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  1. #1
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    Esoteric K-01XS and Mutec MC-3+ USB, did anyone try that ?

    Hello,

    I recently bough Esoteric K-01Xs and after a little while I read that it may sound better with an external clock. I
    took Mutec MC-3+USB for a start, as I also have Esoteric N-01T streaming transport, so to synch them both.

    Spent a few hours and couldn't get an idea, how to set MUTEC to pass 10MHz clock to both units. Mutec's manual is rather vegan and my experience with clock is rather dashing to zero.

    could anyone share an experience with Mutec, if anyone around has it, please.

    thank you in advance.

    Vladimir

  2. #2

    Re: Esoteric K-01XS and Mutec MC-3+ USB, did anyone try that ?

    Whilst I don’t know if Mutec MC-3 + usb meets your needs as an external clock to supply your K-01x, if you have such an expectational component as a K-01X, I would have thought you actually need is a Mutec Ref10, or better yet Mutec Ref 10 120se external clock. I doubt the Mc3 + will meet your needs ( or possibly even work) for a clock that is better than what’s already inside K-01x. Or you can also investigate Cybershaft clocks, which are sensibly priced. But I assume you already know a dealer for Mutec, then Try the Mutec REF10-120se unit.

  3. #3
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    Re: Esoteric K-01XS and Mutec MC-3+ USB, did anyone try that ?

    Thank you, Jambo. That was my fault, I was looking for that model. I found that information on some forum with other owners of Esoteric and though it is a good idea to Strat with something and then look for something bigger. Now I have to admit , it was presumably a waste of time and money, as you probably right, first it does not lock with 10mhz, only 22Mhz, what does not appropriate for N-01t, as that baby only take 10Mhz, and therefore can not be synched via USB , if K-01Xs gets 22Mhz from Mutec. Cybershaft was the one I was looking for, or another Esoteric own clock. DO you know, what is better ?

  4. #4

    Re: Esoteric K-01XS and Mutec MC-3+ USB, did anyone try that ?

    I would try to avoid esoteric own clock as they are based on Rubidium and their phase noise tends not to be good as Mutec or Cybershaft. And phase noise is very important for Audio clocks. Both the Mutec and Cybershaft would serve you well. I suspect that the Mutech will be easier to source/buy in London. The Mutec Ref10 - SE 120 is at the movement about the same performance as the Cybershaft OPA20. Which i believe it is the best clock Cybershaft can currently produce, since the OPA21 has been put on hold. The Mutec has quite few outputs, so it will be able to clock the Esoteric 01xs, the NT1 and also the mutec MC-3 and it has extra ports should come in handy should you wish to clock a network switch, example EtherRegen or some other switch which has an 10mhz clock input.

    So my inclination would be to get the Mutec REF10-120 SE. It has both 50ohm and 75ohm outputs ( Cybershaft also has switchable 50/75 ohms, but i believe it only has 3 outputs) that will come in handy to exactly match your gear and have a few spare ports should wish to drive other gear with 10mhz clock inputs.

  5. #5
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    Re: Esoteric K-01XS and Mutec MC-3+ USB, did anyone try that ?

    For what it’s worth I am clocking my N-01XD with a Cybershaft OP21A (external power supply version) with very very sweet results.

    The OP21A has four output ports. I am currently only using one, will use a second one when my Paul Hynes LPs ships to power a Mutec USB.

    The Mutec clock is certainly a good option also.

  6. #6
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    Re: Esoteric K-01XS and Mutec MC-3+ USB, did anyone try that ?

    Does it mean that I could have clock both K-01XS and N-01t from one Cybeshaft OP21A ?

  7. #7
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    Re: Esoteric K-01XS and Mutec MC-3+ USB, did anyone try that ?

    Yes

  8. #8
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    Re: Esoteric K-01XS and Mutec MC-3+ USB, did anyone try that ?

    I've taken a look at Cybershaft web page and there are other models, with single out. Would it be possible to use single out model to clock both of my units ? the thing is that I am using K-01Xs also as a DAC for N-01t via USB and in this case N-01t is taking clock from K-01Xs , as it is written on the manual, and I nowhere said, wether it could be clocked independently in such a case. I am guessing, wether I could take clock into K-01Xs and and the from it connect into N-01t ? That may also work . Am I right ?

