Cables? What Brand/Model do you use?

**joeinid** · January 1, 2019, 04:12 PM

I'm not looking for trouble

but curious what you guys are using and why?

After rearranging my gear, I went to different brands/models of cables that are shorter in length.

Long story short, no pun intended, the sound is different.

I'll save the results for later after some cable swaps. Later tonight I will go back to what I was using. I'll see if what I hear now is better or worse than what I had before. It's certainly different.

Thoughts?

**jdandy** · January 1, 2019, 04:27 PM

Oh, no! Another cable thread.

**joeinid** · January 1, 2019, 04:29 PM

Look away Dan, for your own sanity

**Oly** · January 1, 2019, 04:35 PM

I think it’s good to swap cables now and then to see if there might be something better (or different). It’s also a good excuse to do some dusting in the back of the rack.

**Mikado463** · January 1, 2019, 04:47 PM

Joe, different cable length alone can/will have an effect on capacitance which in turn can effect amplifier-speaker interaction .....ie sound.

**mep** · January 1, 2019, 04:52 PM

Joe-What do you possibly expect to learn from this thread?

**joeinid** · January 1, 2019, 04:53 PM

Originally Posted by Mikado463

Joe, different cable length alone can/will have an effect on capacitance which in turn can effect amplifier-speaker interaction .....ie sound.

Interesting, I hope for XLR it's not that big a deal. I think that's why I try and keep everything as short as possible. Some of my interconnects changed but not the speaker cables. I want to experiment tonight, if I can get some time.

**joeinid** · January 1, 2019, 04:53 PM

Originally Posted by mep

Joe-What do you possibly expect to learn from this thread?

Absolutely nothing.

Are the Viero Cables still available?

**Paul** · January 1, 2019, 05:09 PM

Joe. With extreme high efficiency speakers like we have, we need cables that store the least amount of energy. Something like Duelund , 47Labs kit ( which I’m shopping for ) or audience cables.

**mep** · January 1, 2019, 05:16 PM

Originally Posted by joeinid

Absolutely nothing.

Are the Viero Cables still available?

Nope. He went out of business very quickly.

**mep** · January 1, 2019, 05:27 PM

Originally Posted by Paul

Joe. With extreme high efficiency speakers like we have, we need cables that store the least amount of energy. Something like Duelund , 47Labs kit ( which I’m shopping for ) or audience cables.

Where did you learn that a piece of wire can store energy?

**PMCH** · January 1, 2019, 05:29 PM

For me the act of unplugging and replugging in different or the same cables always seems like an improvement. Just getting a better contact makes a difference. Cleaning my contacts on the ends of my cables makes an improvement. I always tell myself to do it but I never get around to it.

**joeinid** · January 1, 2019, 05:44 PM

Originally Posted by mep

Nope. He went out of business very quickly.

I’m sorry to see that.

**Jack** · January 1, 2019, 05:52 PM

Joe

If you're in the mood for experimenting might be a good time to contact your local cable "neighbor" as he shows with Volti and uses Volti modded Khorns at home. You can go by the shop and pick them up. Made to the length you need if you like the samples.

**Mike** · January 1, 2019, 06:28 PM

Cables are all about balance. I’ve spent months finding the right balance in my system. Here it is:

Shunyata Sigma NR 20amp IEC 1.75m from wall outlet to AQ Niagra 5000.
Amp has AQ Hurricane HC - 2M
Preamp has AQ Hurricane Source - 2M
DAC has AQ Hurricane Source - 2M
Phonostage has AQ Hurricane Source - 2M
Speakers have Shunyata Sigma NR - 1.75m
All IC’s are AQ Earth except for Phono which is Shunyata Phono cable and AQ Earth back to preamp
USB is Shunyata Sigma
Speaker cables are Shunyata Sigma NR

I have tried numerous other combinations. But this is a BALANCE I consider “perfect” for me.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

**joeinid** · January 1, 2019, 06:31 PM

Originally Posted by Jack

Joe

If you're in the mood for experimenting might be a good time to contact your local cable "neighbor" as he shows with Volti and uses Volti modded Khorns at home. You can go by the shop and pick them up. Made to the length you need if you like the samples.

Excellent idea. At least they will give me another point of reference. Thank you for reminding me.

