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  1. #51
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Great posts, very much enjoyed this and I hope the new home and room work out as well.
    Mike

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  2. #52
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike View Post
    Thanks Ralph. I found this interesting article:

    onhifi.com -- Features Archives


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

    Thanks Mike,

    That was an interesting read.

    I don't agree with Wes's suggestion that:

    "Records and books in shelves -- especially if you resist the urge to stuff 'em into a solid mass -- break up the sidewall reflections. Think of them as diffusers".

    A good diffusor not only changes the reflections to propagate in different directions, but does so EVENLY in all directions and books and record covers certainly don't do that. Further, Wes obviously has not grasped that books if anything will be more absorptive than reflective at any but the highest frequencies.

  3. #53
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Quote Originally Posted by hoosiertom View Post
    Ralph,

    It's great to see you've brought over to Audioshark your Audio-Enz postings. We're all amazed and appreciative of your sharing your audio journey so generously. Best of luck with your new home and listening/music room.

    All the best,

    Tom
    SE MI



    Quote Originally Posted by mgalusha View Post
    Great posts, very much enjoyed this and I hope the new home and room work out as well.

    Thanks very much guys.

    The prospect that the new audio room may deliver the best audio experience I’ve witnessed at home [without changing hardware] is really exciting.

  4. #54
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Great read. Thanks so much for sharing. What a year of experimenting.

    Raidho speakers just have a quality to them that others don't give you.
    Jock

    If you have integrity, nothing else matters. If you don't have integrity, nothing else matters.

    ---------

    House: Naim ND555/2PS, Naim 552, Naim 500, Studer A80/Doshi V3, Magico M2s, 2 Magico Q-Sub 15s, Lumina IC/SC, Shunyata Everest and Omega PCs.

    Workshop: Naim ND555/2 PS, VAC Master Pre, VAC Sig 200iQ, Border Patrol pre/power, Avant Garde Duo Mezzo XD, 2 Magico Q-Sub 15s, Shunyata IC/SC, Shunyata Typhon QR/Triton V3/Sigma PCs.

  5. #55
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Quote Originally Posted by the professor View Post
    Great read. Thanks so much for sharing. What a year of experimenting.

    Raidho speakers just have a quality to them that others don't give you.

    Thanks Jock, I am pleased you enjoyed the read.

    Yes, I agree with you, the Raidhos do have a special quality – a quality which is compelling enough to make them keepers for me.

    You may have read earlier in the thread how I believe that “loudspeakers are the keepers of music.” The tremendous ability that music has to affect and manipulate emotions and the brain is undeniable, and yet largely inexplicable – and also inexplicable is how Raidho simply manages to trigger (for me at least) a greater emotional response to musical content vs. other loudspeakers at similar price points. To me, it is not about HiFi which the likes of Magico arguably do better or about massive dynamic abilities which are often ascribed to the legendary Wilsons – rather it is about a higher goal – which is to enjoy and appreciate the connection to the composer’s or songwriter’s intent and to capture the essence and life of the music and I feel the team at Raidho Acoustics have nailed this goal.

  6. #56
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Quote Originally Posted by kiwi_1282001 View Post
    Thanks Jock, I am pleased you enjoyed the read.

    Yes, I agree with you, the Raidhos do have a special quality – a quality which is compelling enough to make them keepers for me.

    You may have read earlier in the thread how I believe that “loudspeakers are the keepers of music.” The tremendous ability that music has to affect and manipulate emotions and the brain is undeniable, and yet largely inexplicable – and also inexplicable is how Raidho simply manages to trigger (for me at least) a greater emotional response to musical content vs. other loudspeakers at similar price points. To me, it is not about HiFi which the likes of Magico arguably do better or about massive dynamic abilities which are often ascribed to the legendary Wilsons – rather it is about a higher goal – which is to enjoy and appreciate the connection to the composer’s or songwriter’s intent and to capture the essence and life of the music and I feel the team at Raidho Acoustics have nailed this goal.
    Ralph,
    Thank you very much for sharing this journey of yours with us. I agree totally with your assessment on what we are after with our music.

    I also agree with you and Jock when it comes to Raidho speakers. I would already have a pair if not for their propensity to pop when pushed hard. That is in no way meant to be a criticism of the Raidho sound, only a downfall of my room and listening habits.
    If Michael Borreson addresses this one concern, then I will place my order for D3's in a minute !!!!!
    Mark


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  7. #57
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Quote Originally Posted by MDP View Post
    Ralph,

    [...]

    I also agree with you and Jock when it comes to Raidho speakers. I would already have a pair if not for their propensity to pop when pushed hard. That is in no way meant to be a criticism of the Raidho sound, only a downfall of my room and listening habits.

    Hello Mark,

    I think Martin Colloms who the publisher of HiFi Critic Magazine put it quite nicely when he described Raidho as being like a precision analogue camera. While perhaps unintended I think the analogy works quite well.

    To start with, in this point and shoot digital age, analogue cameras are quite simply not for everyone and neither frankly is Raidho. If ones calling is very high sound pressure levels or the delivery of bass slam [and how I hate that term] and / or visceral punch to the listeners stomach then large Wilsons or Rockport’s are a more obvious ticket.

    Further, in the same fashion that an analogue camera takes understanding, training and patience to master and to get the best out of them – so do Raidho loudspeakers. The Raidho’s are a bit unique and their setup is critical. Raidho creations are true free space designs and are not intended to couple significantly to the room and are exceptional in a near-field arrangement – which is antithetical to more normative loudspeaker setup, design and behaviour. Moreover they are far from sensitive and while uncompromised by the load (6 ohm min, 8 ohm typical) they need quality amplification to shine.

    But – and here is the kicker – just as professional with understanding, patience and training can produce first class photos from a precision analogue camera, despite some drawbacks – a Raidho owner with similar attributes or with the assistance from a properly trained professional Raidho dealer, will reap and enjoy virtually unparalleled quality in audio reproduction other things being equal.

    For my US$ 40,000 outlay I could have bought a fabulous pair of loudspeakers from Magico, Wilson, Revel or Focal et. al. but for my system, taste, room and above all my ears, I remain very pleased with decision to go Raidho. Others may see things differently and look for different attributes in their loudspeakers and my only response to that is to observe that we are blessed to have so many great loudspeaker options available.

  8. #58

    Re: Music from a farther room

    Ralph,

    Thank you for pointing out your thread to me. Apologies for missing it, I was on calls all last weekend and equally busy throughout the week. This should be more than a sticky, it should be required reading! You condense a lot of good information in a practical, useful manner, ie, the tuning and buildout of your room.

