Ortofon Cadenza Bronze or...?

**MikeCh** · December 15, 2013, 11:19 AM

Looking to possibly upgrade my cartridge...

How much better (or different) is the Bronze from the Dynavector 20X2H? I love the Dynavector but wonder if there is a better match for my listening which is mostly classical (90%) with some jazz, some rock & some electronic thrown in.

Will the Bronze be a suitable mate on a VPI Classic 2?

Thanks,
Mike

**Mike** · December 15, 2013, 11:24 AM

The Lyra Kleos (from Jeff at AV soulutions) has a great synergy with VPI. I very much like mine on the Classic 3. It's a very lively cartridge. Dynamic. Great balance. Good synergy with VPI IMO.

**Petro85** · December 15, 2013, 12:52 PM

Originally Posted by MikeCh

Looking to possibly upgrade my cartridge...

How much better (or different) is the Bronze from the Dynavector 20X2H? I love the Dynavector but wonder if there is a better match for my listening which is mostly classical (90%) with some jazz, some rock & some electronic thrown in.

Will the Bronze be a suitable mate on a VPI Classic 2?

Thanks,
Mike

I own a cadenza black and used to own a blue(which I ran on a classic1). And did a lot of listening to the bronze on a classic 1 and aries3.
It is a very smooth well detailed cartridge. Lists at $2200 . For the money it's an excellent cartridge.and the best I've heard in that pricerange.
It is definitely the warmest of the cadenza line. . But it's not over the top warm .just real nice. and I don't think you can go wrong with it.
I've listened to a few dynavectors they were not for me. The ones I couldn't afford were awesome though. Lol.
For some reason the Ortofon cartridges appeal to me over others. It's a personal opinion but I think they are the best value as compared to similarly priced cartridges.
I've heard the shelter, lyra and clearaudio offerings as well . I really liked the shelters and lyras too. The clearaudio I think you need to spend more money to get the same quality. My choices were the black, the kleos, or the shelter 901. All were awesome and similar quality with different sound.
But I bought the Ortofon . Good luck!!!

**MikeCh** · December 15, 2013, 05:57 PM

Originally Posted by Mike

The Lyra Kleos (from Jeff at AV soulutions) has a great synergy with VPI. I very much like mine on the Classic 3. It's a very lively cartridge. Dynamic. Great balance. Good synergy with VPI IMO.

Thanks Mike.

I don't recall where I heard it, but I remember somebody saying that the Lyra carts are not at their best in the uni-pivot arm of the Classic? Perhaps this is unfounded, but for some reason it does stick in my mind.

What other carts have you tried on your Classic?

Thanks,
Mike

**MikeCh** · December 15, 2013, 05:59 PM

Originally Posted by Petro85

I own a cadenza black and used to own a blue(which I ran on a classic1). And did a lot of listening to the bronze on a classic 1 and aries3.
It is a very smooth well detailed cartridge. Lists at $2200 . For the money it's an excellent cartridge.and the best I've heard in that pricerange.
It is definitely the warmest of the cadenza line. . But it's not over the top warm .just real nice. and I don't think you can go wrong with it.
I've listened to a few dynavectors they were not for me. The ones I couldn't afford were awesome though. Lol.
For some reason the Ortofon cartridges appeal to me over others. It's a personal opinion but I think they are the best value as compared to similarly priced cartridges.
I've heard the shelter, lyra and clearaudio offerings as well . I really liked the shelters and lyras too. The clearaudio I think you need to spend more money to get the same quality. My choices were the black, the kleos, or the shelter 901. All were awesome and similar quality with different sound.
But I bought the Ortofon . Good luck!!!

Hi Steve,

Thanks for all the great information.

What do you find that the Black does in comparison (or better than) the Bronze? If I'm going to spend this kind of money on a cartridge, perhaps going with the Black instead would be the better choice?

Thanks,
Mike

**Petro85** · December 15, 2013, 08:41 PM

Originally Posted by MikeCh

Hi Steve,

Thanks for all the great information.