**joeinid** · January 1, 2019, 06:32 PM

Originally Posted by Mike

Cables are all about balance. I’ve spent months finding the right balance in my system. Here it is:

Shunyata Sigma NR 20amp IEC 1.75m from wall outlet to AQ Niagra 5000.
Amp has AQ Hurricane HC - 2M
Preamp has AQ Hurricane Source - 2M
DAC has AQ Hurricane Source - 2M
Phonostage has AQ Hurricane Source - 2M
Speakers have Shunyata Sigma NR - 1.75m
All IC’s are AQ Earth except for Phono which is Shunyata Phono cable and AQ Earth back to preamp
USB is Shunyata Sigma
Speaker cables are Shunyata Sigma NR

I have tried numerous other combinations. But this is a BALANCE I consider “perfect” for me.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thank you for posting this Mike.

**jadedavid** · January 1, 2019, 06:43 PM

Originally Posted by Mike

Cables are all about balance. I’ve spent months finding the right balance in my system. Here it is:

Shunyata Sigma NR 20amp IEC 1.75m from wall outlet to AQ Niagra 5000.
Amp has AQ Hurricane HC - 2M
Preamp has AQ Hurricane Source - 2M
DAC has AQ Hurricane Source - 2M
Phonostage has AQ Hurricane Source - 2M
Speakers have Shunyata Sigma NR - 1.75m
All IC’s are AQ Earth except for Phono which is Shunyata Phono cable and AQ Earth back to preamp
USB is Shunyata Sigma
Speaker cables are Shunyata Sigma NR

I have tried numerous other combinations. But this is a BALANCE I consider “perfect” for m

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Has this "recipe" been tried on more than one system?

**audio.bill** · January 1, 2019, 07:04 PM

Originally Posted by mep

Where did you learn that a piece of wire can store energy?

I think Paul would be referring to a cable's capacitance.

**Sean** · January 1, 2019, 07:37 PM

Interested to hear what you find out for your system, Joe.

All Shunyata Venom cabling for me. Seems to pair well with my stuff.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

**Mike** · January 1, 2019, 07:50 PM

Originally Posted by jadedavid

Has this "recipe" been tried on more than one system?

Nope.

**GSOphile** · January 1, 2019, 07:58 PM

Originally Posted by Mike

Cables are all about balance. I’ve spent months finding the right balance in my system. Here it is:

Shunyata Sigma NR 20amp IEC 1.75m from wall outlet to AQ Niagra 5000.
Amp has AQ Hurricane HC - 2M
Preamp has AQ Hurricane Source - 2M
DAC has AQ Hurricane Source - 2M
Phonostage has AQ Hurricane Source - 2M
Speakers have Shunyata Sigma NR - 1.75m
All IC’s are AQ Earth except for Phono which is Shunyata Phono cable and AQ Earth back to preamp
USB is Shunyata Sigma
Speaker cables are Shunyata Sigma NR

I have tried numerous other combinations. But this is a BALANCE I consider “perfect” for me.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Mike, do you run everything off your Niagra?

**still-one** · January 1, 2019, 08:02 PM

I am using Transparent Opus on my amps and pre-amp. For the most part using a mix of Shunyata Alpha (HC, NR, Digital) on my dCS gear.

**joeinid** · January 1, 2019, 08:13 PM

Okay, lately I’ve been using Belden 8402 between amp and preamp (both rca and xlr depending on gear) and some Duelund from my source or rca Belden depending on preamp. Since moving the gear to one rack, I switched to Siltech. I absolutely loved Siltech with all my other speakers especially Studio2 and 4367. With the Duo XD, instantly the Siltech was just too much of a good thing.

I just went back to Belden between amp and preamp and everything went back to what I am used to hearing and more of what I like.

So, it pays to experiment. Don’t assume it’s a speaker or piece of gear that you don’t like or think is not performing well. Everything matters.

**Jack** · January 1, 2019, 08:19 PM

Joe

Have you tried all Belden or all Dueland if you have enough of each?

**joeinid** · January 1, 2019, 08:27 PM

Originally Posted by Jack

Joe

Have you tried all Belden or all Dueland if you have enough of each?

I have to mix a little of both for now but it’s not too bad price-wise to order a little more. I tried them as an experiment and like them both. Plus they don’t break the bank.