    I read it this morning in one sitting: well written and very informative. I believe I am heading down a similar path of education/discovery/room tuning as you have just traveled. I will refer to your experience to guide my path.

    I am curious, as you mentioned, consistent time decay is a goal we should strive for. Is there any specific time target you are shooting for? 300ms or less per se? Or just consistency across the frequency band? Also, on your Chart in post#14, you show a spike of 2.3secs in the 8K range. When I took my measurements, I had one run where I had spike of 4.28 secs in 8K as well, but I threw that out as being a bad sample. Most of my other measurements circled around the 0.5ms range, so that's what I posted. Just curious if that 2.3secs was a consistent value for you or not. I also wonder if the mic has a linear frequency response as I believe I could possibly be getting noise at the frequency extremes.

    Thank you for pointing out the user errors in my first set of measurements. I have a bad case of not RTFM'ing. Will adjust settings and redo measurements.

    I do hope to read more about your new listening room buildout in your new home. Subscribed.


    Allen



  9. #59
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    wow i just found this thread, and i must say incredible the time and effort you put in it, but like a book, i have to put it down for awhile. i read up until you are unpacking the d2's. i will finish the read after work tonight, but i must say i just learned more about room acoustics than i ever knew before . and now have a ton of ideas from this to try in my own room. thank you so much for this and i cant wait to finish reading the rest tonight.
    great job!!!!!
    Steve

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  10. #60
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Quote Originally Posted by socfan12 View Post
    Ralph,

    Thank you for pointing out your thread to me. Apologies for missing it, I was on calls all last weekend and equally busy throughout the week. This should be more than a sticky, it should be required reading! You condense a lot of good information in a practical, useful manner, ie, the tuning and buildout of your room.

    Many thanks for the kind words!


    Quote Originally Posted by socfan12 View Post

    [...]

    I am curious, as you mentioned, consistent time decay is a goal we should strive for. Is there any specific time target you are shooting for? 300ms or less per se? Or just consistency across the frequency band? Also, on your Chart in post#14, you show a spike of 2.3secs in the 8K range. When I took my measurements, I had one run where I had spike of 4.28 secs in 8K as well, but I threw that out as being a bad sample. Most of my other measurements circled around the 0.5ms range, so that's what I posted. Just curious if that 2.3secs was a consistent value for you or not. I also wonder if the mic has a linear frequency response as I believe I could possibly be getting noise at the frequency extremes.

    Reverberation times can and will vary across the frequency range depending on the size of room. The objective here is to ensure decay is relatively even across the frequency spectrum without favouring certain ranges.


    A typical target for midrange decay time (T60) is somewhere between 0.2 to 0.5 seconds. Too short a reverb time leaves music sounding dry and unnatural and too long a reverb time leaves music sounding harsh, confused and muddy.


    As a generalisation classical music aficionados may be best served with room that is more ‘live’, with a higher T60 of 0.4 to 0.5 seconds whereas those who love “audiophile” close‐miked girl and acoustic guitar type recordings might appreciate a lower T60 approaching the 0.2 to 0.3 second range.


    Turning to your other question, I initially thought the 2.32 second decay at 8KHz was a measurement anomaly. Such measurement errors happen – particularly at more directive higher frequencies. However, after adding some additional diffusion to some bare sidewalls the problem went away. I should point out in case you were wondering that my RT60 measures are low due largely to a very small listening room and RT60 measurements for small rooms are not particularly valid with ETC measurement being more meaningful.




    Photo 1: Room size and acoustic treatments will impact RT60 measurements

  11. #61
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Quote Originally Posted by Petro85 View Post
    wow i just found this thread, and i must say incredible the time and effort you put in it, but like a book, i have to put it down for awhile. i read up until you are unpacking the d2's. i will finish the read after work tonight, but i must say i just learned more about room acoustics than i ever knew before . and now have a ton of ideas from this to try in my own room. thank you so much for this and i cant wait to finish reading the rest tonight.
    great job!!!!!

    Thanks for the kind words Steve.

    One of the challenges with audio reproduction is that everything seems to matter! AC, grounding, equipment racks, resonance control devices, cables, speakers, amplifiers etc. etc. In the midst of all of this the room quite often is forgotten and yet the room acts like a great big tone control; lifting some audio frequencies whilst cutting others. A little time and effort spent on the listening environment actually saves audiophiles thousands of dollars in equipment upgrades whose benefit will be masked by poor room acoustics.

  12. #62
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Quote Originally Posted by kiwi_1282001 View Post
    Thanks for the kind words Steve.

    One of the challenges with audio reproduction is that everything seems to matter! AC, grounding, equipment racks, resonance control devices, cables, speakers, amplifiers etc. etc. In the midst of all of this the room quite often is forgotten and yet the room acts like a great big tone control; lifting some audio frequencies whilst cutting others. A little time and effort spent on the listening environment actually saves audiophiles thousands of dollars in equipment upgrades whose benefit will be masked by poor room acoustics.
    Truer words have never been spoken !
    Mark


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  13. #63

    Re: Music from a farther room

    Hi kiwi, can you give me your thoughts between the Sanders Magtech & the Gryphon amp you've had in your system.

  14. #64
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Thanks for your enjoyable and detail journey on room treatments.I initially went too far with absorption and removed half and now getting some final touches with 2D diffusion.
    Stump

  15. #65
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Quote Originally Posted by sharkmouth View Post
    Hi kiwi, can you give me your thoughts between the Sanders Magtech & the Gryphon amp you've had in your system.
    Hi Kev, Some years back I wrote a review on the Sanders Magtech which included some comparison to the power amp section of the Gryphon Audio Designs Diablo amplifier. Review (updated for this forum) copied below.


















  16. #66
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Quote Originally Posted by stump View Post
    Thanks for your enjoyable and detail journey on room treatments.I initially went too far with absorption and removed half and now getting some final touches with 2D diffusion.
    Stump
    Greetings Stump.

    Well I made exactly the same mistake - loaded the room full of absorption (which admittedly was better than untamed reflections running riot) only to replace most of it with diffusion.

    Cheers
    Ralph

  17. #67
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Quote Originally Posted by kiwi_1282001 View Post
    Greetings Stump.

    Well I made exactly the same mistake - loaded the room full of absorption (which admittedly was better than untamed reflections running riot) only to replace most of it with diffusion.

    Cheers
    Ralph
    Ralph,

    That was my experience also, thanks in part, to your thread.

    BTW, I noticed that the picture in post # 60, the 2 stacked GIK Tri-Traps were replaced by 4 different stacked corner traps. The replacements are??

