Devialet Phantom in the house

**Mike** · October 13, 2015, 08:44 PM

I have two Silver Phantom's and the Dialog, but just hooked one up tonight.

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**BayStBroker** · October 15, 2015, 08:24 AM

I'm completely fascinated by the Phantom. I want to own one. When the company stock goes public on the Paris Exchange, I am going to buy as much as I can afford.

**Mike** · October 15, 2015, 09:58 AM

Originally Posted by BayStBroker

I'm completely fascinated by the Phantom. I want to own one. When the company stock goes public on the Paris Exchange, I am going to buy as much as I can afford.

If you lived closer, I have one you could borrow. I have to admit, it sound pretty darn good. The bass is excellent for such a small box. It's perfect in our kitchen and the kids control it with their iPod's. It's been a hit with the family.

**AJ Soundfield** · October 15, 2015, 10:52 AM

Any hologram messages for Obi-Wan coming out of that thing?

**DaveC** · October 15, 2015, 11:08 AM

I was surprised how good they are in context of a lifestyle system. Nobody's going to be replacing their $$ main speakers with these but they are pretty cool and sound better than I would have thought. The demo at RMAF was more successful/convincing vs the Kii3 for sure. The bass drivers have A LOT of excursion, it looks like they are going to take off and start flying around the room.

**Mike** · October 15, 2015, 12:08 PM

Originally Posted by DaveC

I was surprised how good they are in context of a lifestyle system. Nobody's going to be replacing their $$ main speakers with these but they are pretty cool and sound better than I would have thought. The demo at RMAF was more successful/convincing vs the Kii3 for sure. The bass drivers have A LOT of excursion, it looks like they are going to take off and start flying around the room.

Great post. You summed it up perfectly.

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mauidan · October 15, 2015, 02:29 PM

"Self amplified speakers have been shunned by Audiophiles for years – and perhaps part of the reason is few have been built very well. Look at the latest travesty, these new Devialet abominations. Anyone that’s had a serious listen would find them dreadful."

http://www.psaudio.com/pauls-posts/using-twins/

**Mike** · October 15, 2015, 02:56 PM

I think there is some confusion. These aren't intended to replace an audiophile system. They are intended as the bridge between someone going from a Bose to a nice little entry level audiophile system (say a Devialet 120 and a pair of bookshelf speakers). ALL of the calls I've received about the Phantom have started out the same way "I have a Bose now and I'm curious about the Phantom." That's not a slight - just a fact.

Audiophiles expecting the little Phantom to be more than a bridge between a Bose and a entry level system are incorrect.

The one in our kitchen replaced my wife's Panasonic radio she had beside the sink. My Father in Law likes it because it plays louder than his Bose WaveRadio and that's what he wants for his cottage.

Paul's post above continues..."Meridian has made self amplified speakers for years, yet there are none I would ever consider owning.

The truth is, 99.9% of all loudspeakers are not self amplified – and thus, this series focuses more on the practical than theoretical."

Interesting comments for sure.

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mauidan · October 15, 2015, 03:04 PM

If I was looking to upgrade from a Bose WaveRadio, I'd get these:

http://europe.yamaha.com/en/products...peaker/nx-n500

They're only $799./pair.

**Mike** · October 15, 2015, 03:06 PM

Originally Posted by mauidan

If I was looking to upgrade from a Bose WaveRadio, I'd get these:

http://europe.yamaha.com/en/products...peaker/nx-n500

They're only $799./pair.

Trust me, with those specs, they won't sound as good as the Phantom's - especially the bass. The Phantom has good bass for what it is.

Dan - let me know after you've actually heard one what you think. Keep it in context of "a guy with a Bose", not "replacing my Wilson XLF's!" LOL.

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mauidan · October 15, 2015, 03:09 PM

Originally Posted by Mike

Trust me, with those specs, they won't sound as good as the Phantom's - especially the bass. The Phantom has good bass for what it is.

Dan - let me know after you've actually heard one what you think. Keep it in context of "a guy with a Bose", not "replacing my Wilson XLF's!" LOL.

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"From crunching hard rock to deep bass to delicate female vocals, the NX-N500 reproduces them all very well."

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/co...peaker-review/

**Mike** · October 15, 2015, 03:11 PM

LOL. Ok. I'll have to hear a pair.

Can you daisy chain several together? Do they have a wifi app?

I'm wondering to myself whether someone could use 5 phantoms in a home theater setting. Hmmm...don't know.