**Jack** · January 1, 2019, 08:42 PM

I don't have but the one pair of Belden so I just use it between the amp and preamp in the Family Room system. I am using all Dueland XLR in the main system with the SC and PC's from TWL and it is a good balance and better than inserting the Dueland SC's. If you don't mind rolling your own, which won't take but about a half hour, you can order the 12 gauge Dueland speaker cable from Parts Connexion and make a two meter pair for $160 with bare ends.

**Mechnutt** · January 1, 2019, 09:01 PM

I am budget minded and like bang for the buck cables. I prefer to put money towards my electronics and speakers.

I use the Belden 8402 XLRs and love them. I also use a pair of AQ 72v DBS Columbia XLR's. Power cables by PSA and Cullen.

Speaker wire-10g belden but I am planning on upgrading to Analysis Plus.

mauidan · January 1, 2019, 09:08 PM

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**jadedavid** · January 1, 2019, 09:12 PM

Originally Posted by joeinid

Okay, lately I’ve been using Belden 8402 between amp and preamp (both rca and xlr depending on gear) and some Duelund from my source or rca Belden depending on preamp. Since moving the gear to one rack, I switched to Siltech. I absolutely loved Siltech with all my other speakers especially Studio2 and 4367. With the Duo XD, instantly the Siltech was just too much of a good thing.

I just went back to Belden between amp and preamp and everything went back to what I am used to hearing and more of what I like.

So, it pays to experiment. Don’t assume it’s a speaker or piece of gear that you don’t like or think is not performing well. Everything matters.

I and 3 others passed around a set of Dueland IC's and SC's to try in our individual systems. Then we compared our results.
To a man we all felt the Dueland to be on the darker side with a slight roll off of the treble.
On a brighter, lively type speaker they might bring a good balance. On a more neutral/warmer type speaker they were somewhat oppressive.
The Belden IC's when tried by several of us were found to be fairly neutral.
It just goes to show that not one particular wire will win out in every system.
Mixing cables has been found to bring out the best results in our test over a single mfg's "loom".
Your results may vary.

**Mr Peabody** · January 1, 2019, 11:24 PM

I'm using a loom of Clarus, Drimson. I probably should experiment more. It can get expensive though if no shops around to lend cable items.

I'm curious if anyone has tried Clarus? There in FL. I'm not sure what the exact relationship to Tributaries is, either owned by same company or same rep. Tributaries is decent in it's range. Clarus makes Aqua and Crimson, I didn't care much for Aqua but the Crimson is really good.

I've used Transparent, more entry level, and have it on the HT side now. I've had Siltech, found the different series can really vary in sound character. Also, had a loom of AntiCable for a while. AC can really be good in some systems, very pristine sound but wasn't great in some of my friend's systems when I let them try it.

I've had some Analysis PLus in my system and they would be on my list if experimenting. I like how they sound, very natural.

I also played with Wire World that I liked.

I've used BlueJeans which is Belden, they are decent but head to head with most of the above they didn't hold up. However, when trying a set of Zu Speakers they suggested a regular type cable opposed to exotic. I shouldn't say, "didn't hold u", I didn't prefer them over the competitor.

Now, though, Belden had entered the more expensive, very expensive, range. I did get to try a set of speaker cables, they were sort of square shape, I really didn't like them at all. Seemed to have no bass but the midrange was really detailed. I wish I could remember the name, Exolink or something like that.

**Jack** · January 1, 2019, 11:53 PM

Mr P

Clarus and Tributaries are both owned by the Gordon Gow Technologies. I always identified Tributaries as installer cables and they are big in the Auto Audio and HT installer circuit. Both the Clarus cables and AA's Pangea cables are designed by Jay Vincent and the Aqua line even looks a lot like the Pangea cables. Whether the materials or geometries are the same who knows. Also thought the expensive McIntosh branded cables were also re-branded Tributaries cables which makes sense sense Gow is a former Mc employee as is the CEO of Tributaries Joe Perfito.

**kzhtoo** · January 2, 2019, 03:09 AM

MIT EVO One SC and IC. SC was a revelation when they were first inserted cold.
AQ Hurricane HC/Source on INT, DAC and from wall to Denali.
Shunyata Alpha Digital on sub and pre/pro.

