Intel NUC music server incoming

I have been around the horn with various Mac, and PC servers. I have built a couple of fanless ITX systems, both of which failed somewhere. I bought a SGC i5, but the SSD won’t stay mounted. I keep coming back to a fanless i7 NUC 6pro, running ROCK, with a USB drive for the music. Runs cool, and tirelessly. That being said, I’m running on the QNAP NAS currently.

Mind you I have a DAC with built in streamer, so I just need it to run library services, and I resample all to DSD64, as that sounds best on my DAC. I don’t need any special, reclocked USB. Plenty of power for this in the NAS, and the i7 NUC 6pro.

Bones13 said:

I have been around the horn with various Mac, and PC servers. I have built a couple of fanless ITX systems, both of which failed somewhere. I bought a SGC i5, but the SSD won’t stay mounted. I keep coming back to a fanless i7 NUC 6pro, running ROCK, with a USB drive for the music. Runs cool, and tirelessly. That being said, I’m running on the QNAP NAS currently.

Mind you I have a DAC with built in streamer, so I just need it to run library services, and I resample all to DSD64, as that sounds best on my DAC. I don’t need any special, reclocked USB. Plenty of power for this in the NAS, and the i7 NUC 6pro.

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That's very useful info, Bones, thanks. I'm going to be doing something similar; the Intel NUC's only function will be to send files from a hard drive (or from Qobuz) via optical to the Lumin P1, which has also has a DAC with a built-in streamer.

I think this is the same board used in Nucleus Plus Revision B.

Note that your 19V LPS should not be rated less than 3.5A.

wklie said:

I think this is the same board used in Nucleus Plus Revision B.

Note that your 19V LPS should not be rated less than 3.5A.

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Hi Peter! Yes, I have the same specifications for the NUC and for the required LPS: 19V, ≥ 3.5A.

I'm going to use this Intel NUC until the Lumin L2 ships and is available.

Thanks again for the excellent support, and please say Hi to Nelson for me, I met him at AXPONA. I always appreciate the level of support you and the nice folks at Lumin provide.

L2 does not run Roon Core.

wklie said:

L2 does not run Roon Core.

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Hi Peter, yes, I know and that's fine. I've also consistently found that for ripped content and streaming that the same file sounds better with the native Lumin app than Roon. When I am listening "critically", I listen to my P1 with the native Lumin app, but when I just have the system on and and am listening "casually", or have music on in the background, so to speak, I use often use Roon for that role, especially in "Radio mode" to discover new content.

I have some music content both on a USB flash thumb drive and also an el-cheapo consumer-grade external USB hard drive, and have found that the highest music qualty is obtained by playback of a file ripped from disc using the native Lumin app rather than that same file served up by a Roon Core "server". The issue I have with my el-cheapo consumer-grade external USB hard drive I've been using connected to the P1 is that it's really slow to load ripped file content into the Lumin app for playback. This is not the fault of the Lumin app, but rather the hard drive drive mech itself, as content loaded from a solid-state flash (USB thumb drive) drive loads almost immediately.

So, with that, I plan to get the L2 when it ships, put my key music content on it, and use it to serve up files ripped from disc to the P1 via the Lumin app for the highest playback audio quality. As mentioned above, I consistently find the native Lumin app to sound better than the same ripped file "served up" by Roon.

That being said, though, I still use Roon as it's a great way to discover new music, and a key point I find folks frequenty don't understand is that it's not an "all or none" situation using Lumin's "native app" and Roon. Using one does not at all obviate using the other: you can switch playback between the Lumin app and Roon and have it work very seamlessly; the P1 is great in that it will effectively switch playback of tracks from Roon to the Lumin app and back to Roon effectively instantly.

This music server is simply an experimental project to see how a "streamlined" dedicated music server Roon core sounds compared to using a consumer-grade Mac Mini functioning as a Roon core, just to gain data for "the database". I'm a scientist, and scientists do experiments; it's in their nature.

Cheers and thanks, Peter.

I have a lot of experience with these and build a lot of them and love them. Also use one for myself for a few years. They are quiet, and stay cool, and do what they have to do.

A few tips: I always adjust the bios settings for audio. At standard settings there are a few processes running you don't want. For details you may pm me.
Optionally you can buy an extra Akasa heatsink. With that it protects the SSD more against heat, although, with Roon Rock does not get warm at all, it may protect and it is a cheap addition
- I never tried it myself, but this case does come with an internal power unit. Correct me if I am wrong but I think that that one could be replaced by an audiophilic one.
- 16 GB of ram is fine.

it is an amazing buy, technically seen you have the same specs as the roon nucleus, with the same sound, but then for 1/5 of the money. Well done.