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**wisnon** · October 15, 2015, 06:44 PM

Originally Posted by Mike

I think there is some confusion. These aren't intended to replace an audiophile system. They are intended as the bridge between someone going from a Bose to a nice little entry level audiophile system (say a Devialet 120 and a pair of bookshelf speakers). ALL of the calls I've received about the Phantom have started out the same way "I have a Bose now and I'm curious about the Phantom." That's not a slight - just a fact.

Audiophiles expecting the little Phantom to be more than a bridge between a Bose and a entry level system are incorrect.

The one in our kitchen replaced my wife's Panasonic radio she had beside the sink. My Father in Law likes it because it plays louder than his Bose WaveRadio and that's what he wants for his cottage.

Paul's post above continues..."Meridian has made self amplified speakers for years, yet there are none I would ever consider owning.

The truth is, 99.9% of all loudspeakers are not self amplified – and thus, this series focuses more on the practical than theoretical."

Interesting comments for sure.

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The Phantom is a bit more than that. String up 10 of these on the walls of a Club/Disco with a Dialog/NAS and a iPad and you are Golden. No need for any fancy technical support. Your club will be rocking.

Get a pair for a party and even the most drunk guests can't blow out your speakers…unless they spill the drinks..

**wisnon** · October 15, 2015, 06:47 PM

Originally Posted by Mike

LOL. Ok. I'll have to hear a pair.

Can you daisy chain several together? Do they have a wifi app?

I'm wondering to myself whether someone could use 5 phantoms in a home theater setting. Hmmm...don't know.

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Yes, the Phantoms have some kinda artificial intelligence and can adjust automtically to serverl operating modes. They can sense each other thru Dialog and adapt (hive mind). They have a bit of the BORG in them.

**wisnon** · October 15, 2015, 06:51 PM

Dan, I think the Silver Phantoms will destroy the Yamahas in terms of overall big sound. They will plumb deep bass to say the mid 20hz and are limited to 105db, as that is the European club limit for loudness.The Phantoms do rock and the SQ is NOT sucky. Mids and high are decent. The Bass thumps, as its an air pusher type…not vibration propogation as "proper" bass…which would require far bigger woofers.

Fun speakers.

**Bobolaclune** · October 15, 2015, 07:38 PM

Originally Posted by mauidan

"Self amplified speakers have been shunned by Audiophiles for years – and perhaps part of the reason is few have been built very well. Look at the latest travesty, these new Devialet abominations. Anyone that’s had a serious listen would find them dreadful."

http://www.psaudio.com/pauls-posts/using-twins/

I am pretty certain the folks over at ATC, Genelec , Focal Pro, Dynaudio Pro and others would take great exception to sweeping statements like that ... as well they should.

**Bobolaclune** · October 15, 2015, 07:43 PM

Originally Posted by Bobolaclune

I am pretty certain the folks over at ATC, Genelec , Focal Pro, Dynaudio Pro and others would take great exception to sweeping statements like that ... as well they should.

And I am certain that McGowan has absolutely no axe to grind in this particular race ..........

shill
"A person engaged in covert advertising. The shill attempts to spread buzz by personally endorsing the product in public forums with the pretense of sincerity, when in fact he is being paid for his services."

mauidan · October 15, 2015, 07:47 PM

Originally Posted by wisnon

Dan, I think the Silver Phantoms will destry the Yamahas in terms of overall big sound. They will plumb deep bass to say the mid 20hz and are limited to 105db, as that is the European club limit for loudness.The Phantoms do rock and the SQ is NOT sucky. Mids and high are decent. the Bass rocks as its an air pucher type…not vibration propogation as "proper" bass…which would require far bigger woofers.

Fun speakers.

Norman,
I would hope that a $4790. pair of Silver Phantoms would sound better than the $799. Yamahas.

I doubt many Bose Wave Radio owners are going to upgrade to the Phantom.

If I already had a Network DAC with a volume control, I get a pair of Event Opal monitors.

**wisnon** · October 15, 2015, 07:49 PM

Point taken, but they are less than $4k here and look cooler than the competition...

**Mike** · October 15, 2015, 08:04 PM

It's going to be interesting to see how the Phantom does in the market. It's definitely in that "new product" type category and quite unique. Where will it ultimately fit in? Is it too expensive to be a Bose replacement? Does it have a fit in the small home theater category? What about setting up the proverbial disco/dance idea Norman mentioned?

The product is no threat to the guy with the Devialet 400 and a pair of big speakers, but it is a pretty cool new product and I'm stunned at the bass out of this thing.

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**Mike** · October 15, 2015, 08:08 PM

Originally Posted by Bobolaclune

I am pretty certain the folks over at ATC, Genelec , Focal Pro, Dynaudio Pro and others would take great exception to sweeping statements like that ... as well they should.

