Kaiser Kawero or Raidho D3 or Vivid Giya G2?

[Audiocrazy]

Hello friends and audio lovers!

I am new to this site however I have always been reading this forum with lots of interest as it provides me with lots of insights and opinions of different people and mostly people who simply enjoy good music.

I am just curious to get some feedbacks and impressions on the above speakers especially the models mentioned. I have read a lot about them and listened to a few but never together in the same setup or room but none the less all have their strengths and weaknesses and have gained fantastic reputations and positive feedbacks around the world.

I am assuming this would be a difficult battleground as two have a similar configuration interms of tweeter (ribbons) whereas Giyas are domes.

I would love to hear from everyone what are their thoughts on each models mentioned and which one would you prefer to take home if you had the money and correct room to accommodate them.

Hope to get some nice thread going on here and with great insights from everyone.

[Mike]

Welcome Audiocrazy. May we know your first name?


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[Audiocrazy]

Hi Mike,

Simply an amateur who is curious and trying to learn what is out there interms of latest technology and what it delivers for the money and R&D that goes into creating the loudspeakers.

Alvin

[Mike]

Hi Alvin - welcome! Are these three speakers ones you are considering?

[Audiocrazy]

Hi Mike,

Thanks for your reply.

I am casually looking into them at the moment but any promising audition may lead to a purchase later on depending on budget and other factors. I am collecting as much information as I can through auditions and other means however open to suggestions. I love listening to jazz and classical type of music and hence the reason for stating the above brands which I'm keen on further researching on.

[Mike]

Alvin - can you tell us a little more about your room and any associated gear you already own?

[Audiocrazy]

Hi Mike,

I have sold my serious gear to one of my mates lucky I didn't need to advertise, had Dyn C2 with Pass gears... Now will be moving to a new house and new setup as such....Not in a rush as I want to get something really good not saying the C2 were not but want something that shines in the mids and highs and has the ability to create even a bigger soundstage.....:D... New room will be roughly 5m x7m....will be treating the room as required. Good thing is that I am not restricted to any associated gear as it will accompany whatever loudspeaker I deicide to go with.

[Mike]

I'm getting a pair of Spatial Audio Statements in another month or so. Stay tuned. They might be the cat's ass. I've heard his earlier designs and I've heard the servo-sub bass system he is using in the Statements.

Lumina ? SPATIAL AUDIO (http://www.spatialaudio.us/lumina)

But of the three you listed, I own the Raidho D3 in my second system and have heard the Giya G1, G2 and G3's. The Raidho's are wonderful, but they need some special attention with respect to cabling, placement, amplification, etc.

[Audiocrazy]

Thanks Mike,

Thanks for the update and your feedback. I also heard many times that Raidho's are bit fussy with placements but once you get it right it can be all 'divine'....Just curious if you ever auditioned Zellation loudspeakers and if they are up there with the likes of most popular brands.

[Mike]

Yes, I heard the Zellatons. I think it was CES. They were nice, but not $95k nice.
They also can't play loud and the guy running the demo refused to turn them up. IMHO, a pair of Sonus Faber Stradivari's sound somewhat similar in terms of smoothness and to my ears, sound quite a bit better then the Zellatons.

You may want to really focus on some high efficiency speakers: Tannoy, Spatial, Volti, etc. Then you can have some fun with a 300b SET amp. That's what I'm going to do in my main system.


That being said, the Raidho's are very special as well.


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[veindoc]

I have heard both the Kaiser and D3 v1
D3 tweeter is like no other in terms of sweetness and vertical and depth of soundstage. Mike is much more knowledgable about how well or easy amplifiers integrate with these speakers. Kaisers look great, r adjustable like the Klimpt speaker by Vienna acoustics in regards to upper module. They sadly were underwhelming especially lowend when I demo them in SF showroom

Nick

[the professor]

I've liked the Vivid's at some audio shows when Ayre has used them in their room. I haven't liked them in their own room. Strange.

The upgraded version of the Raidho D3s, aren't near as picky in amps/cables/positioning as when they first came out. I didn't find the D1s were that picky, but to get the most out of them, like any speaker it takes some time.

I obviously really like Raidho. They are not accurate as some speakers out there, but they have that musical quality to them that very few systems do.

At CES last January, I heard the Zellatons. I didn't find that they did anything wrong, but they also didn't grab me.

[Audiocrazy]

Hi Mike,

Spartial Audio looks quite interesting... May I ask if this is replacing any of your current systems that you own?


Alvin

[Mike]

Hi Mike,

Spartial Audio looks quite interesting... May I ask if this is replacing any of your current systems that you own?


Alvin

Yes. My Wilson Alexia's - which are phenomenal speakers and should be destination speakers.....but, my name is Mike, and I'm a gear swapper. :)


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[audio.bill]

Yes. My Wilson Alexia's - which are phenomenal speakers and should be destination speakers.....but, my name is Mike, and I'm a gear swapper. :)

Hi Mike, and welcome to the club! We're very fortunate to have you as an ongoing member, and this is one addiction that hopefully won't require an intervention. :D

[Mike]

Hi Mike, and welcome to the club! We're very fortunate to have you as an ongoing member, and this is one addiction that hopefully won't require an intervention. :D

Ha! :D


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[Audiocrazy]

Hi Nick,

Thanks for sharing your experience with Raidho's. It seems that many of the members who own or have listened to Raidho's love them for their immense soundstage, speed, clarity and great musical qualities as opposed to being analytical? I have to organise some serious listening with these beauties.