Alkyogre said:

I have a lot of experience with these and build a lot of them and love them. Also use one for myself for a few years. They are quiet, and stay cool, and do what they have to do.

A few tips: I always adjust the bios settings for audio. At standard settings there are a few processes running you don't want. For details you may pm me.
Optionally you can buy an extra Akasa heatsink. With that it protects the SSD more against heat, although, with Roon Rock does not get warm at all, it may protect and it is a cheap addition
- I never tried it myself, but this case does come with an internal power unit. Correct me if I am wrong but I think that that one could be replaced by an audiophilic one.
- 16 GB of ram is fine.

it is an amazing buy, technically seen you have the same specs as the roon nucleus, with the same sound, but then for 1/5 of the money. Well done.

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Thanks, Alkyogre, very useful info.

I've now got mine up and running, an even streaming from Qobuz, it already was clear it sounds quite a bit better than my Mac Mini Roon Core. It's quite a bit more "dimensional", "fleshed out" sounding with more body as well as "spaciousness" between the "voices", both instrumental and vocal. I just connected an external USD drive with a bunch of content, it found all the files and now I can access files ripped from digital disks as well as streaming from Qobuz. So far, I am very impressed, and I'm not even powering it with a linear power supply, yet. Moreover, I haven't even connected it to the Altaira sub-system of Gemini via one of it's USB ports yet.

More good stuff to come, I would expect. I'll reach out via PM about checking the set up of the BIOS, thank you. Cheers!

Some pics of the set-up in the "remote server room"....



Top view showing EtherREGEN (under doorstop) at left rear, along with the AfterDark Master Clock and power supply, the Pace router at right, and the Akasa NUC Roon Core (which I've dubbed "Alita, Battle Angel", play on words there...) NUC in front.

Everything powered by a Shunyata Gemini power distributor & Venom V14 NR PCs with Alpha and Venom ground cables going from EtherREGEN, Alita (via one of it's USB ports), and the Pace Router to Gemini's Altaira GP-NR subsystem, which makes everything really quiet.


Front view of Alita, Battle Angel servin' up tunes.


Sounds....REALLY GOOD. Whoa. :disbelief:

Puma Cat said:

Sounds....REALLY GOOD. Whoa. :disbelief:

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With the original NUC power supply, or the 19V LPS (which brand)?

It is a bit weird, but it is the Akasa that gives a boost in sound quality, it means that this Akasa-nuc sounds better then the original plastic version. The first time I build one, and tested it, I did not expect that, but the difference was huge.

Between an i3/i5 or i7 I never noticed any difference in sq.

wklie said:

With the original NUC power supply, or the 19V LPS (which brand)?

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Hi Peter,
Presently I'm just using a 19V/4A laptop-style SMPS that I bought at Best Buy until I can purchase an LPS for it. I was going to get the Small Green Computer 100 Watt 19V LPS, but the person who sold me this Akasa NUC has tested several LPS including HDPlex, Teddy Pardo, Farad, etc., and said he can provide a reference for a supplier for the LPS that he and his buddies found to sound the best after comprehensive testing. He was busy with a medical appointment today when I swung by to pick up the Akasa NUC, so I didn't have time to discuss his findings, but we're going to connect via Zoom and discuss his findings and recommendations for the linear power supply he found to be the best.

Moreover, given that my Mac Mini Roon Core is also powered by an (Apple-factory installed) SMPS, it made for a good experimental control ("the datum" as we say in science) to compare to this Intel NUC, and I can safely say that "Alita, Battle Angel" pretty much smokes the Mac Mini Roon Core per the attributes I described above. And, it's getting better (and quieter) as it "settles' (computers, CPUs, cables, etc. really do not like being jostled in a car or logistics truck).

And, even presently powered with an SMPS, it is notably quieter than the Mac Mini Roon Core I was using previously. I can only imagine how good it will be with a good LPS...

Once I get that, I'll post some additional impressions here. I still plan on getting the L2, once it's launched as I am sure it will be very impressive, knowing how well Lumin executes on it's product development.

Cheers.

Alkyogre said:

It is a bit weird, but it is the Akasa that gives a boost in sound quality, it means that this Akasa-nuc sounds better then the original plastic version. The first time I build one, and tested it, I did not expect that, but the difference was huge.

Between an i3/i5 or i7 I never noticed any difference in sq.

