Intel NUC music server incoming

There is an active group which say that Windows does sound better then linux, because Windows does make use of asio and Wasapi drivers and linux does make use of their alsa driver. There is no way to get asio or wasapi to work on linux. But the drawback of Windows is that all background processes are ongoing in the background which have a poor result. To shut of the background processes it is needed to run audiophile optimizer, which will run on either Windows 10 pro or Windows server. With windows pro you have to do all things manually, with server you are all set, but this license is very expensive. A few years ago I had to pay 1200 euro only for that Windows server license and on the other hand support for windows 10 pro is ending soon.

But the questionable thing for me is: if Windows does sound so well, then all streamer builders donÂ’t use it donÂ’t use it and they must run on a kind of linux software and their alsa drivers, so in my opinion linux can sound quite good and a perfect Windows installation is annoying, expensive and more difficult to maintain.

About audio linux, the good news is that you donÂ’t need basic linux knowledge. You can easily install it and all programs are for download with pre buttons. For instance if you want Roon, you only have to go with the keyboard to install Roon and thats it. Installation of audio linux, you need to download it and make in Windows a bootable USB stick (at least 32 GB, and preferably not Sandisc) first. For making bootable USB sticks I recommend BalenaEtcher. It is so easy, start it, select your downloaded file, then choose your target - the USB stick and make a bootable drive. Then restart your pc, change the bios settings to boot USB first and follow the instructions

By the way I did not start yet installation yet due to some private issues, hope to get into it soon amd share results.
 
Alkyogre said:
There is an active group which say that Windows does sound better then linux, because Windows does make use of asio and Wasapi drivers and linux does make use of their alsa driver. There is no way to get asio or wasapi to work on linux. But the drawback of Windows is that all background processes are ongoing in the background which have a poor result. To shut of the background processes it is needed to run audiophile optimizer, which will run on either Windows 10 pro or Windows server. With windows pro you have to do all things manually, with server you are all set, but this license is very expensive. A few years ago I had to pay 1200 euro only for that Windows server license and on the other hand support for windows 10 pro is ending soon.

But the questionable thing for me is: if Windows does sound so well, then all streamer builders donÂ’t use it donÂ’t use it and they must run on a kind of linux software and their alsa drivers, so in my opinion linux can sound quite good and a perfect Windows installation is annoying, expensive and more difficult to maintain.

About audio linux, the good news is that you donÂ’t need basic linux knowledge. You can easily install it and all programs are for download with pre buttons. For instance if you want Roon, you only have to go with the keyboard to install Roon and thats it. Installation of audio linux, you need to download it and make in Windows a bootable USB stick (at least 32 GB, and preferably not Sandisc) first. For making bootable USB sticks I recommend BalenaEtcher. It is so easy, start it, select your downloaded file, then choose your target - the USB stick and make a bootable drive. Then restart your pc, change the bios settings to boot USB first and follow the instructions

By the way I did not start yet installation yet due to some private issues, hope to get into it soon amd share results.
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Very helpful info, Almar. Thanks!
 
I did save the original hd from the sonictransport. I may use that and give the installation process a try. Then I can gain some confidence from the install. If I fail I still have my original plan. Thanks for the information.
 
Darrel said:
I did save the original hd from the sonictransport. I may use that and give the installation process a try. Then I can gain some confidence from the install. If I fail I still have my original plan. Thanks for the information.
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Darrel,
Are you presently able to use your SonicTransporter? I thought about buying one, but Alita came up locally for only $350.
 
Puma Cat said:
Darrel,
Are you presently able to use your SonicTransporter? I thought about buying one, but Alita came up locally for only $350.
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Yes, I'm using it and have used it since ownership. I'm just running a limited windows 10 home software for Roon. I use a HDPlex 200 linear power supply to power it. It's a nice quiet computer. Linux software that came with it just wasn't stable after random power outages. I haven't had power outages since I had window 10 home installed on the current hd.
 
Darrel said:
Yes, I'm using it and have used it since ownership. I'm just running a limited windows 10 home software for Roon. I use a HDPlex 200 linear power supply to power it. It's a nice quiet computer. Linux software that came with it just wasn't stable after random power outages. I haven't had power outages since I had window 10 home installed on the current hd.
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Thanks, Darrel, that was very helpful info.