[Audiocrazy]

Wow Mike something that potentially gets to replace Alexia's must be truly amazing.

Q regarding your current setup - Main listening room vs Family Room do you listen to same genres of music in both of your systems or its dedicated for different occasions?


Alvin

[Part-Time Audiophile]

TIDAL Audio might be a good one to look at, if you're already considering ceramic-driver loudspeakers.

[Mike]

Hi Alvin - I'm certainly optimistic about the Spatial speakers. I love the design theory. I've heard the designers other work and I'm a fan.

On the Raidho's - the music is definitely similar to my main room, except that the Raidho's are filling the house morning, noon and night with music. When I do sit down to actually listen, I get lost in the music and the enveloping soundstage.


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[Audiocrazy]

Thanks Mike,

I can certainly picture myself doing the same and just enjoying the music 'floating' out of the Raidho's. BTW do you think it would be worth auditioning the YG's Hailey with the others? I haven't had a chance to hear them just curious if it engages the listener into music like Raidho's?


Alvin

[Mike]

The YG's are excellent. I would definitely give them a listen.

If you do go with Raidho's - be prepared for a real up and down break in for the first 1000 hours....or at least the first 500. I found playing lots of vinyl helped loosen up the cones a little more and therefore expedited break in.

Expect to go from OMG to WTF? during break in.


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[Audiocrazy]

Hi Mike,

My list of speakers are growing day by day and there's no pattern to what I'm after now but eventually will get there?Hopefully:rolleyes:

I remember you did say something about trying out high efficiency speakers as well...so when I think of High efficiency Horn speakers comes to mind. Any experience with them and what about the Tune Audio especially Animas...they claim "horn speakers that doesn't sound like horn"....also the new Voltic? Did you consider any of these before finalising on Spatial Audio for your next system?


Alvin

[Mike]

Voltic or Volti? Volti is right up there for me. They need a big room though.

http://www.voltiaudio.com/vittora.shtml

I also need to hear Paul (BlueMcintosh) Tannoy speakers.

When it comes to super high efficient speakers (100db or more), the field drastically narrows.

[asiufy]

Thanks Mike,

I can certainly picture myself doing the same and just enjoying the music 'floating' out of the Raidho's. BTW do you think it would be worth auditioning the YG's Hailey with the others? I haven't had a chance to hear them just curious if it engages the listener into music like Raidho's?


Alvin

Hey, there's a speaker I heard, and was very impressed! The YG Hailey's are excellent, top to bottom. Great, controlled bass, and not as demanding of the amps as the previous YG models.

It'd be a good listening exercise, since the YG is a sealed box speaker, while most of the others (all?) are ported designs. There are significant differences in bass characteristic between the two designs, and listening would help you find which one you prefer !


alexandre

[Audiocrazy]

Hi Alex..

Thanks for the information and yes YGs are on my shortlist for auditions....

Alvin

[Audiocrazy]

Hi Mike,

Sorry it is Volti.....my mistake........ I'm little surprised that no one suggested Magico's as an alternate option. Mike what are your thoughts on the Q series or even the latest S series....


Alvin

[Mike]

Hi Alvin - I owned the Magico S5's and sold them after a few months. Although I greatly appreciate the technology in the speaker, at the end of the day, in my room, with my gear, it just wasn't my cup of tea. They did a lot of things right - except emotionally engage me in the music. They demo amazingly well though.

I have heard all of the S and Q series speakers. The Q series speakers, to me, try to perfect audiophile sound rather than reproduce music.

My Wilson Alexia's should be my destination speakers. With any of the sweet tube amps I have, they are outstanding - and leave me scratching my head every time - asking, "again, why am I selling these?" I guess I just want to try the Spatial's and the open baffle/point source design philosophy and failing that, return to the Sonus Faber Stradivari's which is a speaker I should never have sold....a speaker with more soul than any other I've ever heard.

Volti's and Tannoy's are also very high on my list. I guess, I just like to try different gear. Just because I sell something doesn't always mean I don't really really like it. I know a lot of people can't understand that. They think if you like something, you should keep it forever. That works for love, but not gear. I never get emotionally attached to gear - I get attached to the experience of different gear. Some people trade cars every few months because they love the experiences that each and every different car brings. I tend to think of gear that way. Although I admit to getting frustrated sometimes, I do enjoy the journey.

[Paul]

Hi Alvin - I owned the Magico S5's and sold them after a few months. Although I greatly appreciate the technology in the speaker, at the end of the day, in my room, with my gear, it just wasn't my cup of tea. They did a lot of things right - except emotionally engage me in the music. They demo amazingly well though.

I have heard all of the S and Q series speakers. The Q series speakers, to me, try to perfect audiophile sound rather than reproduce music.

My Wilson Alexia's should be my destination speakers. With any of the sweet tube amps I have, they are outstanding - and leave me scratching my head every time - asking, "again, why am I selling these?" I guess I just want to try the Spatial's and the open baffle/point source design philosophy and failing that, return to the Sonus Faber Stradivari's which is a speaker I should never have sold....a speaker with more soul than any other I've ever heard.

