DAC (Re) Search

M

Mr Peabody

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St. Louis, MO, USA
What I am looking for is a solid state DAC, MQA preferrable, and less non-DAC features as possible (ie. preamp, streaming). I will also need USB to accept feed from ACS10. My budget is under $10k although I've had temptations that exceeded that. I use Tidal so I'd like to get the full MQA.

My DAC is built into my preamp. I've never compared it to anything else. I was reading an informative thread about Levinson preamps and someone commented the DAC could have been better. My urge to experiment was in mind before that. The poster thought the DAC on par with a $3k or so unit. I place importance on source so here I am. Side note, concensus was the actual preamp is really good.

Under consideration:
MSB Discrete. I have heard from a few people (not of this forum) that the Discrete is not a top contender at its price point, that MSB upper end DAC's is where it's at. I'd still like to hear one.

Weiss 501. Ruled out, too complex, I don't want to mess with all the DSP and adjustments.

N05xd. A front runner from research and the enthusiasm here. More money but I also considered the K03xd. I'd think the sound of the DAC's should be on par with each other. Either I come up with more money and have a transport or in the 05 preamp/streaming I'll likely not use, at least the transport may see some use.

Meitner M3. I need to look again I can't remember why this is not a top contender, maybe price. Looks like some top notch technology though.

I also looked at, on paper, the Holo May & T+A DAC 200. The Boulder 812 is out there but I believe it's more of a preamp.

From you any other DAC suggestions or comments on what I stated above. Very difficult to find a straight forward DAC anymore.
 
Mr Peabody said:
MSB Discrete. I have heard from a few people (not of this forum) that the Discrete is not a top contender at its price point, that MSB upper end DAC's is where it's at. I'd still like to hear one.
Click to expand...

Completely disagree. This DAC with the second PSU ($1750) hits way way above its price point.

Aside from that, we were asked by Berkeley to give their latest products a listen and we have the REF3 coming in. But perhaps their Berkeley Alpha DAC 3 is worth a look.

Agreed on the N-05xd. Amazing.

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I looked at the Alpha DAC3 but was confused on pricing, one unit showed $28k and another was slightly over $10k but I didn't see any difference in the model#. That combined with no knowledge of the brand I sort of dismissed it until you mentioned them.

I'm hoping to see some of these at AXPONA.

Correction to my OP, Meitner MA3 could be a contender, mqa & just over $10k

Mike said:
Completely disagree. This DAC with the second PSU ($1750) hits way way above its price point.

Aside from that, we were asked by Berkeley to give their latest products a listen and we have the REF3 coming in. But perhaps their Berkeley Alpha DAC 3 is worth a look.

Agreed on the N-05xd. Amazing.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
Click to expand...
 
Mr Peabody said:
I looked at the Alpha DAC3 but was confused on pricing, one unit showed $28k and another was slightly over $10k but I didn't see any difference in the model#. That combined with no knowledge of the brand I sort of dismissed it until you mentioned them.

I'm hoping to see some of these at AXPONA.

Correction to my OP, Meitner MA3 could be a contender, mqa & just over $10k
Click to expand...

It IS confusing:

Alpha DAC Series 3 is $10,995
Alpha DAC Reference Series 3 is $28,000

The N-05XD is worth considering.

MQA is a must?


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MQA I wouldn't say is a must but I would like it since I am a Tidal user. Although I don't like the idea of the extra features the N05xd is my front runner.

Are you able to say what the difference in sound is like between the Discrete and N05xd? Or the Berkeley A3 if you've heard it?

Thanks
Mike said:
It IS confusing:

Alpha DAC Series 3 is $10,995
Alpha DAC Reference Series 3 is $28,000

The N-05XD is worth considering.

MQA is a must?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
Click to expand...
 
Mr Peabody said:
MQA I wouldn't say is a must but I would like it since I am a Tidal user. Although I don't like the idea of the extra features the N05xd is my front runner.

Are you able to say what the difference in sound is like between the Discrete and N05xd? Or the Berkeley A3 if you've heard it?

Thanks
Click to expand...

To my ears, the Discrete is on another level. It has a huge big chunk of the sound of the REF and Select. Sonically, it’s very fleshed out, organic and natural. Far far removed from the typical “digital sounds” of many DAC’s.

I know this may not matter to you, but to me the MSB offers so many benefits:

- can drastically improve sound by adding the second PSU ($1750)
- modular based, so only use the inputs you need. ProUSB/ProISL and Roon Renderer are best.
- MSB’s upgrade policy. Want to one day move up to the Premier? You get 100% of your money back towards the purchase.