**gadawg** · January 2, 2019, 08:14 AM

MIT Oracle SC and IC
Transparent Reference Power

Had Shunyata Sigma SC and Anaconda IC but in my system the MIT was much more open sounding and had greater presence along with better harmonics. I agree that it is all about balance and system synergy along with our own preferences.

George

**aKnyght** · January 2, 2019, 08:39 AM

alp-tone audio alp.wE series IC and SC

i preferred their wE series cables which are made with western electric conductors over the Sn series which is duelund -- was just a bit more lively/dynamic in my system.

**Shadowfax** · January 2, 2019, 08:43 AM

My main rig uses Synergistic Research Kaleidoscope ICs and Speaker wire, because that was what came with the rest of the gear when I bought it all.

I have one pair of Groneburg ICs that came with my Stratos Amp which I tamed a bright system with between an OPPO93 and Rotel 1052.

I have a few pairs of AudioQuest Sidewinders in 2 meter lengths for a few things.

Almost all my other cables are Tara Labs. My secondary system uses Prism speaker cables and Original "S" cables.

Then I have several other Tara cables in the Quantum series from 22s, 33, CX, and a few others.

Power cables include PS Audio, Pangia, and Cullen

**jadedavid** · January 2, 2019, 09:05 AM

Originally Posted by aKnyght

alp-tone audio alp.wE series IC and SC

i preferred their wE series cables which are made with western electric conductors over the Sn series which is duelund -- was just a bit more lively/dynamic in my system.

I/we, found the same thing between WE and Dueland IC's.
I think it might have to do with the oil impregnation that Dueland treats it's cables with.

**Al M.** · January 2, 2019, 09:21 AM

ZenWave Audio D4 ICs throughout, and SMSG speaker cables. If you want outrageous resolution of microdetail, such as every little friction of bow against strings on solo violin, or the complex silky sheen on orchestral massed violins, this is a cable that will satisfy you for a not outrageous price. Tonal balance is neutral (I don't like to adjust tonal balance with cables), and the music comes through as refined, or wild and rough, as it is. Midrange is neither thinned out nor thickened, bass is killer in terms of definition. Perhaps it's overkill, but I also use the ZenWave D4 ICs for my JL Audio subs.

**UltraFast69** · January 2, 2019, 09:52 AM

I began with Nordost and worked my way through their line finishing at Valhalla 2 for power, interconnect and speaker and added their QRT power foundation no regrets other then it was a small fortune.

I also run an Ansuz C2 power cable into the server, and have some A2’s on the sideline along with a C2 interconnect.

I am so far into this, I am not changing, trading, buying or selling.

Shunyata offers nice ways to address incoming power and builds an excellent cable as well as Audioquest with the Niagara conditioners and the Dragon and Hurricane which seem to draw interest here and other places.

Transparent offers some nice stuff and has the largest presence here in the Northwest, and odd that Shunyata who is based here has close to, if not zero play.

In short they are all too expensive but seem to work better in looms (safe) or carefully selected brand choices to match (try before you buy).

In short the following names would draw my interest if I were to start again;

Nordost
Ansuz
Shunyata
Audioquest
Transparent
Audience

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

**Mr Peabody** · January 2, 2019, 10:55 AM

Same here, it cost so much for the loom I have it keeps me from doing much swapping and experimenting.

Originally Posted by UltraFast69

I began with Nordost and worked my way through their line finishing at Valhalla 2 for power, interconnect and speaker and added their QRT power foundation no regrets other then it was a small fortune.

I also run an Ansuz C2 power cable into the server, and have some A2’s on the sideline along with a C2 interconnect.

I am so far into this, I am not changing, trading, buying or selling.

Shunyata offers nice ways to address incoming power and builds an excellent cable as well as Audioquest with the Niagara conditioners and the Dragon and Hurricane which seem to draw interest here and other places.

Transparent offers some nice stuff and has the largest presence here in the Northwest, and odd that Shunyata who is based here has close to, if not zero play.

In short they are all too expensive but seem to work better in looms (safe) or carefully selected brand choices to match (try before you buy).