  9. #9
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    Re: Esoteric K-01XS and Mutec MC-3+ USB, did anyone try that ?

    In your case, if you only have a single output from the clock, you should connect it to the DAC.

    Your N-03T (not N-01T as I don't think such a model exists at this time) USB output is not dependent on the external clock even if you connect one to it.
    Peter Lie
    LUMIN Firmware Lead

  10. #10
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    Re: Esoteric K-01XS and Mutec MC-3+ USB, did anyone try that ?

    thank you, for your reply, Peter. Yes, thats N-03t, my fault, I mistyped it. I am using K-01Xs as a DAC . Will I need to connect. K-01Xs and N-03t with clock cable as well or not ?

  11. #11
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    Re: Esoteric K-01XS and Mutec MC-3+ USB, did anyone try that ?

    If your clock only has a single output, connect it to the DAC.

    If your clock has multiple outputs, connect them to every compatible equipment in the whole chain. If your network switch has a compatible clock input, connect it too.
    Peter Lie
    LUMIN Firmware Lead

  12. #12
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    Re: Esoteric K-01XS and Mutec MC-3+ USB, did anyone try that ?

    Perhaps I should not post this here, blasphemy!! But I will post it anyways.... sorry if someone's feelings are hurt. My experience, mine only, it means nothing for others...

    I have an Esoteric N-01XD streaming DAC. It's the most recent model Esoteric DAC. I tried the Mutec Ref10 SE 120 with it, and even upgraded the clock cable to some very nice aftermarket clock cable. I tried it for about three weeks, everyday, many hours on weekends too. It did absolutely nothing to my music. OK... if I tried very hard, perhaps able to hear some very subtle differences, but I was not sure for good or worse. So I returned the Mutec. My experience with external clocking was not successful. YMMV
    B&W 803 D3 | T+A PA 3100 HV | Esoteric N-01XD | Esoteric P-05X | Shunyata Sigma v2 & Alpha v2 | Shunyata Everest

  13. #13
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    Re: Esoteric K-01XS and Mutec MC-3+ USB, did anyone try that ?

    wow, thx for posting your experience.
    i was close to order the n-01xd with the mutec. and would have connected them together on day 1 and would have left this untouched for years probably.

  14. #14
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    Re: Esoteric K-01XS and Mutec MC-3+ USB, did anyone try that ?

    Quote Originally Posted by u-sound View Post
    wow, thx for posting your experience.
    i was close to order the n-01xd with the mutec. and would have connected them together on day 1 and would have left this untouched for years probably.
    what did you end up ordering?

    As I mentioned, that's just my experience. it does not mean it's a universal truth. It could be my system, or my ears' sensitivity to these kind of things, a defective Mutec unit, or.... who knows.
    B&W 803 D3 | T+A PA 3100 HV | Esoteric N-01XD | Esoteric P-05X | Shunyata Sigma v2 & Alpha v2 | Shunyata Everest

  15. #15
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    Re: Esoteric K-01XS and Mutec MC-3+ USB, did anyone try that ?

    My experience with my setup , with MUtec MC-3+ USB is also not obvious. MC-3+ USB could not produce 10Mhz, despite it said on the manual it could and the only clock K-01XS accepts from Mutec is 22 or 24Mhz. Do not know, wether it is appropriate for sound quality ? I am not really experienced. Can anybody give any comments does it make sense to use that clock frequency , is it any better than built in Esoteric original clock ?

  16. #16
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    Re: Esoteric K-01XS and Mutec MC-3+ USB, did anyone try that ?

    Quote Originally Posted by pe4e4ka View Post
    My experience with my setup , with MUtec MC-3+ USB is also not obvious. MC-3+ USB could not produce 10Mhz, despite it said on the manual it could and the only clock K-01XS accepts from Mutec is 22 or 24Mhz. Do not know, wether it is appropriate for sound quality ? I am not really experienced. Can anybody give any comments does it make sense to use that clock frequency , is it any better than built in Esoteric original clock ?
    From the Esoteric K-01XS page (K-01Xs | SPECIFICATIONS | ESOTERIC:Japan high-end audio manufacturer | エソテリック )

    BNC 1
    Input impedance 50Ω
    Frequencies that can be input (±10ppm) 44.1kHz, 48kHz, 88.2kHz, 96kHz, 176.4kHz, 192kHz, 10MHz, 22.5792MHz, 24.576MHz

    My Esoteric N-01XD only accepts 10 Mhz input from a master clock:

    BNC 1
    Input frequency 10MHz (±10ppm)
    Input impedance 50Ω

    So I am not sure what you really need.

