Thread: Roon vs JRiver

I am looking for opinions and input between these two wonderful pieces of software for controlling and playing my music library.

I have been using JRiver since getting back into higher end audio equipment last fall. It works just fine for me but there are some limitations. I used my Surface Pro 3 as a music server and it worked very well, but it has space limitation. I will run out of space in the very near future. I configured my Falcon Northwest Tiki computer as a music server. It is a tremendous music server that I would put against virtually any dedicated server out there, without storage space limitation.

The one thing that I do not like about the setup is having a monitor sitting on my audio rack in order to control JRiver. I know that they sell the JRemote application for iPads and Android tablets, but do not offer anything similar for my Surface. I prefer to have have to buy an additional tablet just for remote control capabilities.

Therefore I am trying Roon, which has the capability of setting up the Tiki as a server and using the Surface as a controller. This aspect works very well. Roon is supposed to offer a better meta data capability and more information, etc. Roon also interfaces with Tidal, but I do not have any interest in streaming services as well as streaming music from my NAS. So far I like the interface but I have found a few meta data errors that I have had to correct, that did not exist in JRiver.

The biggest issue is that JRiver cost $50 and a small upgrade fee whenever they come out with a new version (which they have not done in a while), but Roon cost $120 a year or $500 for a lifetime subscription. This is a huge cost difference.

So what I am asking is please help me justify if Roon is worth the difference? Is there other aspects of either that you like better than the other? I am truly trying to understand the difference. I like some aspects of one over the other, but is it worth this huge price difference?

Hey Bill, Yes I have watched the video and it is a good overview. I am still not getting a complete reasoning in my mind as to why Roon is charging so much. All the meta data stuff is fun, I guess; and would be a whole lot better if I have not encountered quite a few errors. The connection to Tidal is 100% irrelevant to me.

The interface is good, and I suppose maybe a tad better than JRiver, although both work fine. The server / controller is the big thing for me. This does work pretty nice. Weather that alone is worth the price difference I guess is the big question.

Has anyone tried the JRemote app for Android? Is it as good as the controls directly on the computer screen with mouse of touch? I guess the real consideration comes mostly to that I could buy an Android tablet for the subscription price (some even for the one year sub price) of Roon. Does it do as good of job as the controller install of Roon? If so then it might be worthy of considering that route. If not then this is where Roon shines for me because the controller on my Surface does work well and allows me to not have a huge monitor on top of my audio rack.

Anyone else have any input? This is a very important aspect of digital playback in an audio system.

Randy, I used JRiver with JRemote for years. It's UI is very clunky and the app is very bloated.

I now use Roon and find it SO much better. Given that JRiver hasn't made any effort to improve the UI over the last 5 or so years I've been using it, I would much rather put my money into Roon.

Originally Posted by madfloyd

Randy, I used JRiver with JRemote for years. It's UI is very clunky and the app is very bloated.

I now use Roon and find it SO much better. Given that JRiver hasn't made any effort to improve the UI over the last 5 or so years I've been using it, I would much rather put my money into Roon.

Clarification: the JRiver application is bloated. JRemote is actually very good, at least on IOS.

Thank you for the input! I am still trying to decide between the two.

I am very surprised. I had just about decided to go with Roon. The interface is a little slicker and even though the meta data is not huge on my list it is pretty cool. The people from Roon even told me they would give me extra time in a trial if I needed it to make my decision.

Well this evening I did what to me is the ultimate test and this is what has surprised me so much. I did a direct sound quality comparison. I made sure that both were setup as best as I could with my understanding of each. I was comparing some of my favorite test DSD files. I played a few minutes on Roon and then the exact same on JRiver. All else is exactly the same. Same computer, same DAC, same files even for that matter.

I fully expected them to be identical. What surprised me is they are not, on my system with my ears one was superior every single time. JRiver actually sounds better to me. This is actually a disappointment to me since I had just about decided to spring for the lifetime sub with Roon.

Roon sounded a little brighter and much thinner. The depth, the impact seemed to be missing. Each and every selection the JRiver play back had a much tighter bottom end, smoother vocals without the edge that I was hearing, and the biggest difference was much more open, much better sound stage. Almost like when your ears pop and everything is just clear...

I tried several different selections and several different artist. The only thing that I was important to me was that I was comparing DSD files. I am surprised ...

Randy, I have been using JRiver for years and it just flat out performs outstanding. My current JRiver is v21. I use an IPad with JRemote and find it very easy to manage playback.

The other option is making a Remote Desktop connection to your Surface Pro 3 using another Windows tablet phone, iPhone, iPad etc.

I have experimented with remote desktop software. The standard remote desktop requires Windows 10 Professional I believe. Windows 10 home version no longer includes remote desktop. I have played around with others such as Team Viewer and Splashtop. Both work, but not as smooth as I would like. I also have MCRemote which is a JRiver remote program for Windows Phones. It does actually work, but far too small for my everyday use.

