garth with respect, the Product and the Business-Marketing plan are two entirely separate things. "Well above home made" ?? This stuff is built to the nth degree , better than anything else I've come across in terms of attention to detail, build quality , component usage , etc. This is world-class gear pretty much at the pinnacle of what's being done. And a one-year non-transferrable warranty ? Pretty much standard operating terms I think. Very few manufacturers offer Pass or Bryston-like transferability....certainly no-one at the Gryphon quality level. Vitus, VAC , Magico, Esoteric, dCs..... zero transferability. And service FYI is available in NA for anyone that owns Gryphon product - either Legacy models or voltage-converted units.

Bob, ARC too re warranty transfer.

Mike, they got that cool flyin lion too.

Originally Posted by annapolis Raider

Anyone that's interested in Gryphon gear in general, or my ownership experience feel free to PM me. I'm going to steer clear of issues regarding Flemming's business plan for the NA.

C'mon dude, you can't do that?

I owned an older Gryphon Linestage preamp years ago. When one of the power supplies stopped working they were very helpful in getting me in contact with a service center in the USA to help with the repairs.

Now fast forward to the present. Like others have said, it is very frustrating that I have to go thru a dealer outside of the US to buy a product. I emailed Gryphon directly since there is no local dealer in Saudi Arabia (same problem as when I was in the USA). They told me to use the closest dealer to me. The problem is, I can't order from Israel and have it shipped here. It's not worth the headache that it would cause. I've emailed dealers and none have responded. I think the biggest problem is the language barrier. I can't expect a dealer from Italy, Poland, Germany, etc. to write in English.

Anyhow, they make a great product that not only looks good, but, is built good and sounds great. The fact that they don't have NA distribution is sad. That's a huge market that is missing out on such quality components.

Originally Posted by matt_zak

I owned an older Gryphon Linestage preamp years ago. When one of the power supplies stopped working they were very helpful in getting me in contact with a service center in the USA to help with the repairs.

Now fast forward to the present. Like others have said, it is very frustrating that I have to go thru a dealer outside of the US to buy a product. I emailed Gryphon directly since there is no local dealer in Saudi Arabia (same problem as when I was in the USA). They told me to use the closest dealer to me. The problem is, I can't order from Israel and have it shipped here. It's not worth the headache that it would cause. I've emailed dealers and none have responded. I think the biggest problem is the language barrier. I can't expect a dealer from Italy, Poland, Germany, etc. to write in English.

Anyhow, they make a great product that not only looks good, but, is built good and sounds great. The fact that they don't have NA distribution is sad. That's a huge market that is missing out on such quality components.

It's actually not that big , Asia is where it's at 20+ yrs and counting ....

Originally Posted by a.wayne

I first saw and heard Gryphon at the 1990 Chicago CES, i thought then as now how beautiful crafted and built their products looked , it was the era of Apogee and Krell , Apps were everywhere and if you wanted to sell amplifiers you better can drive them.

Gryphon if memory serves me were using Duntech Sovereigns , a speaker also favored by Manny Huber (FMA) as he had also used them himself for show Demo's, they were Huge and expensive , BTW did i say it was the era of Apogee ..


There was one famous reviewer who like to or could hold manufactures ransom and did at times , fortunately we now have the internet or companies like Gryphon would have faded away, the gate keepers cant swing that bat like they used to ...




Regards

Well-restored apps with Graz panels are still the best. The Full Ranges and Grands out do anything out there IMO but need space.

The FR for sure are special and they will sound different from the traced diaphram models. I have done alot of experiments over the years with traced vs straight foil , trace is more dynamic , better on jazz and instruments , straight foil on the other hand has a very pure sound , voices are rendered naked and they are here, harder to drive due to the extra mass ( kills sensitivity ) and low-Z load ...


Good stuff

Originally Posted by a.wayne

The FR for sure are special and they will sound different from the traced diaphram models. I have done alot of experiments over the years with traced vs straight foil , trace is more dynamic , better on jazz and instruments , straight foil on the other hand has a very pure sound , voices are rendered naked and they are here, harder to drive due to the extra mass ( kills sensitivity ) and low-Z load ...


Good stuff

I have heard the pure ribbon the FR. Pure bliss. The bass was coming in waves down the room and was the best reproduction of Mahler 2 I heard. Great woodwinds. These guys restore it with Graz panels, the bass panel is especially considered much better than the original, the frame is 10 times sturdier, and crossovers can be modded as well as taken active. I heard a well-restored Grand too and will be listening to one more shortly. Do you have an apogee?

For those who this this is OT, Gryphon will be extremely well-suited for apogees

Mike, just get the Gryphon line already!!!!

Originally Posted by bonzo

I have heard the pure ribbon the FR. Pure bliss. The bass was coming in waves down the room and was the best reproduction of Mahler 2 I heard. Great woodwinds. These guys restore it with Graz panels, the bass panel is especially considered much better than the original, the frame is 10 times sturdier, and crossovers can be modded as well as taken active. I heard a well-restored Grand too and will be listening to one more shortly. Do you have an apogee?

For those who this this is OT, Gryphon will be extremely well-suited for apogees

No apogee's currently , but i do currently run a Ribbon/Hybrid similar to the Gen 1 and i have had them in both configurations (traced vs solid foil) I'm also very familiar with the apogee sound (all models) but have never heard the updated stuff from Henk or Graz..

Btw i have been following you guys (on WBF) world trek and re-discover of apps and line source speakers in general, once exposed no way to listen to or live with the dynamic compression of point source speakers, your misery begins.

IMO , Horns come pretty close , but never with the same natural Timbre.. I'm also pretty surprised to see apps being run with toobs thou and last but not least, I'm a big T20 fan over test matches , who has time for test matches ..

Regards

Originally Posted by Mike

Kev - I don't think they have any interest in the U.S. Market.

It does appear so ...

They have interest. In Munich Gryphon looked for an american distribution.


Sent by iPad

Originally Posted by wisnon

I thought you were US based??? You in the UK?

Yes US based .....

I played it alot in mi yung un days, long before liking Gryphons and its more popular internationally than baseball ...

Originally Posted by a.wayne

No apogee's currently , but i do currently run a Ribbon/Hybrid similar to the Gen 1 and i have had them in both configurations (traced vs solid foil) I'm also very familiar with the apogee sound (all models) but have never heard the updated stuff from Henk or Graz..

Btw i have been following you guys (on WBF) world trek and re-discover of apps and line source speakers in general, once exposed no way to listen to or live with the dynamic compression of point source speakers, your misery begins.

IMO , Horns come pretty close , but never with the same natural Timbre.. I'm also pretty surprised to see apps being run with toobs thou and last but not least, I'm a big T20 fan over test matches , who has time for test matches ..

Regards

Lol. I agree though, for me real estate in central London is the primary consideration, but if I had the space, I would live forever with FRs. If I had more surplus, Grands. I heard Grands and realized this was the end-game. My next favorite is Trios with bass horns, but not the same tone as a pure apogee ribbon. With further surplus should add Western Electric 16A with GIP drivers on their long wall. In short, I wish had the money to do all this

Look at mini grands , their space requirements are much easier to deal with and may work for you in London ...

Originally Posted by wisnon

I know...I went to school adjacent to Sabina Park! :-)

A St George's old bwoy with tooobs , say it isnt so ...