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I don't like how the Alpha 3 has to convert USB to one of the other inputs.

If 2 PSU can all the Discrete units be stacked on one shelf? I also saw the Discrete has to be grounded or it can void warranty, looks like the wire can go under a screw of the preamp but this gives pause for thought. My power conditioner has a ground thumb screw I wonder if that would work or if it has to be to the preamp?
 
Mr Peabody said:
What I am looking for is a solid state DAC, MQA preferrable, and less non-DAC features as possible (ie. preamp, streaming). I will also need USB to accept feed from ACS10. My budget is under $10k although I've had temptations that exceeded that. I use Tidal so I'd like to get the full MQA.

[…]

Under consideration:

[…]

Weiss 501. Ruled out, too complex, I don't want to mess with all the DSP and adjustments.

[…]

From you any other DAC suggestions or comments on what I stated above. Very difficult to find a straight forward DAC anymore.
Click to expand...

I have the DAC502 Mk1 (larger chassis version of the Mk1). You don’t have to use the DSP / preamp functions. It is equally good, if not better, as a straight DAC. I have previously posted on my comparisons with the AQUA Formula xHD and Chord DAVE.

Weiss introduced the Mk2 last year and, imo, improved on some aspects of the sound that could be perceived to be lacking.

It now has a denser / weightier midrange, deeper, punchier, bass and a bigger soundstage. Dynamics wise, it has an interesting way with the flow and ebb from soft to loud and vice-versa. Not flat sounding at all.

I have directly compared the DAC502 Mk2 with TAD DA1000TX and Soulnote S3 v2 on fairly high end systems. It is laughable (in a good sense) to see the tiny Weiss compete head to head with the impressively overbuilt TAD and Soulnote units.

This review is quite insightful (from Positive Feedback Online but syndicated from the original Polish review) - the reviewer used it as a direct DAC.

Weiss DAC502 Mk2 DAC - Positive Feedback
 
Mr Peabody said:
What I am looking for is a solid state DAC, MQA preferrable, and less non-DAC features as possible (ie. preamp, streaming). I will also need USB to accept feed from ACS10. My budget is under $10k although I've had temptations that exceeded that. I use Tidal so I'd like to get the full MQA.

.....

From you any other DAC suggestions or comments on what I stated above. Very difficult to find a straight forward DAC anymore.
Click to expand...

The Topping D90SE is a solid state balanced USB DAC with MQA capabilities. It is a "straight forward" DAC; it is cheap, actually maybe too cheap for some folks ($900 from Amazon).
At that price, you lose nothing except your time to try it out and if you like it, you will save over $9k from your budget. And you can return it for a full refund if not happy.
 
GSOphile said:
There are at least several DAC manufacturers who don't like to integrate a USB interface into their DACs for technical reasons (usually noise related). Berkeley is one. In case you haven't seen it, an excellent review of their Alpha USB Interface appeared in TAS:
Berkeley Audio Design Alpha USB Interface - The Absolute Sound
Click to expand...

Testing one now. Alpha USB and REF3 at the request of Berkeley. Gotta say, yeah, yeah, pretty freaking great.

N30SA is source.

f9a86c14d500a23c5a84cc5833c94d99.jpg



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Thanks for the link & info. I'll have to do some research, it seems a converter like Berkeley uses would be different than a USB input, the latter wouldn't have to convert it to a different digital form, would it?
GSOphile said:
There are at least several DAC manufacturers who don't like to integrate a USB interface into their DACs for technical reasons (usually noise related). Berkeley is one. In case you haven't seen it, an excellent review of their Alpha USB Interface appeared in TAS:
Berkeley Audio Design Alpha USB Interface - The Absolute Sound
Click to expand...
 
Mr Peabody said:
Thanks for the link & info. I'll have to do some research, it seems a converter like Berkeley uses would be different than a USB input, the latter wouldn't have to convert it to a different digital form, would it?
Click to expand...

FWIW, I tried direct AES AND SPDIF from the N30 to the DAC. The Alpha USB in the mix sounded more “there, there”, more presence.


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Bryan, you should really consider an Aqua La Scala with the Aqua LinQ. The DAC by itself is awesome but the linQ takes it to another level. It is a tube DAC but it only uses 2 common tubes that should last forever in a DAC. I heard one in a friend's system and in my system when he brought it over. Just smooth, musical and detailed. No fatigue whatsoever.

The Holo May KTE is another DAC to look at. I heard it in a friends system with a Pass XP22 pre and 250.8 amp. Just awesome. I am not a fan of the Holo Spring DAC though. Although I prefer the Aqua DAC with the LinQ.
 
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