Well said.

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**wisnon** · October 15, 2015, 08:10 PM

Yes Mike. I already had similar convos with Marketing people in the industry and everyone is eager to see how the Phantom will do from an intellectual perspective. It is so new and different and seems to fall into no man's land…price wise.

I have it on good authority that they need to sell 7K units to break even on investment, so a very tall order… its not obvious how this will end up, BUT I think their best bet is to attack the pro market, i.e. clubs, high end stores and boutiques (fancy Muzak players), high tech offices like Facebook/Google/ any successful Silicon Valley startup, high end gyms, etc.

**Mike** · October 15, 2015, 08:10 PM

Norman - are you considering a Phantom (or two)?

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**wisnon** · October 15, 2015, 08:11 PM

Maybe in a year or so…couldn't get that past "customs" at the moment. LoL
I Have 3 systems at the moment and the third system is not even setup yet...

A single Phantom is a waste of time, BTW.

**Mike** · October 15, 2015, 08:15 PM

Wish you were here - I would send you mine to try!

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**wisnon** · October 15, 2015, 08:17 PM

Originally Posted by Mike

Wish you were here - I would send you mine to try!

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I have demoed them 3 times already.My local dealer is 20mins walk from home and I am always welcome there. They are also Focal and Heil and Monitor Audio dealers, as well as Naim and a few other brands..

**Mike** · October 15, 2015, 08:18 PM

Originally Posted by wisnon

I have demoed them 3 times already.My local dealer is 20mins walk from home and I am always welcome there. They are also Focal and Heil and Monitor Audio dealers, as well as Naim and a few other brands..

Nice! Those Monitor Audio speakers are real sleepers. I LOVE NAIM!

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**DaveC** · October 15, 2015, 10:56 PM

I think tons of folks will upgrade from Bose or other similar stuff to the Phantoms. They look cool and far surpass Bose in sound quality. The general public has no time or interest to piece together an audiophile system no matter what price range it's in. I think the Phantom was a great idea, like most things it's success will be mostly dependent on marketing though.

mauidan · October 15, 2015, 11:16 PM

Originally Posted by DaveC

I think tons of folks will upgrade from Bose or other similar stuff to the Phantoms. They look cool and far surpass Bose in sound quality. The general public has no time or interest to piece together an audiophile system no matter what price range it's in. I think the Phantom was a great idea, like most things it's success will be mostly dependent on marketing though.

Wow, "tons of folks" will upgrade their $300. Bose Wave Radios to a $2K Phantom.....LOL.

**Mike** · October 15, 2015, 11:21 PM

http://youtu.be/nfWlot6h_JM

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**DaveC** · October 16, 2015, 12:13 AM

Originally Posted by mauidan

Wow, "tons of folks" will upgrade their $300. Bose Wave Radios to a $2K Phantom.....LOL.

Yup, it's a unique product. For their target audience it's not much money. I guess we will see who's right...

mauidan · October 16, 2015, 12:24 AM

Originally Posted by DaveC

Yup, it's a unique product. For their target audience it's not much money. I guess we will see who's right...

How will we determine who's right?

**wisnon** · October 16, 2015, 02:04 AM

Dan, wasn't it you on wbf who posted that it was the fastest selling debut for an audio product. Normally you are a Dev lover, so what has put you off?

mauidan · October 16, 2015, 02:14 AM

Originally Posted by wisnon

Dan, wasn't it you on wbf who posted that it was the fastest selling debut for an audio product. Normally you are a Dev lover, so what has put you off?

I was hoping they would switch their manufacturing to Poland, the new center of HiEnd Audio.

**wisnon** · October 16, 2015, 03:07 AM

Actually CH is more "central". How is Hawaii coming along as HE audio destination?

Anyway, please dont dodge the question…why have you changed your mind on the Phantoms and you have not even demoed them yet?

**DaveC** · October 16, 2015, 11:29 AM

Originally Posted by mauidan

How will we determine who's right?

That's easy, we'll see if it meets their expected sales. Someone already said 7k units to break even, I expect they will want to accomplish this within a year or so...

**wisnon** · October 16, 2015, 12:18 PM

7K units at $2K retail each is about $14m or say €12m which is the magic investment return figure. I imagine the margin here is high and so perhaps they take in 50% of retail, so that would mean 7K PAIRS needed and this is before taking into account the time value of money.

Its a massive investment in a non-existent niche they need to carve out. Very interesting business case.

**DaveC** · October 16, 2015, 02:56 PM

Originally Posted by wisnon

7K units at $2K retail each is about $14m or say €12m which is the magic investment return figure. I imagine the margin here is high and so perhaps they take in 50% of retail, so that would mean 7K PAIRS needed and this is before taking into account the time value of money.