Yeah, I've been wanting to buy an HDPlex LPS to power my Akasa-cased NUC Roon core, but HDPlex is presently out of stock on them. I've only read excellent comments about them, and they're the "de-facto" standard LPS that most of the guys that are really into building their own "super high-end" music servers (like Nenon at AS) are using. I've got a notification set up with HDPlex to be notified when they are back in stock. Cheers and thanks again. 👍
 
There is a GREAT psu for your Nucleus or Nucleus clone:

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256804636423034.html

$200 shipped. LHA Audio is a great chineese company. There is really no point in spending more.

PS. All Nucleus boards work on 12-19V DC as per Intel spec sheet. I always recommend to get 12V one, as you will be able to reuse it down the road, if you ever sell your Nucleus. 19V one will basicly only work with Nucleus.
 
I have the opposite recommendation. I recommend using only 19V LPS with no less than 3.5A output (i.e. 66W) for authentic Intel NUC boards for ensuring system stability. The reason is that many LPS will drop voltage when stressed. When its voltage is dropped from 19V, it may hopefully still work. When it drops below 12V, nothing good can happen.

Edit: The rationale for this is to cater for the worst case from an engineering perspective. To ensure system stability, you need the power to be sufficient for the worst case, not the average case. There is a third party review that stresses the NUC7i7 (i.e. same generation as Nucleus Plus) and got a maximum measured 58.5W consumption.

For things outside authentic Intel NUC boards, I agree 12V is much more versatile.
 
wklie said:
I have the opposite recommendation. I recommend using only 19V LPS with no less than 3.5A output (i.e. 66W) for authentic Intel NUC boards for ensuring system stability. The reason is that many LPS will drop voltage when stressed. When its voltage is dropped from 19V, it may hopefully still work. When it drops below 12V, nothing good can happen.

For things outside authentic Intel NUC boards, I agree 12V is much more versatile.
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1. Your "authentic" Nucleus uses generic Intel board. Specs on Intel website are clear:

DC Input Voltage Supported: 12-19 VDC

There is no advantage from going with 19VDC. If anything, voltage needs to be dropped even more (MoBo subsystems work on 3.3V, 5V and 12V).

2. Power supplies are regulated. If your linear power supply can't hold the voltage at rated current, they you bought yourself a garbage, not a decent PSU. The LHY Audio PSU I have linked has zero problems supplying 4A @ 12V of instantaneous current. It is more than enough for any Nucleus.

3. Nucleus+ draws only 0.66A @ 12V while playing music in native format (no upsampling) and 0.72A @ 12V while playing music with 2x PCM upsampling and DSP switched on. At no point it will go past 2A @ 12V while using Roon (unless you dress it with 4 external HDD drives like a christmas tree AND load the CPU with DSD512 upsampling on top). In any case - you can always switch on the Power Sense feature in the BIOS settings, which will throttle the CPU down when it senses the PSU cannot keep up.

There are many people using SBooster PSUs with the Nucleus+ with ZERO issues (no DSD512 upsampling) and those are rated @ 2A/12V.

Regular Nucleus (non-Plus) uses even less current that that.

FACTS.
 
Elberoth said:
1. Your "authentic" Nucleus uses generic Intel board. Intel specs are clear:

DC Input Voltage Supported: 12-19 VDC

There is no advantage from going with 19VDC. If anything, voltage needs to be dropped even more (MoBo subsystems work on 3.3V, 5V and 12V).

2. Power supplies are regulated. If your linear power supply can't hold the voltage at rated current, they you bought yourself a garbage, not a decent PSU. The LHY Audio PSU I have linked has zero problems supplying 4A @ 12V of instantaneous current. It is more than enough for any Nucleus.

3. Nucleus+ draws only 0.66A @ 12V while playing music in native format (no upsampling) and 0.72A @ 12V while playing music with 2x PCM upsampling and DSP switched on. At no point it will go past 2A @ 12V while using Roon (unless you dress it with 4 external HDD drives like a chrismass tree AND load the CPU with DSD512 upsampling on top). In any case - you can always switch on the Power Sense feature in the BIOS settings, which will throttle the CPU down when it senses the PSU cannot keep up.

There are many people using SBooster PSUs with the Nucleus+ with ZERO issues (no DSD512 upsampling) and those are rated @ 2A/12V.

Regular Nucleus (non-Plus) uses even less current that that.

FACTS.
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Very useful info, Adam, thanks.
 