The way that Roon runs with a "Server" on the main computer and installing the "Controller" on the Surface (or laptop etc.) works very nice because it is exactly the same as the desktop app.

Just wondering if JRemote works as good as this. I would literally be buying a tablet for this purpose. Seems silly to get a tablet just to use it as a remote ....

I am continuing to compare to make sure it was not just an anomaly last night. I really want them to sound the same and really find it hard to believe that there is a difference. I can't ever remember routing for something to be better so that I could spend $500 and DAMMIT. I just played some selection from some 96kHz PCM files.... DAMMIT, JRiver stills sounds better. Fuller, richer...son of a b!@#$%...

I said from the get go that SQ is the one factor that I am not willing to compromise on. I am just shocked that JRiver actually sounds better than Roon... of course judging only from my setup...

So now do I buy a tablet just to run JRemote? The remote desktop apps are not solid enough to remove the monitor from on top of my audio rack (Roon's controller was )... MCRemote on my phone is too small and basic to use 100% of the time, and honestly I almost always have to re-connect the phone to wifi when I use it because unlike the kids, I do not live on my phone ....

Ok, giving Roon one more chance.... ELP From the Beginning in 96kHz.... "New Stereo Mix".... ok the Roon playback sounds pretty good.... JRiver..... F!@#$.... fuller, more open, richness in the vocals is much better... the guitar strings are so much more present and the sound stage is to die for....I didn't even notice the background percussion in the Roon playback.... grrr

I know this has got to be funny as heck, me giving a play by play... but I thought some might find it very interesting. But, yea JRivers does sound better... which honestly makes me sad....

huh? Surface Pro 3 should be running Windows 10 Pro not Home Ed. An RDP session from a Win 10 Pro machine should work a treat, even to an iPad.

With your music on a NAS like a Synology (preferably switched from another room) would solve all of your storage problems. Also, Ethernet will always be cleaner than WiFi with HiFi.

The Surface Pro 3 is running Windows 10 Pro but the PC is not. It is running Windows 10 Home. It was a free Windows 10 upgrade PC... So another option might be to upgrade the Windows version on the PC.... hmmmmm and then the PC could be set to accept Remote Desktop connections.

Randy....I think you are at a level that deserves a NAS for your needs. Plus you can use it for all of your other stuff.

The Synology DS1515+ is a ripper. It will last you for many years.

It also opens up many other media player choices.

I already have a 4 TB NAS on my network. I am a software engineer. I had the house pre-wired through out. I still prefer to have the music running from the local server/pc. I use the NAS as a backup and a file server.

I am currently running a Windows 10 Pro upgrade on the computer now ....

Got remote desktop working... but it really is clunky as heck... not nearly as good as it works to remote to the servers that I do all day long at work ....

I picked up an Android tablet today. Honestly the JRemote app seems to work really good. Not quite as slick as Roon, but fairly decent, pretty close, and very usable. It also allows me to take the monitor off the top of the audio rack!

I have two weeks to continue to play with Roon and also the Android before making the absolutely decision.

I could not tell the difference between JRiver and Roon in my system, so I went with better interface/experience and got a lifetime Roon experience. I currently use an Aries for streaming, but will try a PC endpoint one day and see if HQ Player lives up to the hype. I have PCs, and an iPad, and everything just works once you get the library reading done. The RoonServer, and the Aries integration (and example of RoonSpeaker IIRC), really makes things easier IMO. To date, if a system allows "bit perfect" and "exclusive access", I am pretty happy. I have found "integer mode" to be spotty on my ability to detect a difference.

I found JRiver to be clunky to use (not enough experience for me I am sure), and had too many features I did not want/need, but thought JRemote on the iPad worked well. On a headless PC, I found myself having to open up the remote desktop way too often to sort out some "update" with JRiver, which happens seamlessly when you respond to the Roon app when it has updates.

It is still early for Roon, and their product continues to improve. You can always come back later and try again if the sound is not up to snuff today. Now that they play with HQP, other "sound enhance" type programs my follow, or perhaps some of these type things will get written in.

Thank you for the input. It sounds like your experience between the two is the same as mine.... I really wanted Roon to be as good (or better)... but the SQ in JRivers was better with every single test I did.

I tried an Android tablet as a controller for JRiver. yes it worked but it was not nearly as nice as Roon.

I have conversed with Roon a few times. They have made a few suggestions. Their support was also thinking that maybe JRiver and Roon were in contention with each other. The one thing that does seem to make the most difference is running Roon as a Headless Dedicated Server on the Tiki. Nothing else running other than the normal protection software. And then using the Surface as the Roon Controller. Seems like the SQ is there and definitely a heck of a lot better interface.

Because of the amazing diligence from Roon support and their obvious continual improvements I decided to purchase the lifetime subscription. They also assured me that version 1.2 will be out within a month!