    Can't wait to see what you do with your new room.

    All the best,
    Tom
    SE MI
    85" snowfall so far this winter

  18. #68
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Quote Originally Posted by hoosiertom View Post
    Ralph,
    That was my experience also, thanks in part, to your thread. […]

    Hi Tom,


    It is always nice to read of others independently validating my experiences with room acoustics and treatments. I’m am equally pleased to learn this thread has been useful to others.




    Quote Originally Posted by hoosiertom View Post


    BTW, I noticed that the picture in post # 60, the 2 stacked GIK Tri-Traps were replaced by 4 different stacked corner traps. The replacements are??

    Boy, you don’t miss much Tom!


    The two stacked GIK Tri-Traps were replaced 4 x Mega bass traps from Real Traps LLC (USA).


    The Real Traps Megatrap is a far more effective bass trap than the GIK Tri-trap both in terms of measured and observed experience. When I replaced my Raidho Acoustics C-1 loudspeakers with the D-2 model I was a bit shocked just how low in frequency the D-2’s went. I had way too much energy (in room) at 34Hz and 63Hz – and whilst I could not do much about the former the later is at the outer reaches of effectiveness for a conventional membrane design.


    Real Traps claim that “MegaTraps absorb more than any other commercial bass traps in the world, regardless of price”. While I can’t possibly validate that claim I can say based on measured performance in my room that they were very effective.




    Photo 1: Rear wall treatments; GIK Scopus T38 (tuned) at base with Vicoustic DC2 diffusors above and Realtraps MegaTraps at corner

  19. #69

    Re: Music from a farther room

    Nice!
    Main System:Mcintosh MC601's Amplifer,Mcintosh C1000/C1000T Preamp,Kef Ref 5 Speakers,Mcintosh MCD1100 CDP,Mcintosh MT 5 TT, Olive 04HD, Acoustic Zen Absolute Shotgun Cables,4 ELECTRA™ 7 Power Cords&2 Pairs of
    ECLIPSE 7 (EBI) XLR's, Consonance D-Linear 15 Ultra Reference Power Conditioner/Surge Protector, SolidTech "Rack of Silence"Reference 4 Audio Stand.

  20. #70
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    If you want to talk about over treated rooms get a load of this, what you see on the side walls are absorption panels:mediaroomphoto1.jpgMediaRoomProfPhoto3.jpgmediaRoomProfPhoto2.jpgThis is what happens when you have more enthusiasm than experience. I went crazy with the art panels. But it sure was fun until I discovered I had an anechoic listening room. Not the best prescription for the Raidho D2's that have replaced the B&W 802's seen in the picture. The other rookie mistake I made was putting the rack between the speakers. Oh well, I'm learning. Le Roy

  21. #71

    Re: Music from a farther room

    Ralph...I have just flipped through this thread (haven't even begun to read it yet) and I must say I am looking forward to carving out a few hours to go through each and every post. Your detailed, systematic and thoughtful unveiling of your journey with system and room design is about as rigorous and perfectionist as it can get without bringing in outside help. Congrats and well done and wish you all the best with new house/room!
    Cyril
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  22. #72
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Quote Originally Posted by Odyssey View Post
    If you want to talk about over treated rooms get a load of this, what you see on the side walls are absorption panels: This is what happens when you have more enthusiasm than experience. I went crazy with the art panels. But it sure was fun until I discovered I had an anechoic listening room.







    Not the best prescription for the Raidho D2's that have replaced the B&W 802's seen in the picture. The other rookie mistake I made was putting the rack between the speakers. Oh well, I'm learning. Le Roy



    Hello Le Roy,


    Well, way too much absorption in your room to be sure and those thin panels will not only dampen / deaden the room but perhaps worse lead to a skewed frequency response because 1 inch panels only absorb high frequencies and do little for the midrange and nothing for low frequencies, potentially leading to spectral imbalance.


    I made exactly the same error – but let me congratulate you on the panel artwork, which is simply stunning, and the use of diffusion on the rear wall and ceiling. It looks to be a nice space. What are the room dimensions?



    Yes, changes will definitely be needed to get the best performance out of your wonderful Raidho D2 loudspeakers. Personally, I would start by removing all the sidewall mounted absorption and see how that sounds / measures. Then I’d introduce some two-dimensional diffusion at the first side wall reflection points and see how that comparatively sounds. Raidho speakers excel in free-space settings so don’t be afraid to pull them far into the room, quite some distance from the front wall where your screen presently is. If you do that your equipment rack between the two loudspeakers is less of a positional concern.


    Set up properly your Raidho D2’s will murder your Bower & Wilkens 800 series loudspeakers. The Raidho’s offer far greater resolution, incisiveness and speed; and while the B&W’s reach lower in frequency the Raidho’s proffer far superior bass definition – all in my humble opinion of course! As one former 802D owner recently wrote; “the Raidho’s don’t sound angry!”

  23. #73
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Quote Originally Posted by cmalak View Post
    Ralph...I have just flipped through this thread (haven't even begun to read it yet) and I must say I am looking forward to carving out a few hours to go through each and every post. Your detailed, systematic and thoughtful unveiling of your journey with system and room design is about as rigorous and perfectionist as it can get without bringing in outside help. Congrats and well done and wish you all the best with new house/room!

    Thank you Cyril,

    Yes, I am very excited about the new house and the new audio room. My old audio room raised a lot of "what if?" questions - and I hope to answer some of these questions through my new room. The toughest part is the waiting time. Key elements of the project like acoustic doors and windows have painfully long lead times.

    Regards
    Ralph
    Borresen Acoustics Loudspeakers, Borresen Model 01 Compact monitor loudspeakers with Ansuz Darkz T2s Supreme resonance control, Audio Video Manufaktur GmbH (AVM) Inspiration amplifier & streamer, Innuos Zen MKII music server, Ansuz Acoustics cables & accessories. Please visit my system thread hosted on Audioshark for more details. Disclosure: The author is materially connected to Ansuz, Aavik & Borresen Acoustics via friendship with an owner.

  24. #74
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    I made exactly the same error – but let me congratulate you on the panel artwork, which is simply stunning, and the use of diffusion on the rear wall and ceiling. It looks to be a nice space. What are the room dimensions?

    Ralph, the room dimensions are 11.5' x 16' to the rear of the nook of the room. Clearly the room is over treated. I have tried removing all of the sound (absorptive) panels and the room becomes and echo chamber. There is a lot of time smearing and flutter echo. This is especially evident when I clap my hands together vigorously.