Volti's and Tannoy's are also very high on my list. I guess, I just like to try different gear. Just because I sell something doesn't always mean I don't really really like it. I know a lot of people can't understand that. They think if you like something, you should keep it forever. That works for love, but not gear. I never get emotionally attached to gear - I get attached to the experience of different gear. Some people trade cars every few months because they love the experiences that each and every different car brings. I tend to think of gear that way. Although I admit to getting frustrated sometimes, I do enjoy the journey.

Well said Mike.....I can't wait you get here :woot: I have a strange feeling that this Tannoy's going to be here for a looooong time :D ( For the record the longest one was 13 months in my room. Shortest was 50 days LOL )

[Audiocrazy]

Hi Mike,

Excellent write-up and really appreciate your honest feedback and experiences with different systems. I guess I have to take my own journey and discover things as I progress further and deeper into this hobby.

I'll be gladly waiting for your impressions on the Spatials once it replaces your beautiful Alexia's.... In the meantime I will continue doing my own research and see where I end up.. at the moment everything is pointing towards Raidho's!:D

[elegy]

The comparison of a reference speaker like Zellaton to pleasing Sonus Faber Italian furniture is, in my humble opinion, way off the mark :) These are completely different speakers and share no resemblance whatsoever. Zellaton got best of show at Munich from TAS this year (both Harley and Valin who preferred over Raidho, Magico, YG, Wilson etc…), and selected Zellaton as most coveted speaker etc... This is the only speaker in 25 years that have equaled, and in many ways surpassed my Quad 57's. They play louder and more coherently than any speaker I ever heard. In fact, as you turn up the volume they have zero compression - just pure musicality and control. Alvin, if you listen to Zellaton I'm afraid everything else will be unlistenable. They are a true music lover's speaker.

[sharkmouth]

As of everything audio, it all comes to opinion.......



The YG's are excellent. I would definitely give them a listen.

If you do go with Raidho's - be prepared for a real up and down break in for the first 1000 hours....or at least the first 500. I found playing lots of vinyl helped loosen up the cones a little more and therefore expedited break in.

Expect to go from OMG to WTF? during break in.


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Mike, you do that to me on a regular basis :D




Well said Mike.....I can't wait you get here :woot: I have a strange feeling that this Tannoy's going to be here for a looooong time :D ( For the record the longest one was 13 months in my room. Shortest was 50 days LOL )


Joe has that so beat it'd make it dizzy :woot:




Hi Mike,

Excellent write-up and really appreciate your honest feedback and experiences with different systems. I guess I have to take my own journey and discover things as I progress further and deeper into this hobby.

I'll be gladly waiting for your impressions on the Spatials once it replaces your beautiful Alexia's.... In the meantime I will continue doing my own research and see where I end up.. at the moment everything is pointing towards Raidho's!:D


When you stop listening to your system & you have an emotional bonding & passion for music, you know something is amiss, the hard part is working out how to fix it. Sometimes it is just don't play music for a night, others it takes a new chord/interconnect/tube/amp/speaker etc. as your preferences change. I once jumped from one system to the next regularly, now I have components that at this stage I have no intention of replacing. Hell, I've head the same curtains for 18 months now.....

[Jack]

Kev

That is what I was thinking too. Harley, Valin, Srajen and others jump on every new boat that comes along and do so for a reason. That reason is not always about the sound. There are very few of them I pay attention to and those are the ones whose opinions and tastes stay the course over time. If only someone kept score of how many times the next "great thing" came along to the "usual suspects."

[Mike]

(both Harley and Valin who preferred over Raidho, Magico, YG, Wilson etc…), and selected Zellaton as most coveted speaker etc...

This week at least! :)

I like that the Zellatons have a open baffle midrange. But to me, they are just "ok" and they do have SPL limitations. I distinctly remember the rep telling me this and believe I read something about the pair in Munich having issues.

As for Sonus Faber furniture.....I will admit that many of their models are that....but a great speaker like the Strads will always be a great speaker.

Personal taste I guess. I would rather buy the Strads on Audiogon for $22,000 and pocket the $78,000 difference.

[Jack]

Amen to that Mike. Following that group will make you poor in a hurry. There is a reason some speaker manufacturer's have been around for decades and others come and go when the publicity from there ad revenue runs out. No matter what the reviewers think, the customers make the final decision. Wait a year and look on Agon for the "speaker of the month" and see how many you see and the price they are selling for as opposed to those from the established companies.

[Audiocrazy]

Hi El,

Thanks for your insight into the Zellation's... I guess in show conditions there are lots of factors that may hinder the performance of the loudspeakers including what they are paired with, room specifications which all play a part in good listening experience but most of the time people don't get to experience good sound due to these factors.

Just curious if their lower end models possess the same quality interms of sound signature and dispersion characteristics..... Also have you had a chance to hear them at a dealer or in a proper setting as opposed to show demos?

If I come across Zellations I will definitely hear them and see what they are capable of.....



Alvin

[Audiocrazy]

Does anyone have experience with Voxat (https://www.google.com.au/search?espv=2&biw=1440&bih=696&q=Voxativ&spell=1&sa=X&ei=CW2hU6TUHs_98QXDkYHwCg&ved=0CBkQBSgA)ix loudspeaker from Germany? Looks interesting wonder if they are able to capture audience with classical and jazz music.