What do you find that the Black does in comparison (or better than) the Bronze? If I'm going to spend this kind of money on a cartridge, perhaps going with the Black instead would be the better choice?

Thanks,
Mike

Omg the black is so good !!! It has to be the best value in cartridges in this pricerange.
At $2600 retail it's worth the extra $400 over the bronze and $800 over the blue. I was shopping for $2k-$4k range and this was my first choice. When I asked our friendly analog guru what I should buy he said cadenza black without hesitation and im so happy I did.
Can't go wrong !!

**Mike** · December 15, 2013, 08:56 PM

Mike - no issues with the unipivot arm. That being said, I would seriously talk to Jeff at AV Solutions. That guy has tried more cartridges and more arms with more tables then everyone I know, except maybe Fremer.

Mike

**Petro85** · December 15, 2013, 10:45 PM

Originally Posted by Mike

Mike - no issues with the unipivot arm. That being said, I would seriously talk to Jeff at AV Solutions. That guy has tried more cartridges and more arms with more tables then everyone I know, except maybe Fremer.

Mike

+1 Jeff is the guy I call with my questions.
Depending on music style is big too.
Where mike and me listen to some of the same stuff.
We have different tastes for the most part. The kleos might be better for him where the black is better for me.
I have heard of not being able to run a Benz well on a jmw. But I never heard that about lyras

**RSG** · December 17, 2013, 03:57 PM

If it makes you feel better there's a friend-dealer that told me in his opinion the bronze is the best cartridge he's ever heard, and he's heard at least one $6000.00 cartridge, that's why he owns one. Steve which heard the Bronze, seems to like the black a lot, and after buying his Classic 1 from with the blue which sounds beautiful. Oh year I happen to put the red on the Classic, don't even know if it's installed properly and that sounds pretty good! so guess what?! I think I'm going to take a break and listen to my CD player..! I will probably hear the bronze in my system soon and will let you know

**audio.bill** · December 17, 2013, 04:29 PM

Sorry for the delay in my response to this thread, but I've been kept busy setting up and getting used to a new Windows 8.1 PC. I own the Cadenza Bronze and have it mounted in an Origin Live Enterprise-C tonearm on a Nottingham Dais table. I chose it over the Black due to my system being solid state (Audia Flight Phono, Pre and the Rowland 625 power amp) and therefore preferred the slightly warmer tonal balance of the Bronze. The Black would be a better in my opinion most often when matched with warmer balanced tube electronics. They are both superb and offer performance well beyond their price points. I could have afforded several other more expensive cartridges, but after hearing the Cadenza Bronze in my system I knew that my search was over. I also continue to be amazed at how quiet the Bronze tracks the grooves, with virtually all of the surface noise that I thought was inherent to vinyl playback and specific records gone.

**MikeCh** · December 17, 2013, 11:17 PM

Thanks for all the great, detailed information guys. I think the Bronze might well be my next step with vinyl playback.

Mike

**MikeCh** · December 20, 2013, 06:10 PM

woops, double post

**MikeCh** · January 21, 2014, 08:10 PM

Mike (admin Mike), you have a new Bronze on the way eh? Sweet! Please let us know how it performs once you get a chance to break it in proper!!!

Thanks,
Mike

**Mike** · January 21, 2014, 08:17 PM

Originally Posted by MikeCh

Mike (admin Mike), you have a new Bronze on the way eh? Sweet! Please let us know how it performs once you get a chance to break it in proper!!!

Thanks,
Mike

Will do....I was thinking of trying the Cadenza Black, but Jeff indicated the Bronze has a tiny bit more warmth and pairs really well with the Classic 3. A friend of mine just bought the Cadenza Bronze as well and I got to listen to it. Very nice sounding cartridge. Full sound, rich, with loads of detail.

I would encourage anyone looking for anything analog/vinyl related to call Jeff at AV Solutions. He has tried them all!