    When I put up the sound panels at just the first reflection point the sound does improve. Is it your position that diffusion is the better solution at the first reflection point over absorption?

    I am going to have all of these art panels taken apart and turned either into reflection or diffusion or some combination of both. I would love to have your opinion Ralph. Thanks. Oh and congratulations on this outstanding thread. I have learned a great deal in reading it.

    Le Roy

  25. #75
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Quote Originally Posted by Odyssey View Post
    [...] I have tried removing all of the sound (absorptive) panels and the room becomes and echo chamber. There is a lot of time smearing and flutter echo. This is especially evident when I clap my hands together vigorously.
    Yes, also having a small room I completely understand issues around flutter echo. Absorption solves the flutter echo problem but unless used judiciously can result in a sound which is dry and dead (over attenuated).

    What is needed is a product which kills flutter echo but preserves ambience.

    Options here include RPG BAD panels, Vicoustic wavewoods or similar. Another option for you to consider is adding scattering plates / binary amplitude templates behind the fabric on your art panels.



    Quote Originally Posted by Odyssey View Post
    […] When I put up the sound panels at just the first reflection point the sound does improve. Is it your position that diffusion is the better solution at the first reflection point over absorption?
    My position – which by no means is greeted with universal approval – is a strong preference for diffusion at the 1st sidewall reflection point. Not only is energy and ambience maintained and flutter echo eliminated, but the uniform distribution of energy back into the room aids intelligibility, detail and realism and done well improves spatial experience – so the room feels bigger than what it really is. Our ears and brain happily process reflections as part of everyday life. If you remove reflections entirely (as absorption can do) the resulting sound can lose realism.

  26. #76
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Music from the NEXT room



    And so begins my next great adventure – a brand new audio room for 2014.


    This room whilst similar in size to my earlier room i.e. still a small space will be completely different in construct. Whereas my former room was a bit like a “bunker” with solid concrete floor and thick brick walls the new room will be more porous based around light timber framing and GIB board (plasterboard) – more commonly referred to as “drywall” or gypsum board in North America.


    The materials have arrived on site and work is now well underway


    Twin 10mm layers of GIB Noiseline drywall will be used on all walls. Other than being an effective wall bracing sheet for light timber framed buildings, Noiseline is also a high performance plasterboard designed specifically for reducing the level of sound transmission between rooms. Its higher density core can reduce noise transmission between rooms and also between floors in two storey homes.



    Photo 1: A trailer load of plasterboard for the walls and ceiling



    For insulation Pink Batts “Silencer” is specified. Pink Batts Silencer insulation is a lightweight flexible glass wool insulation product designed to provide acoustic insulation in internal walls. By design it absorbs sound – reduces noise transmission between rooms for a quieter more relaxing home. NRC is 1.04 and an STC rating of over 50 is achieved when combined with the GIB Noiseline drywall.



    Photo 2: Specialized insulation for the walls and ceiling




    For the ceiling solid 13mm GIB sheets will be used together with a GIB Rondo metal batten system which is designed to attenuate (some) sound by way of non-rigid fixings.



    Photo 3: The rooms ceiling will be somewhat isolated from the Joists (beams) above via special ceiling clip & batten system




    The room being developed for this listening room started life as a ground floor garage. It was subsequently partially developed into a rumpus room (recreation or ruckus room) for teenagers by the previous home owner. All existing linings will be ripped off as part of the build so that improved insulation and wall linings (which resist working like a drum) can be installed and provisions can be made for dedicated AC power circuits, specialized earthing and data networking.




    Photo 4: The starting space. Concrete floor, particle board and no ceiling


    The room measurements are 17.06 feet (length) x 11.22 (width) and a bit low at a little under 8ft in height. Being very similar in total cubic foot size to my previous listening room may mean that I am able to draw some comparisons on outcomes further down the track.







    Figure 1: A simplistic room mode calculator which displays the first 16 axial modes up to 500Hz to predict low freq behaviour



    Running the dimensions through a simple modal calculator (from Real Traps LLC USA) suggests that as always; smaller rooms present a greater challenge in the distribution of room resonance modes with bunching or coincidence of modes inevitable in the all important bass frequency range. Still, overall the room modes look to be more even than my previous room below the transition frequency and it will be interesting to observe whether this aids a better listening experience.

    A number of updates will follow as various stages of the project are completed.

  27. #77
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Love seeing projects like these from start to finish. And, you give a very nice detailed step-by-step so I'm very much looking forward to reading more!
    Michael

    Magico S5s; PASS Labs Xs150s and Xs preamplifier; Lumin A1; Synergistic Research Galileo LE Powercell, Galileo LE speaker cables and interconnects, Galileo LE Analog and Digital power cords, Transporter Ultra SE, Tranquility Bases, MiGs, HFTs, XOTs, FEQ, Vibratron and Bass Station.

  28. #78

    Re: Music from a farther room

    An NZ patent, my my!

  29. #79
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Ralph
    Great news

    Can't wait to see the details of this next process unfold ....

    I have a similarly sized listening space and I know we'll all continue to learn even more from your experience.

    Thanks for sharing.

    All the best,

    Tom

  30. #80

    Re: Music from a farther room

    Look forward to see how your room evolves, Ralph!


    Allen



  31. #81
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Music from the NEXT room - update 1



    This update is a continuation of my thoughts and experiments in creating a good listening environment within the confines of a small listening room measuring approximately 17ft x 11ft. Starting with the shell of a room that started life as a ground floor garage this update together with others that will follow will chart key conflicts, decisions and progress towards what I hope will be a new and rewarding approach to small room acoustics.


    The first obvious step of preparation for the new audio room was to remove all existing wall linings so that improved insulation and better quality wall linings can be installed and provisions can be made for dedicated AC power circuits, specialized earthing and data networking.


    The obvious nature of this first step however concealed a huge dilemma I had to work through before the carpenters started work. Put succinctly the nagging question was – what overall building element performance (STC/Rw etc.) was required to meet a desirable level of acoustic comfort?


    Determining the acoustic comfort design level requires balancing several factors such as budget, owner and occupant expectations, building code and district plans, organisational standards, and the intended function of a room or space. It can impact on junction details, building service placement and containment, room layout, construction types, and quality assurance programmes.


    I have long believed in the benefit of quiet spaces in which to enjoy music. Quietness demands noise control and by extension isolation from unwanted noise. The benefit for audiophiles of a quiet environment is multi-fold. First, unwanted noise such as the sound of cars passing on a nearby road or the footfall of children in nearby rooms – which is distracting – can be eliminated or a least reduced. Second, a quiet room, one with a very low noise floor, will improve the possible dynamic range of your audio system. Simply put therefore, the quieter the room the more things you will hear from a recording and the less distracted one will be by noise (unwanted sound).