One more thing: I'm not advocating using SB Booster 12V/2A PSU on the Nucleus+. It is perfetly fine on the Nucleus, but it may not be enough in some circumstances (heavy DSP use, either for room correction or upsampling, or both) on the Nucleus+. I just gave this example to show, that the current draw of the Nucleus is not as high as some people think it is.

If you go with w bit bigger PSU, i.e. 3A instead of 2A max, then basicly any competent 12V/3A PSU will be OK. The $200 LHY Audio I posted is rated more than that, i.e. 12V/5A max, and is more that a Nucleus+ will ever need in ANY scenario.

Spending more doesn't make any sense, as to unlock the full Nucleus potential you need to invest into a better end point, not even better PSU for the Nucleus.

If you have $1000 to spend on the Nucleus, just invest into a good end-point instead (like used SOtM sMS-200Ultra for example + LHA Audio PSU for the end-point).
 
Bad news: Intel stops producing Nucs. In future we need to change to an alternative motherboard in a fanless case, Roon Nucleus included.
 
Alkyogre said:
Bad news: Intel stops producing Nucs. In future we need to change to an alternative motherboard in a fanless case, Roon Nucleus included.
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I read that the other day and thought that it might be a good thing. Intel must realize they can't compete with all of the mini computers available today coming from China. Or Intel may have to rethink their own small form computers.
 
Darrel said:
I read that the other day and thought that it might be a good thing. Intel must realize they can't compete with all of the mini computers available today coming from China. Or Intel may have to rethink their own small form computers.
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Chinese pc's are indeed an alternative for the nuc. In fact: aliexpress has alot of clones, which also will do perfect for audio and which are already dedicated fanless. Buy one of these and you have a fanless mini pc for half the price of a nuc with Akasa case. I already tried one as Roon core and compared it with the usual fanless nuc and did not hear any difference in sound quality.
 
Outside of Intel NUC, the success of running ROCK is significantly decreased due to lack of drivers (primarily LAN, sometimes there were also BIOS issues). Successful cases are called MOCK, you'll need to search for MOCK in Roon forum.

If you want a fanless build with a powerful CPU, that'd usually be more difficult unless the box is fanless to begin with.

If you don't have to use ROCK, then you're free to use Windows or Linux (e.g. Ubuntu), but that loses the "appliance" appeal of Roon OS.

(Note: Nucleus is the same as ROCK on NUC7 but with additional thermal management for Nucleus fanless chassis.)
 
Puma Cat said:
What about this-?

ASUS Z390-I ROG Strix Gaming Intel LGA 1151 mini ITX motherboard
CPU: Intel Core i9-9900K

Press Release from Intel:
Goodbye, Intel NUCs: production stops but partners carry the torch | TechSpot
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Great idea, but good you ask this, because you made the same beginners mistake I did. The problem is the choice of the Intel Core i9-9900K. The problem is that the TDP for your core is far too high, resulting in an overheated pc. Intel has 3 core classes, the normal, the K and the T. For fanless builds a TDP below 45W is required, that means normally Intels T build processors. Secondly: an i7 will do for audio and as long you don't convert to DSD i5 and maybe i3 is also possible. But most important is that the TDP is below 45W and that it fits on the motherboard.

About the case: I did use a Streacom case for the mini ITX board, this one is perfect and there are more audio pc builders who use it FC8 – Fanless Mini-ITX Case – Streacom. With my build: with an Asus 560i gaming I had a second problem: there was a large heatsink on it which will block the assembly of the Streacom heatpipe, which could be solved with an extra Streacom HT4. That having said: I don't advise a gaming motherboard like the Asus at all. Next time I will build one I go for the brand SuperMicro. It is not the cheapest one, but perfect for audio.
 
wklie said:
Outside of Intel NUC, the success of running ROCK is significantly decreased due to lack of drivers (primarily LAN, sometimes there were also BIOS issues). Successful cases are called MOCK, you'll need to search for MOCK in Roon forum.

If you want a fanless build with a powerful CPU, that'd usually be more difficult unless the box is fanless to begin with.

If you don't have to use ROCK, then you're free to use Windows or Linux (e.g. Ubuntu), but that loses the "appliance" appeal of Roon OS.

(Note: Nucleus is the same as ROCK on NUC7 but with additional thermal management for Nucleus fanless chassis.)
Click to expand...

There is also the possibility not to install Rock at all, and install Roon on a normal linux distro. What also is possible is to buy and install audiolinux.
 
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