**Petro85** · January 21, 2014, 08:46 PM

Originally Posted by Mike

Will do....I was thinking of trying the Cadenza Black, but Jeff indicated the Bronze has a tiny bit more warmth and pairs really well with the Classic 3. A friend of mine just bought the Cadenza Bronze as well and I got to listen to it. Very nice sounding cartridge. Full sound, rich, with loads of detail.

I would encourage anyone looking for anything analog/vinyl related to call Jeff at AV Solutions. He has tried them all!

congrats mike!!!! your gonna love the ortofon. for some reason i was against buying an ortofon cartridge, not sure of the reason. but once i heard them i was hooked.
i think the best post in this thread was audio bill who said the warmth of the bronze suits his solid state gear well, and the black is better for tubes.
when i heard the bronze several times it was on a tube system, and it was extra warm.i thought way too warm for my hovland/snapper/faber setup.which already leans very warm and liquidy. i later heard it on solid state gear in a different location and was thoroughly impressed. any of the ortofon cadenza line is just a damn good buy, and great lineup of cartridges. i may not have heard loads of the newer gear thats out there, but ive heard most of the cartridges now, and would be hard pressed to honestly tell you to buy anything else.
ummm im going to hear a lyra etna in couple weeks!!!!! lmao!!! cant wait for that.

i might fall in love again, but thats $7k of love. yikes!!!

**cmalak** · January 21, 2014, 09:34 PM

Where does the new Ortofon Quintet series fall relative to Cadenza (above or below): Products - Cartridges - The Quintet series

From the body etc...looks like it's their entry level MC carts now (maybe replacing the Rondo line of old)??

Jeff (A/V Solutions)....have you heard these? Any thoughts?

**A/V Solutions** · January 21, 2014, 09:45 PM

Originally Posted by cmalak

Where does the new Ortofon Quintet series fall relative to Cadenza (above or below): Products - Cartridges - The Quintet series

From the body etc...looks like it's their entry level MC carts now (maybe replacing the Rondo line of old)??

Jeff (A/V Solutions)....have you heard these? Any thoughts?

The Quintet replaces the Rondo series......haven't had the chance to listen to the Quintet but will do so shortly.

**cmalak** · January 21, 2014, 09:48 PM

Jeff...thanks for the response. That's what I figured.

**MikeCh** · February 11, 2014, 08:39 PM

Cadenza Bronze it is! Verbal order is now placed, should be here in a couple of weeks. Yay...

**Petro85** · February 11, 2014, 08:43 PM

congrats mike!!!! youll be really happy with it.

**Petro85** · February 11, 2014, 11:48 PM

refresh my memory, what kind of table you have mike?

**MikeCh** · February 12, 2014, 01:29 AM

Hi Steve,

VPI Classic 2.

**Petro85** · February 12, 2014, 10:15 AM

nice should be a great setup!!!! ortofons dont take too long. like a week from europe and a few days from the dealer to you. you should be spinning soon. i mentioned this to you before, but even though they say it takes 50 hours for break in, im on my second cadenza and i think its more like 100 to be at its best.

**MikeCh** · February 13, 2014, 10:17 PM

Originally Posted by Petro85

nice should be a great setup!!!! ortofons dont take too long. like a week from europe and a few days from the dealer to you. you should be spinning soon. i mentioned this to you before, but even though they say it takes 50 hours for break in, im on my second cadenza and i think its more like 100 to be at its best.

Hi Steve,

With previous carts I've had here the 50-100 hour mark seems about right for most. I'll try to be patient....

**MikeCh** · February 18, 2014, 10:46 PM

....be patient. ....be patient.

**Petro85** · February 18, 2014, 10:51 PM

awesome mike, between you and other mike id like to see some reviews on this bronze, both should be breaking them in at the same time. cadenzas are all incredible cartridges

**MikeCh** · February 18, 2014, 11:02 PM

Pretty excited to get it here Steve. Will report the progress as I get along with it.

**Petro85** · February 19, 2014, 12:18 AM

sweet. what cartridge are you replacing?