    The design of my previous audio room achieved a measured noise floor of 30dB, not bad when you consider there was a fairly busy road outside the window and that a typical home does well to achieve 50dB SPL.


    Aiming for some targeted level of acoustic comfort is an important prerequisite to establish because it aids in estimating how much noise attenuation is needed. For example if the sound of cars passing outside the window of your desired listening space measures at 75dB and you desire a target noise floor of 30dB, then design for your room must ensure an STC of 45.





    Figure 1: External noise level minus target indoor noise level = required STC




    Once a desired level of acoustical performance is locked down attention then turns to design elements (walls, ceilings, doors, windows etc.) required to achieve the goal.


    Looking first at drywalls [I will address other elements in a subsequent update] several builders books state that thicker drywall reduces sound transmission but engineering manuals recommend using multiple layers of drywall, sometimes of different thicknesses and glued together, or special type of drywall designed to reduce noise. Also important are the construction details of the framing with studs, wider stud spacing, double studding, insulation, and other details reducing sound transmission. Sound transmission class (STC) ratings can be reduced from 33 for an ordinary stud-wall to as high a rating as 59 with double 1/2" sheetrock on both sides of a wood stud wall with resilient channels on one side and fiberglass bat insulation between the studs.




    THE DILEMMA


    Herein lay the first dilemma. Whilst it is relatively easy to increase the thickness of drywalls either via increased thickness of materials or double / staggered studding or introduce a brick internal wall for increased rigidity we run headfirst into a well-documented problem. One of the great ironies of acoustics is that thick rigid walls that improve isolation between rooms will also cause more acoustic problems within the rooms. With standard walls made of one layer of sheet rock, the lowest frequencies pass through to some extent, and are also partly absorbed when the wall vibrates in sympathy. Walls made of cement or multiple layers of sheet rock reflect more and to lower frequencies, thereby increasing the damage caused by acoustic interference.


    Low frequency energy passes right through the lightweight walls to the outside; and by passing through the walls instead of being reflected, the low end response is more uniform than in many rooms. For this reason whilst I am desiring an STC performance of 45 I am wanting to achieve this with a relatively lightweight structure so for this build I will be using single stud with two layers of relatively thin (10mm) GIB board affixed internally as shown in figure 2 below.





    Figure 2: Wall design detail



    In my next update I will discuss some of the other design elements and decisions around them; notably the windows and ceiling.





    Figure 3: Stripped back to timber framing; provisions made for power, lighting etc.

  32. #82
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Music from the NEXT room - Update 2



    This update is a continuation of my thoughts and experiments in creating a good listening environment within the confines of a small listening room measuring approximately 17ft x 11ft. Starting with the shell of a room that started life as a ground floor garage this update together with others that will follow will chart key conflicts, decisions and progress towards what I hope will be a new and rewarding approach to small room acoustics.


    This particular update addresses the window and how its design addresses different types of noise; airborne and impact.



    NOISE


    Noise is any sound that is unwanted, usually because it distracts or disturbs us. Noise can come from a variety of different sources but there are only really two forms: Airborne - These are sounds which travel in waves through the air and enter our ears. Airborne noise can travel from outside a building to the inside. Typical examples are:


    • Music
    • Children playing
    • Traffic noise


    Impact - These are sounds that are transmitted via vibration through a physical structure such as a conservatory roof. Typical examples are:


    • Rain
    • Hail



    ACOUSTIC WINDOW


    The weakest links in reducing the level of sound transmission between rooms and to the exterior tend to be windows, doors and ceilings. The challenge for these building elements is to bring them up to an acoustical performance level that is not too similar to the outside envelope of the home. There is little benefit in having STC 59 rated exterior walls if those walls are punctuated with large windows with an STC 29 rating. If a room design is targeting a sound transmission class of 40, then all elements of the design; windows, doors, ceilings etc. must come up to that standard.


    Most acoustic control rooms in broadcast / recording studios achieve high STC ratings by having fixed pane (non-opening) windows with large air-gaps, often 4” between the glass panes. Unfortunately non opening windows with large air gaps are not an option for domestic houses so some compromise is necessary.


    People assume that because insulated glass does a better job of reducing heat transfer, it will also do a better job of reducing the transfer of noise. This is almost always not the case. In fact the small air gap that is typically found in insulated glass and is so useful for its thermal properties, is usually a disadvantage acoustically. The air in the gap couple (not isolates) the two sheets of glass, thereby improving the ability of a thermo-pane window to transfer sound energy.


    For acoustic properties the preference swings to laminated glass. Using laminated glass (two or more layers of glass bonded together by a visco-elastic damping layer between them) the STC of a window assembly can be significantly improved. The damping layer, although very thin and not visible, improves the overall glass performance (increases STC) by eliminating or greatly reducing the losses that inherently occur at coincidence frequencies in single panes of glass. It should be noted that in colder regions the improved STC provided by laminated glass will be reduced as the damping layer is substantially cooled. The air space between glass sheets in commercial windows can be as little as 0.25” and is generally no more than 1”. The acoustical performance of such assemblies is inherently limited by such small air gaps. Generally, acoustically rated windows have spacing of 2” – 4” between panes. The airspace between the panes should not be less than four inches if an STC above 45 is desired.






    Figure 1: A typical acoustic window design



    Acoustical windows can be purchased factory-assembled or they can be constructed locally (in a shop or on-site). Any window purchased from a factory should have been tested acoustically and should come with a guarantee of performance.


    Working closely with my builder we eventually settled on a solution from Viridian Glass (formerly Pilkington Glass). That solution was Viridian VLam Hush™ which is a laminate that uses a specially developed interlayer to dampen noise, providing enhanced sound insulation performance. This means that thinner and lighter glass can be used for equivalent acoustic performance. VLam Hush reduces the coincidence dip of standard monolithic and laminated glass.





    Photo 1: Window fitted on site




    Photo 2: Window detail showing cavity between panes



    The window comprises of double glazed 7mm Stadip Silence Laminate on 7mm Stadip Silence Laminate with approx. ½ inch between the panes. Each pane contains a special acoustic interlayer (approx. 1mm) which not only bonds the glass but also acts as a dampening core between the glass panes, preventing sound frequencies vibrating from one pane of glass to the other. This interlayer absorbs and weakens sound, helping to act as a barrier to both airborne and impact noise. Normal windows have a ‘resonant frequency’, at which they vibrate more significantly reducing their acoustic insulating performance. Stadip Silence double glazed units perform at least 20% better than conventional units comprising annealed or normal laminated glass. At the critical resonant frequency they can perform up to 10dB better. If a window incorporates an opening of any kind it is important that well performing seals are also fitted. Sound will travel through any small gap and will have a detrimental effect on the overall acoustic performance of the window.