Alvin

[elegy]

I agree about "flavor of the month" and judging by all the Wilson's on Audiogon as well as others, it's clear to me that the game is rigged, but in favor of some of the mainstream high-end brands. Wilson, Magico and Raidho for instance come out with a new speaker so often - and reinventing the wheel every year. This clearly benefits the merry-go-round disease that is endemic in high end audio but sadly supports the symbiotic relationship of manuf/reviewer/magazine/dealer etc… This is why you see people dumping their discontinued (or current) Wilson's and Magico's on Audiogon the second they are replaced with the latest and greatest, and one of the reasons (besides incredible musicality) why I like Zellaton and other brands as well as they operate outside of all that (which makes it even more shocking that they got best of show in CES and Munich) - and in terms of longevity, Zellaton has been around since the 1930's - way before Dave Wilson and Alon Wolf were wearing diapers :)

You read right - Zellaton patented its driver in the early 30's:


Z E L L A T O N - Zellaton - The Legendary Speaker (http://zellaton.com/en/#/history)

[Petro85]

ive never owned , or tried to own any of the speakers talked about here in this thread. ive listened to several of them and have heard many many others not in this thread.
im always looking for efficient speakers now and the others i could honestly care less about anymore. no matter how good the listening session was. that is except for raidhos. i just love the sound that damn ribbon tweeter makes, and i cant get enough of them and the fact that i could never run any of them on 300b's is heartbreaking to me, but as far as the others ive heard i can live without most all of them even if i really liked them, none to me matches the things that the raidho does so well. and whatever it is that raidho does i just seem to love it.

[ozarktom]

BTW, my second choice behind the Zellatons would be the Kaiser Kaweros. But the Kaweros are more than 60K and the Zellaton Grands are much less. All of the Zellatons have the same quality no matter which model you buy. The drivers in all of the speakers have the same quality build requirements. For larger rooms, go with the larger ZEllatons. In my 16x24 foot room the Emotions do a wonderful job. I should be able to get a great sound from the Grands, but I think the References might be a little too large for me. The Grands should have more bass, but the Emotions have great bass now.

Just keep watch on the audio show reviews, Zellaton will be tops in every show. Or just spend an hour or two at a local dealer, if you have a very discriminating ear like I do, or RH and JV of TAS does, you will agree, Zellatons are clearly the best.

[Mike]

I must definitely give the Zellaton's a more serious listen. I wonder if they will be showing them at RMAF?

[veindoc]

Just my two cents-the number of speakers on Agon often relate directly to how many speakers r sold and how many audiophiles get bored and r now looking for new sonic attributes. I think Wilson has around 30 US dealers. Zellaton has essentially one true dealer
Who controls his market. If Zellaton sells X speakers per year- Wilson sells 100X speakers a year. It only makes sense more of them would appear on Agon. I don't think it has anything to do with either brand being superior or inferior. The R and D going into cabinets, drivers and crossovers is very sophisticated and expensive to execute with companies like Wilson and Magico. If one prefers a smaller brand that produces a pleasing sound to their ear that's also fine. But please don't think Zellatons absence or near absence from Agon is quality related. It is more related to how few speakers r sold enter the market place compared to larger players

Nick

[tunes]

The zellaton grand and emotion were at the last 2 rmaf respectively. I spent a long time in the Audioarts room both years and became smitten with the zellatons, though i prioritized source components on my list to upgrade. Depending in your room dimensions and budget Alvin, i would suggest adding either the emotion or grand to your audition list. They are typically positioned out into the room, quite far from the front wall so space is required to maximize their capable range.
Chris

[ozarktom]

The zellaton grand and emotion were at the last 2 rmaf respectively. I spent a long time in the Audioarts room both years and became smitten with the zellatons, though i prioritized source components on my list to upgrade. Depending in your room dimensions and budget Alvin, i would suggest adding either the emotion or grand to your audition list. They are typically positioned out into the room, quite far from the front wall so space is required to maximize their capable range.
Chris

My Emotions sits about 26 inches from the back wall. One of the secrets to the Zellaton's SQ is the fact it is an Open Baffle speaker. That gives the speakers the ability to completely disappear.

If anyone here is driving thru the Ozarks of Missouri on a weekend, stop by my place for a day. We can listen all day if you want.

[elegy]

Nick, I think you missed the point which was not about being on Audiogon per se, but rather the business paradigm that forces audiophiles to think that the new Wilson's or Magico's are the latest and greatest, thereby pressuring owners to dump their gear and upgrade. Yes, Wilson sells many speakers but since people rarely hold on to them (as is evident from today's listings on Audiogon), it speaks volumes as to long term musical enjoyment. I spoke with a Japanese audiophile who told me that Zellaton is now outselling Wilson and most mainstream high-end speakers there. Japan has one Zellaton dealer in Tokyo btw. My understanding from Audioarts is that Zellaton is more interested in quality representation rather than ubiquitous representation, which I think will be the trend in the future for the best gear. In the end quality will always prevail over quantity. I don't think I've ever enjoyed a speaker more than these Grand's...
Ozarktom, what electronics are you using with your Zellaton's?

[Mike]

One of the secrets to the Zellaton's SQ is the fact it is an Open Baffle speaker. That gives the speakers the ability to completely disappear.

I'm a big fan of that part!