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Interesting, but can't say I'm surprised, per se. My hyphothesis is that the Akasa case allows for the "simplest" implementation/installation, with just the minimal required parts and "sub-systems', and nothing more to obtain functionality. IIRC, the original plastic-cased NUCs still have the internal fan subsystem, and I'm sure that contributes noise, just as one example. The Akasa case doesn't require the fan as it uses heat sinks to disperse heat.

When I used to teach DFSS, a key principle I tried to drill into the heads of our engineers is that the simplest manner in which a function can be performed...the better. In TRIZ, this is known as the "Theory of Ideality", shown here:



"Simpler" really is "better", just as Linn and Nelson Pass have been espousing for years, and those Akasa-based NUCs look really simple.

Although not everybody believes it, I have always believed fanless to be an important thing.

NUC board calls for 12-19V DC. As little as 2A/12V will do, if you don't plan using upsampling. You can always switch power sense to ON in the BIOS - it will limit the CPU performance if the PSU is not able to deliver the requested current.

This is a great, low noise 4A/12V PSU for the Nucleus:
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256804636423034.html

Just be aware that the NUC7i7DNB board will not work with Akasa Plato X7 case without modifications to the case's cooling block - this is why NUC7i7DNB is not listed on the Akasa webpage as compatible.

Yes, I know that you can fit the NUC7i7DNB board inside the case without any problems and many people do it - they just don't realise one of the three CPU chips that should be touching the cooling block, is literally hanging free in the air with zero cooling, as the cooling block is not long enough.

I can only imagine that the CPU is throttling down in such a build to avoid overheating and subsequent damage.

On the other hand, the less powerful NUC7i3DNB and NUC7i7DNB baords fit just fine.

There is something above the nuc. I really like these, but it misses a good clock, especially those oxco clocks are great.

The best computers are not only fanless, but also have an audiophilic soundcard, feeded by a separate lps. They are made for headless purposes, meaning that you directly hook a dac on it. This reduces jitter. Those kind of computers are very expensive and start price is about 20k dollar.

What I do, I thought it could be done cheaper. This is the reason I added that Singxer digital to digital converter behind my nuc to reduce that jitter. It worked amazingly well. Because it sounded far better then my Sonore ultrarendu streamer with dedicated lps, I listen now with a nuc headless system, with that Singxer behind it.

Alkyogre said:

There is something above the nuc. I really like these, but it misses a good clock, especially those oxco clocks are great.

The best computers are not only fanless, but also have an audiophilic soundcard, feeded by a separate lps. They are made for headless purposes, meaning that you directly hook a dac on it. This reduces jitter. Those kind of computers are very expensive and start price is about 20k dollar.

What I do, I thought it could be done cheaper. This is the reason I added that Singxer digital to digital converter behind my nuc to reduce that jitter. It worked amazingly well. Because it sounded far better then my Sonore ultrarendu streamer with dedicated lps, I listen now with a nuc headless system, with that Singxer behind it.

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Hi Alkyoogre,
Thanks for this info; it's very helpful.

Regarding a clock, I am using an AfterDark Queen master clock that is connected to EtherREGEN (ER) with a Venom-X clock cable. This brought a BIG improvement to the system sound, overall. Very appreciative that John Swenson put a clock port on ER. Both the Queen clock and ER are powered by an AfterDark LPS.

Regarding the soundcard, not sure that would be necessary in my case (though not exactly sure) because I don't use a USB cable to the DAC anymore. All I do is connect the Akasa NUC to EtherREGEN (in the remote server room) with a Sigma Ethernet cable, an then run LC/LC optical fiber out from ER's SFP cage on A-side into the back of my Lumin P1's SFP cage in the main audio rack in another room. I use single-mode 1310 nM Corning fiber per Peter Lie's recommendations (again, thank you, Peter :tup in to Planet Tech MGB-TL40 LC/LC optical transceivers. So, I don't use an Ethernet or USB cable in the main rack at all, anymore. Simple. And...simpler is better, as Nelson has been telling us for many years, now.

I'll look into the Singxer digital to digital convertor; thanks for the tip on that. Cheers.

If you are using an end-point connected via Ethernet (wired or optical), then it doesn't matter.

The normal way of upgrading the sound of Nucleus is

a better PSU for the Nucleus

or

an Ethernet connected end point.

If you have your Nucleus in another room (read: not next to your hifi) then the PSU on the Nucleus doesn't really matter. Only the end point and its PSU.

In a core-endpoint connection I hear a SQ difference between such a fanless Akasa Nuc and same motherboard in the original plastic case even when they are located in another room far away from my endpoint, the streamer. I still don't understand why.