    An air gap of only 1% of the total window can reduce the sound insulation by up to 10dB, meaning that the noise passing through sounds twice as loud as it would if well sealed.


    The STC rating for the glass in the above mentioned configuration is approx. 40. Though it is important to note that the window by design limitation will be more suitable for blocking higher pitch frequencies. Lower or deep pitch frequencies whilst muffled will still possibly audible.


    In the next update I will provide insight into the isolated ceiling design.

  33. #83
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Nice view on your backyard.
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  34. #84

    Re: Music from a farther room

    Hi Ralph,

    Curious, have you looked into quiet curtains or the like to reduce unwanted noise? Just wondering if you did and know of their effectiveness vs. the glass solution you are using.

    Thx


    Allen



  35. #85
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Ralph, I always look forward to your posts. I find them extremely informative. Your observations and actions are well thought out. You'll have to put up a bibliography at the end of your thread. I wouldn't know where to go to find all of the info that you have assimilated.

    Le Roy

  36. #86
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Quote Originally Posted by NorthStar View Post
    Nice view on your backyard.


    LoL. Thanks for overlooking the shoddy lawn trimming/edging Bob….





    Quote Originally Posted by socfan12 View Post
    Hi Ralph,


    Curious, have you looked into quiet curtains or the like to reduce unwanted noise? Just wondering if you did and know of their effectiveness vs. the glass solution you are using.


    Thx



    Hi Allen, indeed I have looked into quiet curtains. For my previous room I imported at considerable cost Quiet curtains from a supplier in San Diego, CA. The curtains, with a very heavy proprietary vinyl liner and thick suede fronting fabric claimed a lab tested STC 20 rating. They required special heavy duty tracks and carriers to manage the weight. I not only fitted the curtains to my audio room but also installed them into my master bedroom – as both faced an urban street, so I had reasonable opportunity to observe their effectiveness.





    Photo 1: My previous audio room. Quiet Curtains can seen in the background of the above photo. Even bunched and installed floor to ceiling they were considered marginally effective. Other than noise attenuation they do reduce room reverberation



    How effective were they? Well, I did not objectively measure their performance but observationally I struggled with the STC 20 rating. The rating is a result of measuring against a specific contour, typically from 125 Hz to 4000 Hz, with the focus really on the effectiveness of attenuating speech. Needless to say the product is more effective at frequencies above 1 KHz – but even here when I had my son stand and speak on one side of the curtain I am pretty certain the sound I heard on the other side of the curtain was reduced no more than 25%, nothing close to expectation. That of course was a hardly scientific exercise and flanking may have played a role. Equally for low frequencies, typical of traffic noise, a quiet curtain is not effective.


    In sum – and sorry about being long winded – a quiet curtain can’t be considered as an alternative to an acoustic glass window solution. By merit of its mass and interlayers a window will be more effective at noise reduction and importantly over a broader band of noise. At best a curtain should be considered as supplementary. A quiet curtain can however be effective in blocking distracting bright sunlight and reducing room reverberation and echo - which can be a problem with uncovered glass surfaces.





    Quote Originally Posted by Odyssey View Post
    Ralph, I always look forward to your posts. I find them extremely informative. Your observations and actions are well thought out. You'll have to put up a bibliography at the end of your thread. I wouldn't know where to go to find all of the info that you have assimilated.


    Le Roy


    Thanks for the kind words Le Roy. May be one day I will better organise my observations.

  37. #87
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Music from the NEXT room - update 3



    This update is a continuation of my thoughts and experiments in creating a good listening environment within the confines of a small listening room measuring approximately 17ft x 11ft. Starting with the shell of a room that started life as a ground floor garage this update together with others that will follow will chart key conflicts, decisions and progress towards what I hope will be a new and rewarding approach to small room acoustics.


    This particular update will focus on the ceiling, one of the largest and most important elements of any audio room.

    Over years of experiments and observations both in my own audio room and that of others I’ve arrived at several conclusions that will inform my ceiling design. I am not an authority on the topic and others may disagree but I nonetheless state for clarity my observations below:




    1. Audio rooms with chapel ceilings are a mistake. As an old audiophile tale goes, the only place where a chapel ceiling is appropriate is a chapel.
    2. Ceiling light fittings should be avoided. Ditto for florescent lighting and dimmers too.
    3. Avoid ceilings that act like trampolines. This is especially relevant in basement rooms where joists typically bear a floor load above.



    As earlier recited noise can come from a variety of different sources but there are only really two forms: Airborne – being sounds which travel in waves through the air and enter our ears and Impact - These are sounds that are transmitted via vibration through a physical structure such as a footsteps on a floor above.

    Since my audio room will have human traffic on a directly above floor the ceiling design must attenuate both airborne and impact noise.


    In order to attenuate airborne noise insulation is typically used. I found that 250mm (around 10 inches) was needed in the ceiling which in conjunction with 13mm specialised GIB Noiseline board met my targeted level of acoustic comfort.

    In order to attenuate impact noise a resilient channel is necessary to decouple the ceiling board from the flooring joists.





    Photo 1: A ceiling clip




    Photo 2: Ceiling clips at 600mm centres and at right angle to joist





    Photo 3: Ceiling channel installed with gaps left at wall intersections for acoustic sealant





    Photo 4: Insulation fitted, 2 x 100mm Noiseline batts plus 50mm higher density foam




    The design avoids the use of ceiling lights for three reasons. First, any holes punched in the ceiling will weaken the ceilings acoustic performance. Second, given the ceiling is already quite low, lights will further reduce the perceived height. For this room soft wall mounted lights will be employed instead. Third, the close proximity of insulation to recessed light fittings can produce a fire hazard.


    An abundant amount of acoustic sealant is used at wall intersections and great care is needed to ensure that screws used to secure the ceiling board to the metal channel don’t tap into the joists.




    Photo 5: A jig is indispensable in mounting the ceiling board to the metal channel.



    In the next update I will provide insight into the electrical aspects of the room.

  38. #88
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Ralph, this update is on par with your others, most excellent.