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[ozarktom]

Nick, and don't forget Fidelis Audio in New Hampshire. They also sell numerous brands of speakers including Sonus Faber, Wilson, and distributes Harbeth. Zellaton must be very special to Fidelis for them to add Zellaton to their inventory. In speakers alone, they must stock millions of dollars worth. Wilson has been number one for about the last 30 years, but now audiophiles and reviewers are discovering something better. I hear that there are numerous customers that have been trading their Magico's and Wilson's into Fidelis for Zellatons.

[ozarktom]

In my present set-up elegy, I am using the Job 225 amp with the Sony HAP-Z1ES music server. I would like to get the Red Wine Audio tube mods on the Sony, but everything is sounding so smooth and transparent as it is. Zellatons are so revealing, any cable or amp changes can make a big difference. I know there are better amps than the Job, but they will probably cost 10 times or more. I think trading in the Emotions for the Grands would be a better choice. But as the sound is at the moment, I am very satisfied.

[Mike]

Nick, I think you missed the point which was not about being on Audiogon per se, but rather the business paradigm that forces audiophiles to think that the new Wilson's or Magico's are the latest and greatest, thereby pressuring owners to dump their gear and upgrade. Yes, Wilson sells many speakers but since people rarely hold on to them (as is evident from today's listings on Audiogon), it speaks volumes as to long term musical enjoyment. I spoke with a Japanese audiophile who told me that Zellaton is now outselling Wilson and most mainstream high-end speakers there. Japan has one Zellaton dealer in Tokyo btw. My understanding from Audioarts is that Zellaton is more interested in quality representation rather than ubiquitous representation, which I think will be the trend in the future for the best gear. In the end quality will always prevail over quantity. I don't think I've ever enjoyed a speaker more than these Grand's...
Ozarktom, what electronics are you using with your Zellaton's?


Elegy - do you have any financial interest whatsoever with Zellaton? Are you a dealer or distributor?

Mike

[Audiocrazy]

Hi Mike,

Seems like you may need to reconsider the Zellations and give them a second chance with a proper audition!

Since we are talking about the open baffles so I thought to throw these into the mix...:D...... not your everyday typical system I guess. Anyone who is willing to go large and have the room and budget they should check this out as well.

Managed to get the audition on the Tune Audio Anima's while exploring something different.... In summary the Horn speakers sounded fantastic, very natural, lively and had a massive soundstage. Those who love the organs, trumpets and choir this will definitely amaze you on every level. Their claim that these horns don't sound like horns is very true and at the moment these are the best Horn loaded speakers I have ever heard. Good price for the performance and awesome fit and finish. Unfortunately I don't think I have the rooms for these beauties or it would have been on my shortlist. Positive feedbacks and great reviews everywhere.

Also the new release Martin Logan neolith - Haven't heard them but I bet these must be pretty good as well?

.66246625



Alvin

[Mike]

I would love to hear those Alvin. The new ML's look phenomenal. Hopefully Myles will get a pair. :)


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[elegy]

Just like Ozarktom and others I simply love the speaker. Others on this forum love other brands as well and are passionate about their virtues - that does does not mean that they have a financial interest in those brands. We're an opinionated bunch but it's all part of the fun....Would you accuse a Wilson or Magico advocate on this forum of having an interest? Ozarktom, how do you find the Sony? Did you compare with other streamers as well?

Cheers...

[Mike]

That's fine Elegy...just want to make sure there isn't any disclosure required. As for Zellatons - I look forward to a more serious listen sometime soon.

[Audiocrazy]

Any love or experience with the new line of Kharma's... especially the exquisite line with in-house diamond tweeters and carbon composite drivers? Many owners claim they are not that accurate but very musical speakers.

Any current owners or people with experience on their new range?


Alvin

[KeithR]

The comparison of a reference speaker like Zellaton to pleasing Sonus Faber Italian furniture is, in my humble opinion, way off the mark :) These are completely different speakers and share no resemblance whatsoever. Zellaton got best of show at Munich from TAS this year (both Harley and Valin who preferred over Raidho, Magico, YG, Wilson etc…), and selected Zellaton as most coveted speaker etc... This is the only speaker in 25 years that have equaled, and in many ways surpassed my Quad 57's. They play louder and more coherently than any speaker I ever heard. In fact, as you turn up the volume they have zero compression - just pure musicality and control. Alvin, if you listen to Zellaton I'm afraid everything else will be unlistenable. They are a true music lover's speaker.

Honestly, a Valin and Harley rave would make me run from a speaker. Sorry.

[Perfect Sense]

There are a lot of brands mentioned in this thread. I don't really know where to begin, but I do carry Wilson, Magico, Raidho and soon - Kaiser amongst others.

The Kaiser rooms in Munich recently belonged to my top 5 among the "real world" contenders.

Nola might be a contender as well if you truly want to set your music free (open baffle, ribbon tweeter :)

The Crystal Cable Arabesque series are up there with the best as well. The Minissimo monitor is a killer.

If going for high-efficiency in a modern, high-performance speaker - have a look at Stenheim.

I'm carrying all of the above, which means I might be considered biased. I should be able to give you some insights and advice though regarding the individual characteristics of the different brands.

[Audiocrazy]

Hello Sir,
Thanks for sharing your experience with us and it's great to know that you are carrying so many popular brands under one roof. I believe it provides people with a rare opportunity to experience and seriously audition their favourite brands and compare against each other.

In your opinion what would be your best pick for jazz and classical listening? Never heard of Stenheim until now but looks very interesting as well.