In short the following names would draw my interest if I were to start again;

Nordost
Ansuz
Shunyata
Audioquest
Transparent
Audience

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

**Mr Peabody** · January 2, 2019, 10:58 AM

It's hard to believe Western Electric has so much NOS wire.

A friend of mine read the Western Electric was really good, he ordered some bulk to make some power cables, they way outperformed his Signal. So he now has pretty much all Western Electric cabling, DIY, accept areas he couldn't make like USB, Ethernet, etc.

**joeinid** · January 2, 2019, 11:10 AM

The Western Electric cables are outstanding. Must be the formulation, obviously. But they seemed to be in their stride back in the day.

**FDPDK** · January 2, 2019, 12:04 PM

Well , before i started to consider what brad i was going for i have 3 that came to my mind.
Ansuz
AudioQuest
NordOst
And then i started to figure out if there was dealers near me that would let me try them out in my own system for free.
Then it quickly was down to NordOst , and have had most of there line up to V2 on loan , Power cables - Interconnect - Speaker cables
And right now i am Using Frey 2 for power cables with an QB 4 distribution box.
Next up will be speaker cables ( Frey 2 )and hopefully V2 at a later stage as they where a revelation.
Also did try Interconnect but don't think there is much gain there so they will be the last upgrade.

Had also tried their Ethernet cables , but was mixed on what they did , so for know i just upgraded from AudioQuest Cinnamon to Vodka.

**nc42acc** · January 2, 2019, 12:28 PM

All JPS Labs here. Aluminata XLR interconnects, SC3 BiWire speaker cables, Kaptovator on the amps. Curious Cable regen link USB. Furutech DIY on the rest.

**alp-tone** · January 2, 2019, 01:20 PM

Originally Posted by Mr Peabody

It's hard to believe Western Electric has so much NOS wire.

A friend of mine read the Western Electric was really good, he ordered some bulk to make some power cables, they way outperformed his Signal. So he now has pretty much all Western Electric cabling, DIY, accept areas he couldn't make like USB, Ethernet, etc.

NOS from 1950s era manufacture has been bought-up a while ago and is now is pretty much non-existent. What there is available online from this vintage is mostly salvage (careful if buying as there have been reports of counterfeit WE wire coming from China).

There is still some stock around that a prior incarnation of the re-established Western Electric had manufactured to the exact same specs as the original WE KS-13385 Audio Transmission Wire. This is great wire and, arguably, better than the original given modern manufacturing precision.

**alp-tone** · January 2, 2019, 01:43 PM

Originally Posted by joeinid

The Western Electric cables are outstanding. Must be the formulation, obviously. But they seemed to be in their stride back in the day.

The magic is in the tinned-copper!

In the early 1900s wire manufacturers began tin-plating copper wire to protect it from oxidation. So, the benefits in audio applications were, perhaps, a happy accident. (If interested, there is a little more history here: https://alp-tone.com/sn-cu-conductors.html)

Also, others swear by PVC as a dielectric versus PTFE/Teflon.

**ptman** · January 2, 2019, 01:50 PM

I've been running Thales interconnect and speaker cables for the past several years. For the money, they have a transparency that I've yet to beat with more expensive cables. All power cables are Waveform Fidelity. They were a significant benefit to my system, providing more "oomph" to the music, dynamics and response time. My digital cable is from Stealth cables, and is a good match to the rest of the loom.

The upgrade of cables to my present loom presented a significant improvement to my system. I'll continue to audition cables in the future, and will not hesitate to upgrade if the improvement is clear and right from my ears. System sound and clarity are a personal choice.

**nicoff** · January 2, 2019, 06:55 PM

Originally Posted by alp-tone

The magic is in the tinned-copper!

In the early 1900s wire manufacturers began tin-plating copper wire to protect it from oxidation. So, the benefits in audio applications were, perhaps, a happy accident. (If interested, there is a little more history here: https://alp-tone.com/sn-cu-conductors.html)

Also, others swear by PVC as a dielectric versus PTFE/Teflon.

I understand that the Duelund uses the same technique: tin-plated copper.

**Rob** · January 2, 2019, 11:31 PM

Always Transparent Ultra.

**Mechnutt** · January 3, 2019, 11:52 AM

Is any one using Duelund 12g wire for speaker cables? I am thinking about giving it a try. I was wondering how they sound.

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