    I have a number of questions I would like to pose to you; however, I shall confine myself to one at this point: Do you believe that it is still a mistake to use dimmed lighting that is on a separate circuit from the presumed dedicated circuit for you Music Room?

    Often times dimmed lighting is used to set a mood or to enable one to better concentrate during periods or critical listening. If there is no interference with the havoc a dimmer introduces into the electrical current, does your admonition stem from something else?

    Just one more question for now: when do you expect for your room to be complete?

    Le Roy
    Le Roy

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    Chicagoland : Soulution 725 preamp, 711 stereo amp, 541 SACD/560 DAC w/ Network Streaming, Raidho D5.1, Naim UnitiServe 2TB, Aurender W-20 Ansuz DTC later generation wire, Teac X1000 R2R, QNAP TS-451+

    Foundation:
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  39. #89
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Hi Le Roy,

    In reply to your question I avoid dimmers even where (as they will be in my room) they reside in separate power circuits.

    The issue is one of potential harm caused by hum. See Kill Studio Hum and Buzz at the Source
    for interesting discussion on the topic, including one possible solution using large variable power transformers, something I did not consider as practical due to size.

    I agree with you that mood lighting is beneficial so my room design calls for mood lighting (sans dimmers) and separate task lighting and I will detail this together with other electrics in my next update.

    ETA for room completion is 4 weeks. There was long lead times on my acoustic doors and acoustic drapes.


    Regards
    Ralph

  40. #90

    Re: Music from a farther room

    Ralph, interesting and informative read as usual. Well done.


    Allen



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    Re: Music from a farther room



    Ralph, when you finish your flooring treatments are you going with carpet and padding or some other floor covering? Are you going to lay some kind of wood underlaymnet (3/8" or 1/2" plywood) as a buffer between the concrete and the floor treatment? What are your views on concrete or cement structures and how they will affect the sound within the room? Thank you for all of the pics.

    Le Roy
    Le Roy

    Austin, Tx : Soulution 520 preamp, 501 mono blocks, 541 SACD/560 DAC w/ Network Streaming, Raidho D3.1, Lumin U1, Uptone Audio Modded Mac Mini w/ MMK fanless kit & JS-2 LPS, Regen, Ansuz DTC loom (complete), Oppo 105D, QNAP TS-451+

    Chicagoland : Soulution 725 preamp, 711 stereo amp, 541 SACD/560 DAC w/ Network Streaming, Raidho D5.1, Naim UnitiServe 2TB, Aurender W-20 Ansuz DTC later generation wire, Teac X1000 R2R, QNAP TS-451+

    Foundation:
    Raidho Rack system, Ansuz DTC Mainz8, Ansuz (2) Supreme Mainz D8 Distribution, 20 amp dedicated outlets via subpanel

  42. #92
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Quote Originally Posted by Odyssey View Post

    Ralph, when you finish your flooring treatments are you going with carpet and padding or some other floor covering? Are you going to lay some kind of wood underlaymnet (3/8" or 1/2" plywood) as a buffer between the concrete and the floor treatment? What are your views on concrete or cement structures and how they will affect the sound within the room? Thank you for all of the pics.

    Le Roy


    Hi Le Roy,


    Thanks for the interest.


    From the outset I should state that I am endeavouring to build a room around my speakers – rather than the traditional approach of buying a pair of speakers and praying to God that they work ok in a pre-existing room. It is important to understand this foundational position because it will be basis of many decisions I make including the flooring treatments.


    Turning directly to your question, the room has a concrete slab base and flooring treatment will consist of 12mm foam underlay with sisal wool carpet laid on top.


    Why I have chosen this solution really comes down to my speakers. In my previous listening room I had timber strip flooring over a concrete floor. This did not in my opinion work well because the flooring was not perfectly level and as a result my speakers did not sit properly. Furthermore, the relative lack of a buffer between the concrete and the timber led to a leaner overall sonic presentation. The problem was solved by introducing a thick carpet rug. You may read elsewhere of others siting their Raidho speakers on granite or ceramic slabs or tiles or even adding spikes to their speakers. While such choices obviously reflect personal preference they defeat – in my opinion – the effort that has gone into Raidho’s clever footers which serve a critical purpose. Spikes, granite et. al. act like tuning devices and they will nearly always “lean out” the sound. In an effort to maximise the potential of the speakers I plan to ensure that Raidho’s footers have good grounding to the carpet but don’t compress it to the extent that they will connect to the concrete. Wool carpet was an obvious choice as for reasons I can’t explain it sounds better than synthetic carpet – an opinion that does find some support of other audiophile community members. Rather less obvious was underlay selection where the choice is between rubber waffle, slab rubber or foam chip. I really don’t know which is best but I do recommend avoiding cheap underlays of any type. Clay fillers may have been added to basic rubber waffle underlay to keep down the manufacturing costs. In time the waffle structure may collapse as the fillers break down. Cheap low-density foam underlays with a density of less than 95kg will quickly lose their resilience and maintain indentations. Foam chip underlay which I’ve selected is graded by density (kg/m³) – and the higher the better from the point of view of feel, durability, thermal properties and acoustic buffer. I will be using 12mm thick foam underlay with a 120 kg/m³ density.


    Turning to your second question re concrete / cement structures I don’t yet have an opinion. My earlier audio room was a concrete bunker with a solid reinforced concrete base floor and cement plaster over brick walls. My hypothesis as of now is that room may have been TOO rigid and so my current rooms design will be experimentally more lightweight in a purposed effort to relatively release rather than store or reflect back energy into the room. Only observation over time will test the validity of the hypothesis.
    Borresen Acoustics Loudspeakers, Borresen Model 01 Compact monitor loudspeakers with Ansuz Darkz T2s Supreme resonance control, Audio Video Manufaktur GmbH (AVM) Inspiration amplifier & streamer, Innuos Zen MKII music server, Ansuz Acoustics cables & accessories. Please visit my system thread hosted on Audioshark for more details. Disclosure: The author is materially connected to Ansuz, Aavik & Borresen Acoustics via friendship with an owner.

  43. #93
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Music from the NEXT room - update 4



    This update is a continuation of my thoughts and experiments in creating a good listening environment within the confines of a small listening room measuring approximately 17ft x 11ft. Starting with the shell of a room that started life as a ground floor garage this update together with others that will follow will chart key conflicts, decisions and progress towards what I hope will be a new and rewarding approach to small room acoustics.


    This particular update will focus on the electrical design for the room with a specific focus on decisions taken around lighting. Subsequent updates will discuss power circuits and earthing.



    LIGHTING


    The right lighting can create a mood, light up a task or accent a decorative feature and when it comes to lighting in an audio room generally all three will be planned for.