**MikeCh** · February 19, 2014, 12:41 AM

Dynavector 20X2H is what's currently been playing here.

**Mike** · February 19, 2014, 01:14 AM

Originally Posted by Petro85

awesome mike, between you and other mike id like to see some reviews on this bronze, both should be breaking them in at the same time. cadenzas are all incredible cartridges

I sure will Steve once I get my Tonearm repaired.....don't ask.

**Petro85** · February 19, 2014, 11:36 AM

omg!!! i gotta ask, what happened??

**dlb2** · February 20, 2014, 12:43 PM

Originally Posted by Petro85

omg!!! i gotta ask, what happened??

Yeah Mike, what's up? Were you playing hockey in the house again and take it out with a flying puck?

**dlb2** · February 20, 2014, 12:45 PM

Originally Posted by MikeCh

Dynavector 20X2H is what's currently been playing here.

Mike, what do you think of the 20X2?

**MikeCh** · February 20, 2014, 01:14 PM

Doug, the 20X2H is a darn fine cartridge for the money. It tracks extremely well and sounds great, however I've read so much good about the Bronze that I just have to hear it too. I'm unsure what the differences will be between the Dynavector and the Ortofon, so I'm excited to compare them.

I plan to keep the 20X2H as my backup once the Cadenza Bronze arrives since it works so well with the Classic 2.

**dlb2** · February 20, 2014, 01:23 PM

Originally Posted by MikeCh

Doug, the 20X2H is a darn fine cartridge for the money. It tracks extremely well and sounds great, however I've read so much good about the Bronze that I just have to hear it too. I'm unsure what the differences will be between the Dynavector and the Ortofon, so I'm excited to compare them.

I plan to keep the 20X2H as my backup once the Cadenza Bronze arrives since it works so well with the Classic 2.

Thanks Mike. I've heard lots of good things about that cartridge. I've been looking at the 17D3 Karat too.

There are so many cartridges out there, and so little time!

**audio.bill** · February 20, 2014, 04:13 PM

Originally Posted by dlb2

Thanks Mike. I've heard lots of good things about that cartridge. I've been looking at the 17D3 Karat too.

There are so many cartridges out there, and so little time!

The Dynavector 17D3 is another interesting choice worthy of consideration, but I suggest that you check one out first hand before purchasing. It provides a very clean and detailed perspective on the sound, at least partially due to its extremely short cantilever design. Such a short cantilever can make setup and stylus cleaning a bit of a challenge, but many users find it to be a worthwhile tradeoff for the performance level that it offers.

**Petro85** · February 20, 2014, 09:01 PM

Originally Posted by dlb2

Mike, what do you think of the 20X2?

i heard it , good cartridge, bronze will make you forget all about it.lol.

**MikeCh** · February 20, 2014, 09:10 PM

Originally Posted by Petro85

i heard it , good cartridge, bronze will make you forget all about it.lol.

That is the hope from here!

However, given that I can be a klutz at times, the 20X2H will remain as a fall back for sure.

**MikeCh** · February 26, 2014, 12:14 AM

The Bronze was delivered to me today.

**dlb2** · February 26, 2014, 08:56 AM

Originally Posted by MikeCh

The Bronze was delivered to me today.

Awesome!

**Petro85** · February 26, 2014, 11:36 AM

nice! let us know what you think!

**MikeCh** · February 28, 2014, 09:49 AM

Originally Posted by Petro85

nice! let us know what you think!

Roger.

**MikeCh** · March 7, 2014, 12:40 AM

Bronze is mounted and playing today. Been thru four and working on five LP's now. Letting it break in.

So far, the sound has been a bit brittle, then very smooth and well rounded, then bright, then brittle, then somewhat smooth, etc.

Figure I'll just play 10 or more LP's and listen occasionally, but not seriously until it softens up some and catches it's stride.

Once again, it seems to boil down to PATIENCE!