Its a massive investment in a non-existent niche they need to carve out. Very interesting business case.

Agreed, it will be interesting to see if they have any luck with it.

**Garth** · October 17, 2015, 12:28 AM

Mike their are two models one is a higher powered than the other I thought it sounded better . Very cool design and I have been told you can do a whole house with one router up to 24 speakers not sure that is right. Each speaker is control able from your phone or computer as to volume level . Their are stands that will be out soon that are part stand and part heat sink. They get pretty warm when played loud and long .

Interesting company and ideas they have a single speaker can be run with out the router from a phone or computer pretty low cost and easy to set up. I heard them on a stand and on a HRS platform the platform made them too boomy to my ear. I hope you post your findings I think they will sell well.

**wisnon** · October 17, 2015, 05:33 AM

i think a dialog can control up to 32 speakers, the silver plays to 105db and the cheaper white to100db.
a single module is not very convincing.

not sure how they will sell at $2k an orb.

**Garth** · October 17, 2015, 08:36 AM

Originally Posted by wisnon

i think a dialog can control up to 32 speakers, the silver plays to 105db and the cheaper white to100db.
a single module is not very convincing.

not sure how they will sell at $2k an orb.

A dealer near me brought in 20 or 30 of them not sure exactly how many but they are piled floor to ceiling in a long row. I heard just one and then two and I agree two is better but for a step up from ear buds one is pretty good. As some one mentioned earlier in this post can they do surround sound systems . They are new cool looking sound pretty good and easy to use they will sell. 2 grand is no big deal these days. The future is Borg not Bose IMO

**wisnon** · October 17, 2015, 09:03 AM

They only start making money when they sell over 10k units.At $4k+ a pair, they start to compete with LCD TVs for the mainstream maker entertainment $$$$.

I can't really say how successful they will be. I will just observe.

**Mike** · November 29, 2015, 01:19 AM

My phantom with a little style.

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**AJ Soundfield** · November 29, 2015, 07:50 AM

What, no beret?

**Steve** · April 8, 2016, 01:38 PM

I listened to these today. Interesting technical solution. Certainly will not replace a traditional system, but as an unobtrusive lifestyle or office solution, quite compelling.

Look past Bose, buy these...

**tunes** · April 8, 2016, 04:04 PM

Heard the one at Mike's and was amazed at what this little orb can do. It's being sold in the MOMA store.

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**jaxwired** · April 9, 2016, 09:26 AM

I've thought from day one this product would fail in the market. I might be way wrong, but I still don't think anyone but audiophiles and the very wealthy will spend more than $1000 on a music system. Not talking Home theater here, just a music system. The vast majority of people only listen to music on their phones, or in the car. Other than for parties, music no longer plays in the typical American home ever unfortunately. Plus people have been conditioned by Best Buy and Walmart that a cheap music system costs $99 and a really expensive one costs $700 or $800. It's like trying to sell a pizza for $50. It's a really really good pizza. Any takers?

**Mike** · April 9, 2016, 09:35 AM

Originally Posted by jaxwired

I've thought from day one this product would fail in the market. I might be way wrong, but I still don't think anyone but audiophiles and the very wealthy will spend more than $1000 on a music system. Not talking Home theater here, just a music system. The vast majority of people only listen to music on their phones, or in the car. Other than for parties, music no longer plays in the typical American home ever unfortunately. Plus people have been conditioned by Best Buy and Walmart that a cheap music system costs $99 and a really expensive one costs $700 or $800. It's like trying to sell a pizza for $50. It's a really really good pizza. Any takers?

Devialet tells us they have sold over 50,000 units. Someone is buying them. My typical buyer of the Phantom is not the wealthy or the audiophile. It's a whole new customer base. Obviously it's people with disposable income, but I've been pleasantly surprised.

**jaxwired** · April 9, 2016, 09:52 AM

Originally Posted by Mike

Devialet tells us they have sold over 50,000 units. Someone is buying them. My typical buyer of the Phantom is not the wealthy or the audiophile. It's a whole new customer base. Obviously it's people with disposable income, but I've been pleasantly surprised.

I believe you, I just find that very surprising.

**Garth** · April 9, 2016, 11:36 AM

Originally Posted by Mike

Devialet tells us they have sold over 50,000 units. Someone is buying them. My typical buyer of the Phantom is not the wealthy or the audiophile. It's a whole new customer base. Obviously it's people with disposable income, but I've been pleasantly surprised.

Thats good it seems like a good product great to see it doing well. Should go well with a 50 buck pizza

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