    Task lighting is essential and located in proximity to your audio rack this is required to provide adequate light for you to make changes to audio connections etc. even if they are on the bottom shelf. You want your speaker cables in the right phase and you want all cables dressed as tidily as possible and hence the amount of light needed here should be enough to accomplish these sorts of tasks. Task lighting can also be useful close to where your music is stored so you can more easily find your record or CD of choice.


    While bright lights might be great for entertaining and activities requiring a certain task to be performed when it comes to actual listening to music most audiophiles agree that mood lighting is the way to go.



    "Skilful application of mood lighting can, perhaps more than any other non acoustic element in the environment, affect the experience of the listener
    ."



    Light is an element of design which should be used not only for visual comfort, but also to achieve predetermined emotional responses from the lighted environment. Through use of lighting patterns of varying levels of illumination, and of colour in the light source and in the illuminated object, it is possible to produce certain moods such as: solemnity, restfulness, gaiety, activity, warmth, and coolness. The lamps themselves can be used to dramatize elements of interior design—line, form, colour, pattern, and texture.


    While higher levels of lighting generally produce cheerful effects and stimulate people to alertness and activity, lower levels of lighting tend to create an atmosphere of relaxation, intimacy, restfulness and focus on the reproduced music rather than the distraction of hard illumination.


    While it is tempting to use light dimmers to alter the level of illumination in a room – don’t! With few exceptions (which tend to bulky and / or costly) lighting dimmers can produce noise in the form of hum or buzz. Solid-state light dimmers in particular can create havoc with audio gear. These devices work by changing the amount of time the full power line voltage is applied to the light being controlled, as opposed to actually raising and lowering the voltage. Although AC power is supplied by the power company as a pure sine wave (having no harmonics), the dimmer's sudden switching of the voltage on and off actually generates harmonics which extend to very high frequencies and these high frequency harmonics can get into audio gear both by radiation through the air and also by traveling through the power wiring directly into the audio circuitry.


    A superior solution is to place lighting on a separate power circuit (ideally just for the room) and select the appropriate light fitting / bulb size / lumens / colour to achieve your desired atmosphere. I prefer to have task and mood lighting on separate switches to purpose for different activities. Further, my experience has directed the avoidance of installing florescent lighting in the music listening area. Use only incandescent or halogen lighting. I've not done a scientific exploration as to whether it is the aesthetic effect or if it might be electronic hash on the power circuits or both, but music always seems to sound better with subdued incandescent lights.






    Photo 1: Selected wall mounted mood lighting for my for my audio room




    Personal preference will naturally play a key role in lighting choices. Speaking personally I prefer the following;


    1. Wall mount rather than ceiling mount lights. Not only are bulbs easier to change in order to tailor appropriate colour and lumens, they can also produce interesting lighting patterns.


    2. An up-down (directional) lighting pattern. This is not only interesting but also more intimate and avoids an undesirable situation of light shining into one’s eyes.


    3. A curved form for the light fixing as these will scatter rather than simply reflect certain audio waves.


    4. Warm lighting. It must simply be psychological but I find cool lighting = cool unengaging music….


    In the next update I will discuss other aspects of the electrical design; power circuits and earthing.

  44. #94
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Ralph - terrific job! No stone is left unturned. Very thorough. I'm curious, how long are your speaker cables? Also, I may have missed it, but did you install a solid core door?


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  45. #95
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike View Post
    Ralph - terrific job! No stone is left unturned. Very thorough. I'm curious, how long are your speaker cables? Also, I may have missed it, but did you install a solid core door?


    Hi Mike,

    Thanks!

    In reply to your questions;

    I have two sets of loudspeaker cables. One set is 7m the other 2.5m, the choice depending on the location of the equipment rack; either sidewall or between and behind the loudspeaker plane.

    I am planning a separate update on doors. The main entry to the audio room will have a special acoustic door and frame and I think a short note on that is warranted as a future update.

  46. #96

    Re: Music from a farther room

    Hello Ralph,

    I'm using LED lighting without dimmers: I just turn on or off separate LED strips closely spaced together to achieve the required luminosity. Also, using RGB LEDs allows me to choose a color fit to my mood.

    P.S. No need for expensive professional stripes, Christmas tree ornaments will do the job (I placed them inside semi-transparent cable masks that can be found in any IT store).

  47. #97
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Quote Originally Posted by iosiP View Post
    Hello Ralph,

    I'm using LED lighting without dimmers: I just turn on or off separate LED strips closely spaced together to achieve the required luminosity. Also, using RGB LEDs allows me to choose a color fit to my mood.

    P.S. No need for expensive professional stripes, Christmas tree ornaments will do the job (I placed them inside semi-transparent cable masks that can be found in any IT store).

    Hi Costin, Now that is interesting. What color do you find yourself listening in mostly?

  48. #98

    Re: Music from a farther room

    Quote Originally Posted by kiwi_1282001 View Post
    Hi Costin, Now that is interesting. What color do you find yourself listening in mostly?
    Mostly amber, it's warm enough to put me in the mood but not as strange as, say, red. I too avoid cool colors: green or blue just make everything look freakish.
    Sometimes I just use blue above the gear (makes the blue displays look white while keeping almost everything else in the dark).

    I must confess I also have a "light organ" (kind of an '80 style toy) that I modified to work with the LED stripes. I keep it on a separate circuit and sometimes use it while listening to Guns'n'Roses, Yello or Kruder & Dorfmeister. Better keep off the 18 years old Laphroaigh while doing this

  49. #99

    Re: Music from a farther room

    Hi Ralph,

    Great update. I'm not happy with the lighting in my room and as you say, it really sets the mood right. Once my gear settle choices settles down and acoustic treatments are up, I will tackle that next.

    Interested in what you do for your door. I have solid core doors, but with a healthy 1/2 inch or so gap on the bottom. Was thinking of getting some door treatments for the bottom to prevent so much sound from leaking...


    Allen



  50. #100
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    Re: Music from a farther room

    Quote Originally Posted by iosiP View Post

    [...] I must confess I also have a "light organ" (kind of an '80 style toy) that I modified to work with the LED stripes. I keep it on a separate circuit and sometimes use it while listening to Guns'n'Roses, Yello or Kruder & Dorfmeister. Better keep off the 18 years old Laphroaigh while doing this

    I disagree. A good single malt, a comfortable chair, mood lighting and the sweeping orchestral backing of "November Rain" -- is an epiphany of the divine. It is for such moments we strive tirelessly....

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Music from a farther room

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