Crystal cable arabesque is also on my short list for auditions unfortunately there's no way I can compare them with either Raidho's and Magico in one setting. Can I have your general opinion how crystal cable stacks up with the mentioned brands.


Alvin

[ozarktom]

Honestly, a Valin and Harley rave would make me run from a speaker. Sorry.

Too bad if you overlook these Zellatons because of a TAS review. These speakers are very special in sonics. In the last 40 years, these are the best I have ever heard. Very few companies out there actually hand make all of their drivers like Zellaton does. The Zellagons are very neutral, but very musical and transparent at the same time.

[ozarktom]

If I could go this year Mike, I would meet you at the Zellaton room at RMAF. I am sure they will be there. Too bad so many audio shows keep popping up, these companies cannot afford to go to all of them. Now Munich is the Number One show, we need to have RMAF regain that status. If RMAF had two days for the audio dealers, two days for potential customers like us, RMAF could regain that status. And Munich allows families to attend, while none of the bigger USA audio shows do.

So it is amazing that Zellaton made it number 1 in the last two years in Munich with all of the many companies attending.

[Mike]

Sure! I look forward to giving them a good listen. I did hear them at CES - twice - and like I said - they were nice, but not something I would take over quite a few other speakers. But I will give them a real good listen next time.


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[Paul]

One thing I don't rave about is" best review "or "best of show stuff". Do you guys really care about this ? aren't they all paid for ?

[Mike]

Directly or indirectly Paul....that may often be the case.


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[ozarktom]

One thing I don't rave about is" best review "or "best of show stuff". Do you guys really care about this ? aren't they all paid for ?

No, nothing is paid for but there has been a lot of politics over the years. Look at all the raves Wilson gets. Wilson had it in the 80's, and they still get it today.

[Paul]

No, nothing is paid for but there has been a lot of politics over the years. Look at all the raves Wilson gets. Wilson had it in the 80's, and they still get it today.

Two of my friends are reviewers and that's not what I heard so can't comment on your post.

[NorthStar]

I would. :D

[Paul]

I would. :D

Be my guest.

[NorthStar]

...If I could. No direct experience; I can't. :D

[sharkmouth]

Same as it ever was......

[socfan12]

At the end of the day, people should buy with their own ears. Rave reviews from reviewers, dealers, family or friends, may be take in as input but ultimately trust your own ears and your reaction to what's being heard. :peace:

[ozarktom]

So is that the reason Audio Research, Krell, Martin Logan, Wilson, Vandersteen and a few others has remained at the top for the last 30+ years? They paid for all of their rave reviews?

Nobody has paid me for the Zellaton comments here. But if you ever get tired of trading speakers, then try the Zellatons. If you are still dead set against trying Zellatons, then buy the Kaiser Kaweros. You are at least getting the second best out there in the audio world.

Four years ago, many of the Europeans were trading in their MBL's for the Kaweros and has never looked back.

[Mike]

I have to hear these two brands. I don't recall ever hearing the Kaiser Kawero's. Were they at CES?


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[Paul]

So is that the reason Audio Research, Krell, Martin Logan, Wilson, Vandersteen and a few others has remained at the top for the last 30+ years? They paid for all of their rave reviews?

Nobody has paid me for the Zellaton comments here. But if you ever get tired of trading speakers, then try the Zellatons. If you are still dead set against trying Zellatons, then buy the Kaiser Kaweros. You are at least getting the second best out there in the audio world.

Four years ago, many of the Europeans were trading in their MBL's for the Kaweros and has never looked back.

Are you the dealer ?

[ozarktom]

Are you the dealer ?

Not a dealer. I live in the Ozarks. No one here owns MBL's or Kaweros. And no Europeans are ever buying Kaweros from anybody here in the states. I am pretty sure it is a German company.

I did a review of the RMAF in 2010 saying the Kaweros were the best at the show on Audiocircle. There was a response from several of the Europeans saying that they had been trading their MBL's in on the Kaweros and was very happy.

if Zellaton was there that year, I missed the room. Zellaton Grands is still slightly better at a much better price.

Here is a review on the Kaweros at $65K. I know for sure this was not paid for.

Kaiser Acoustics Kawero Loudspeakers (http://www.positive-feedback.com/Issue51/kawero.htm)

[sharkmouth]

It's alright, we all have different tastes.

[Audiocrazy]

Hi Ozar,

Thanks for your lovely insight into the Kawero's. I do know its a wonderful speaker and its pretty under-rated in the audiophile arena.....however they are quickly gaining fans and people who properly listen to it to fall in love.....

I am not sure if you had the rumours but I heard from few sources that Kaisers are 'secretly' building a new flagship to rival major players in the market! It could be true.

Anyways my shortlist of speaker auditions is gradually shrinking which is a good think as I am getting somewhere now. On top of my shortlist includes some serious listening with Kaisers Kaweros, Raidho D3, Zellation, Yg Hailey's and Kharma exquisite range.

Hey Mike, if you do get an opportunity you should listen to Kaisers and Zellation's as I would love to hear your impressions and how it compares to you past and current systems.


Alvin

[Mike]

Alvin - I definitely look forward to hearing them both. Hopefully RMAF will provide that opportunity.

Mike


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[Audiocrazy]

For those who love reading techie stuff and about the materials employed for speaker building, this is an interesting read.