**MikeCh** · March 7, 2014, 05:33 PM

On the 9th or 10th record now and the cartridge is starting to become smoother now.

edit: 14 records in and this cartridge is just exceptional! Strings, horns and woodwinds are presented with amazing accuracy/clarity and with all the right weight and timbre.

**Mike** · March 9, 2014, 10:47 AM

After a major mishap and two weeks waiting for repairs on my tonearm (big thank you to Jeff!!), I setup my new Ortofon Cadenza Bronze on my VPI Classic 3 last night. I spent a good deal of time listening last night and since 8am this morning. Like any new cartridge, it needs time to break in. The sound is a little compressed, but I can hear it getting a little better with each LP.

This is definitely one quiet tracker. The sound is one notch to the side of warmth (which is exactly what I like). It is certainly a little more laid back then the Kleos. The Kleos is a very quick, dynamic sounding cartridge.

I noticed that the tracking force is set a little higher with the Ortofon vs the Lyra.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

**Petro85** · March 9, 2014, 12:07 PM

Originally Posted by MikeCh

On the 9th or 10th record now and the cartridge is starting to become smoother now.

edit: 14 records in and this cartridge is just exceptional! Strings, horns and woodwinds are presented with amazing accuracy/clarity and with all the right weight and timbre.

Originally Posted by Mike

After a major mishap and two weeks waiting for repairs on my tonearm (big thank you to Jeff!!), I setup my new Ortofon Cadenza Bronze on my VPI Classic 3 last night. I spent a good deal of time listening last night and since 8am this morning. Like any new cartridge, it needs time to break in. The sound is a little compressed, but I can hear it getting a little better with each LP.

This is definitely one quiet tracker. The sound is one notch to the side of warmth (which is exactly what I like). It is certainly a little more laid back then the Kleos. The Kleos is a very quick, dynamic sounding cartridge.

I noticed that the tracking force is set a little higher with the Ortofon vs the Lyra.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

big congrats to both Mikes!!! smooth is what this cadenza line is all about . sounds awesome at 50 hours but at its best around 100 hours. i was always a big fan of tracking heavy at first to break the cartridge in quicker, but Jeff told me to stop doing that i might hurt the suspension. which i listened to him because i never thought of that.lol. for both the blue on the jmw arm and the black on the ortofon arm, i found they sound best at about 2.5g but after the first 50 hours on both i backed off to about 2.3g and believe the best all around setting for me is right where it is now weighing in at 2.35g.
enjoy your new cartridges and give us a little review after its broke in!!

**MikeCh** · March 12, 2014, 01:08 AM

Hi Steve,

I'm tracking at 2.52g since the start (just checked again tonight and it's not wavered) and holy cow, this cartridge just produces beautiful music with remarkable acuity. I'm impressed.

**dlb2** · March 12, 2014, 08:09 AM

Glad to hear you guys like the new carts. I'm running a Delos and at times think about having something a bit more laid back. I'll keep this line in mind when thinking about a replacement.

**Petro85** · March 12, 2014, 09:49 AM

glad to hear that, the value you get with these ortofon cartridges is outstanding. the only cartridges i heard that i liked better than my black, i cant afford.

**MikeCh** · March 15, 2014, 09:41 AM

Something I thought I'd share about this Cadenza cartridge:

I had/have plans to purchase a dedicated mono cart + additional JMW 10.5 arm as a primary while listening to these mono LP's....but now I'm wondering if I should.

Reason? The Cadenza Bronze is fantastic in this role. Not only does it track them well, in many cases there is far less surface noise than I've heard with other stereo carts I've had in the past. Makes me wonder if the stylus profile isn't tracking the groove walls in a manner that these old LP's have never experienced? Even with records that visually look like they'd have lots of pops and clicks due to hairline scratches, sleeve scuffs, etc. from the old paper sleeves, many of them are extremely silent when tracked with this stylus.

Last night I listened to three different Al Hirt mono RCA pressings and was just amazed at how great they all sounded....and with quiet backgrounds to boot.

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