    I would email Esoteric directly, or your Esoteric distributor in your country, and ask them that question
    B&W 803 D3 | T+A PA 3100 HV | Esoteric N-01XD | Esoteric P-05X | Shunyata Sigma v2 & Alpha v2 | Shunyata Everest

  17. #17
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    Re: Esoteric K-01XS and Mutec MC-3+ USB, did anyone try that ?

    yes, I know that it should work, but whenever Mutec sends 10MHz, Esoteric says it can not lock to it, and clock sign is blinking. In the manual it says that the unit receives unacceptable clock ... kinda strange.

  18. #18
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    Re: Esoteric K-01XS and Mutec MC-3+ USB, did anyone try that ?

    Quote Originally Posted by pe4e4ka View Post
    yes, I know that it should work, but whenever Mutec sends 10MHz, Esoteric says it can not lock to it, and clock sign is blinking. In the manual it says that the unit receives unacceptable clock ... kinda strange.
    I may be mistaken on this, but I think Esoteric only accepts "master" clock. Not "word" clock. So you probably bought the wrong Mutec? I am sorry I don't know. I wish I could help. I would email Esoteric directly, or your Esoteric distributor in your country, and ask them that question
    B&W 803 D3 | T+A PA 3100 HV | Esoteric N-01XD | Esoteric P-05X | Shunyata Sigma v2 & Alpha v2 | Shunyata Everest

  19. #19
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    Re: Esoteric K-01XS and Mutec MC-3+ USB, did anyone try that ?

    thank you for your advise. I'll give It a try with local Esoteric dealer.

  20. #20
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    Re: Esoteric K-01XS and Mutec MC-3+ USB, did anyone try that ?

    Quote Originally Posted by thyname View Post
    what did you end up ordering?

    As I mentioned, that's just my experience. it does not mean it's a universal truth. It could be my system, or my ears' sensitivity to these kind of things, a defective Mutec unit, or.... who knows.
    well, if you couldnt hear any added excitement after 3 weeks, it was certainly best to skip it.
    mutec doesnt seem to be the right clock for ecoteric.

    i went with the meitner ma3, mainly because of budget reasons.

  21. #21
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    Re: Esoteric K-01XS and Mutec MC-3+ USB, did anyone try that ?

    Quote Originally Posted by pe4e4ka View Post
    My experience with my setup , with MUtec MC-3+ USB is also not obvious. MC-3+ USB could not produce 10Mhz, despite it said on the manual it could
    If I'm not mistaken, the MC-3+USB is not meant to generate (output) 10MHz on its own. It "locks to" 10MHz input only with an external 10MHz clock (e.g. in conjunction with Mutec REF10). Therefore in your setup you do not have 10MHz clock to feed the Esoteric.

    If your objective is to provide a 10MHz clock for the Esoteric, you need the REF10 (or other clocks such as Esoteric or Cybershaft), not the MC-3+USB. This has actually been stated in post #2 already.

    I believe post #18 is right in that you bought a wrong model of Mutec. If you still want to ask someone official to confirm this, you should be asking Mutec about 10MHz generation (not locking), not Esoteric.
    Peter Lie
    LUMIN Firmware Lead

  22. #22
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    Re: Esoteric K-01XS and Mutec MC-3+ USB, did anyone try that ?

    Quote Originally Posted by thyname View Post
    I have an Esoteric N-01XD streaming DAC. It's the most recent model Esoteric DAC. I tried the Mutec Ref10 SE 120 with it, and even upgraded the clock cable to some very nice aftermarket clock cable. I tried it for about three weeks, everyday, many hours on weekends too. It did absolutely nothing to my music. OK... if I tried very hard, perhaps able to hear some very subtle differences, but I was not sure for good or worse. So I returned the Mutec. My experience with external clocking was not successful. YMMV
    That's very interesting. This implies the internal clock N-01XD is good enough such that it is not necessarily bettered by an external clock or you are approaching diminishing returns.

    I recall that in another forum someone found that the same clock made a greater difference to old DAC models than newer DAC models of the same brand, so I suppose your finding is in line with that.
    Peter Lie
    LUMIN Firmware Lead

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