The Virtues of Panzerholz : An Investigation into the Acoustical Properties of Aluminum and Panzerholz (http://www.lessloss.com/page.html?id=80)

Panzerholz or simply German tankwood used 100% in the construction of Kaiser cabinets. However this does not necessarily conclude that using this material will make the sound more superior to what is currently out there!


Alvin

[Mike]

Alvin - interesting read. I've been reading a lot about designs and materials lately. Panzerholz looks like a good product for cabinets. Of course, I'm experimenting with a slightly different idea: the best cabinet is no cabinet. All cone and dome speakers have some degree of cabinet resonance - similar to cupping your hands, putting them a few inches in front of your face, and talking. Once you learn to recognize it in any cone and dome speaker, it can become an annoyance - UNLESS - it is minimized by the cabinet design and materials, sort of like "tuning" the cabinet to essentially resonate as part of the overall sound of the speaker. Harbeth does this well. I've always found the Sonus Faber Stradivari speakers unique design to handle resonances well. But those are few and far between.

That being said, I still need to live with a point source, open baffle design for a while before truly understanding it's benefits and weaknesses.

[Audiocrazy]

Hi Mike,

I am in the same 'boat' as you are and would love to try few unconventional concepts that different companies are now trying with their design approach. I'm curious about the Goebel Loudspeakers - especially their bending wave tweeters - Have you heard them at any of the shows?

Welcome to GÖBEL - Revolutionary Bending Wave Technology (http://www.goebel-highend.de/en/products/epoque.html)


Anyone else who has experienced Goebel speakers and how they compare with the Raidho's or even Zellation's?


Alvin

[Mike]

Alvin - the Goebel speakers look very interesting. Would love to hear them.

[Perfect Sense]

Hello Sir,
Thanks for sharing your experience with us and it's great to know that you are carrying so many popular brands under one roof. I believe it provides people with a rare opportunity to experience and seriously audition their favourite brands and compare against each other.

In your opinion what would be your best pick for jazz and classical listening? Never heard of Stenheim until now but looks very interesting as well.

Crystal cable arabesque is also on my short list for auditions unfortunately there's no way I can compare them with either Raidho's and Magico in one setting. Can I have your general opinion how crystal cable stacks up with the mentioned brands.


Alvin

Well, on this elevated level it usually comes down to personal preference, as there are few bad apples.

I listen to a lot of acoustical music incl. sing and songwriters in general myself, which means that the handling of unamplified instruments and voices are crucial. Based on these premises, I do hold Nola (http://www.perfect-sense.se/varumarken/nola) in general very high. I'm breaking in a pair of Metro Grand Reference Gold at the moment, which I believe are one of the most musical speakers I've ever experienced in a known environment. The timbre/tone colour is as natural as it gets, where the open baffle for the midrange and ribbon tweeter opens up a soundfield that's more or less free from colouration and boxiness.

Stenheim (http://www.perfect-sense.se/varumarken/stenheim) Alumine is somewhat lightweight in overall character in comparison, and perhaps more revealing (but never analytical or over the top). The build quality is amazingly precise.

Raidho (http://www.perfect-sense.se/varumarken/raidho) are rather unique in being quite sweet (as in never sharp or edgy) and at the same time extremely transparent speakers that throws a huge soundstage. Very easy to enjoy. They are a challenge to mate and setup well though, which you need to take into consideration (make sure the dealer has done their homework).

I'm waiting for the Kaiser Chiara monitor to arrive, as well as the Crystal Cable Minissimo. I would like to come back to those when I've got to know them better.

I would like to mention Diapason (http://www.perfect-sense.se/varumarken/diapason) from Italy as well. These are not "up there" among the usual suspects, but the emotional connection you get with the Adamantes and Asterra monitors are world-class in its own right imo.

[Audiocrazy]

Thanks for your brief feedback and highlighting your experience with some of the key brands. I am eager to hear about your impressions on the monitors once they arrive on your 'doorsteps'...:)

[Audiocrazy]

I am keen on listening to some Rockports...... Any current owners or people who have these on their shortlist or maybe someone with enough experience to make some comments compared to other popular brands. I would love to hear some impressions...


Thanks
Alvin

[Perfect Sense]

Thanks for your brief feedback and highlighting your experience with some of the key brands. I am eager to hear about your impressions on the monitors once they arrive on your 'doorsteps'...:)

I'll keep you posted :)

[Audiocrazy]

Hi

Thought to update you guys on my current status with speaker search. Due to changing circumstances and priorities I will probably end up with good stand-mounts for now. I have narrowed down to Kaiser Acoustics Chiara, Crystal Cable mini's( also have to audition the new Minissimo's), Raidho D1, SF Guarneri Evolution.


So what do you guys think of the above list?


Alvin

[the professor]

The D1s are outstanding.

[Mike]

The D1s are outstanding.

+1. If you need a stand mount - Raidho D1's all the way.


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[Audiocrazy]

Hi Mike,

Any ETA on your Spatial's? I am really curious to know how they will sound.



Alvin

[Perfect Sense]

Hi

Thought to update you guys on my current status with speaker search. Due to changing circumstances and priorities I will probably end up with good stand-mounts for now. I have narrowed down to Kaiser Acoustics Chiara, Crystal Cable mini's( also have to audition the new Minissimo's), Raidho D1, SF Guarneri Evolution.