Originally Posted by Randy Myers

The only thing that I was important to me was that I was comparing DSD files. I am surprised ...

Might it be that although you are playing DSD, it is converted to PCM?
If this is the case it might be a matter of different filters.
JRiver uses a very aggressive filter by default removing almost all high frequency components
(see the pics on http://www.thewelltemperedcomputer.c...s/Spectrum.htm)

If there is such thing as consensus in audio, HQPlayer is the way to go if we talk sound quality.
Its interface is primitive so Roon+HQplayer probably gives you the best of both worlds.

I had checked that previously. I was running DSD in Native. I have one album in DSD 256. The only way it can play is through native on either. It played fine on both JRiver and Roon.

I may look into the HQPlayer with Roon eventually. After just purchasing the lifetime on roon I have to lay low for a little while on audio player software ....

Nice, now to figure out how to install it. I am fairly certain it will be a breeze ....

Originally Posted by Randy Myers

I have experimented with remote desktop software. The standard remote desktop requires Windows 10 Professional I believe. Windows 10 home version no longer includes remote desktop. I have played around with others such as Team Viewer and Splashtop. Both work, but not as smooth as I would like. I also have MCRemote which is a JRiver remote program for Windows Phones. It does actually work, but far too small for my everyday use.

The way that Roon runs with a "Server" on the main computer and installing the "Controller" on the Surface (or laptop etc.) works very nice because it is exactly the same as the desktop app.

Just wondering if JRemote works as good as this. I would literally be buying a tablet for this purpose. Seems silly to get a tablet just to use it as a remote ....

I am continuing to compare to make sure it was not just an anomaly last night. I really want them to sound the same and really find it hard to believe that there is a difference. I can't ever remember routing for something to be better so that I could spend $500 and DAMMIT. I just played some selection from some 96kHz PCM files.... DAMMIT, JRiver stills sounds better. Fuller, richer...son of a b!@#$%...

I said from the get go that SQ is the one factor that I am not willing to compromise on. I am just shocked that JRiver actually sounds better than Roon... of course judging only from my setup...

So now do I buy a tablet just to run JRemote? The remote desktop apps are not solid enough to remove the monitor from on top of my audio rack (Roon's controller was )... MCRemote on my phone is too small and basic to use 100% of the time, and honestly I almost always have to re-connect the phone to wifi when I use it because unlike the kids, I do not live on my phone ....

Ok, giving Roon one more chance.... ELP From the Beginning in 96kHz.... "New Stereo Mix".... ok the Roon playback sounds pretty good.... JRiver..... F!@#$.... fuller, more open, richness in the vocals is much better... the guitar strings are so much more present and the sound stage is to die for....I didn't even notice the background percussion in the Roon playback.... grrr

I know this has got to be funny as heck, me giving a play by play... but I thought some might find it very interesting. But, yea JRivers does sound better... which honestly makes me sad....

Hi Randy, very interesting test, thank you for sharing. Unfortunately I do not have much to contribute, regarding the SQ of either, as I was using Audirvana as a Mac user.

What might also happen, is that your 'better' is what you are accustomed to, as you have been using JRiver for a while. You could hence cross check both Roon and JRiver vs. another source e.g. CD.

I have gotten everything as honed in as I can I think at this point. because of the amazing service and interface with the people from Roon I decided to purchased a lifetime Roon subscription. By running Roon as a headless server on my dedicated PC and using my Surface as a Roon controller it not only sounds excellent but also works very nice. The Roon controller is about as good as you get in convenience and ease of use!

I was shocked at how better Roon sounded than anything else I tried (on Antipodes server). The only downside I see (besides the subscription of course) so far is the fact that it obliges one to use Tidal over Qobuz, which means a smaller catalog, at least for classical music and jazz. That, plus a few stability issues and bugs. Regardless, I'm switching all my dealers and all willing clients to it.

Streaming is not something that I am currently interested in so Tidal versus Qobuz does not matter. I have not seen any stability issues so far. At first JRiver was giving me a very slight sound quality improvement. However, with optimizing Roon, going with Room as a straight headless server on my dedicated PC and using another PC (Surface Pro 3) as the Roon controller I feel that any SQ differences have been negated. The amazing customer service that i experienced from the Roon staff and the tremendous advantages (and much better interface) of the Roon Controller versus JRemote on an Android tablet led me to purchase the lifetime sub. Purchased an Android tablet to use negated a portion of the Roon sub price since I already had the Surface available!

I am a lot late to the party. But J remote works well with Android. You can also use a program called Splash Top. It's free and it works great. It puts the desk top of one computer on another and it allows you to control it an any programs remotely and seamlessly. I use it to control Bug Head on my dedicated music laptop and external hard drive.

http://www.splashtop.com/

I am very familiar with SplashTop, and TeamView, etc, etc.... I also own JRemote.... all are good, none are close to Roon Controller....