So what do you guys think of the above list?


Alvin

These are all world-class speakers. The Raidho D-1 is indeed amazing with a lot of admirers in this forum, but it needs careful setup including the right choice of electronics, cabling etc. as well as enough room to breathe where the distance to the back wall is critical imo.

[Mike]

Hi Mike,

Any ETA on your Spatial's? I am really curious to know how they will sound.



Alvin

Probably another 2-3 weeks. I'm as anxious as you! They will be showing them at RMAF this year. When I do get them, you're welcome to come and hear them. My CARY 300b amps are being made too. With some upgraded tubes, the VAC preamp, should be a great pairing.


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[Design Audio Video]

Sorry guys, but I have to disagree about set up, cabling and electronics being difficult for Raidho speakers. I have now tried approximately eight different brands of separates with three different brands of integrated and some of them being in the low price range category. I know of it at least five different brands then I use that other people have had success with. I have also used about six different major cable manufacturers with excellent results. As for the set up, it is not difficult it is just a little different than most speakers. Once you learn how to set up a Raidho speaker it can be done in less than 15 minutes. The Raidho speakers are very revealing and high resolution. Because of this you can hear the flavor of different electronics and cables probably more so than any other speaker. But every brand that I have used has sounded very good. Some better than others. And definitely my favorite would be Constellation and soulution. But what speaker wouldn't benefit from electronics of that level. The majority of the speakers we talk about on this forum should have careful consideration of cabling and electronics. So to me, Raidho is no different than any other high-end speaker. Some you can just throw in and make work with any amplifier and cable combination but why would you want to invest that kind of money and not take careful consideration with components and cables to get the best possible sound out of those speakers. When Sonus Faber come to set up my Amati Futura'd they spent over two hours tweaking on the speaker positioning. But the end result you would have to have a tape measure to see that they had even been moved an inch. It took all of about 10 minutes to position my D5.

[MDP]

Thanks David.
I agree about the D3's not being that hard to set up, my Salon 2's took a lot longer to get positioned right. And I have also used some lower priced integrates with great results.

[Perfect Sense]

The Kaiser Chiaras are here... A revelation. More to come :)

[socfan12]

Looking forward to hearing more, Marcus!

[Rhapsody]

The Kaiser Kaweros will be here this week and the Chiaras will be here either later this week or next week as well.

[socfan12]

Great to see you posting again, Bob! Would love to hear them one day!;)

[Rhapsody]

Allen, will let you know when they are installed....come on over for a listen.

[wisnon]

http://audioshark.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=8833&stc=1http://audioshark.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=8834&stc=1http://audioshark.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=8835&stc=1http://audioshark.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=8836&stc=1Hi Bob,

Hope you are doing well.

I heard the Chiaras in Warsaw at the Show. Very nice.
Regards

[Rhapsody]

Hi Norman,

Thx and hope you are well as well:) Have a happy holiday season over there.

Yes we are excited to get the Chiaras and the Kaweros. We actually have three pairs of Kaweros on the way or in the process of being built. One pair has the lacquer finish which takes 12 weeks to cure. Two pairs are going to new homes and then our demo pair along with the demo Chiaras.

They will all be here the next time you visit! Be well.

[wisnon]

Excellent!

Happy holidays to you too.

Next Summer for sure...maybe before if I have some business travelk in the area. Airfares have gone crazy, BTW. Unbelieveable since oil prices are plummeting. Can we say price gouging? LoL

[Myles B. Astor]

Excellent!

Happy holidays to you too.

Next Summer for sure...maybe before if I have some business travelk in the area. Airfares have gone crazy, BTW. Unbelieveable since oil prices are plummeting. Can we say price gouging? LoL

No. Airlines buy on a yearly contract hedging the high and low prices for the year, giving them predictable costs. It helps them hedge against times when the cost is high (like it has been for years) but hurts when the price is low. Of course, once they've broken the frackers, the price will go up. So although costs have gone down for the public, it really hasn't for the airlines.

The reason the prices are high other than the holidays is all the mergers and cutting back of airline routes.

[Bobolaclune]

No. Airlines buy on a yearly contract hedging the high and low prices for the year, giving them predictable costs. It helps them hedge against times when the cost is high (like it has been for years) but hurts when the price is low. Of course, once they've broken the frackers, the price will go up. So although costs have gone down for the public, it really hasn't for the airlines.

The reason the prices are high other than the holidays is all the mergers and cutting back of airline routes.

Strictly speaking Myles, that's not true . Airlines, quite possibly the worst business over the last century , drove (flew?) themselves into the ground for decades with the onset of Reagan-esque Deregulation . It is only with the onset of bankruptcies and consolidation through mergers that the Industry has seen some semblance of market and price discipline . Plus the unions were brought to heel. That in turn has allowed them to pass on rising fuel costs to the consumer through fuel surcharges. However- many airlines were in such a parlous state that they lacked the cash to put up as margin collateral for futures hedging contracts . Even if they wanted to hedge out their avgas bills , they couldn't. Case in point - American Airlines - they don't hedge and pretty much never have , arguing that this was all swings and roundabouts anyway. Others , like Delta , hedged less but went out and bought a refinery - thinking that was a hedge.

Don't also look to the crackers & the E&P guys in the shale space to buckle under too quickly. Those guys HAVE hedged out forward production at prices averaging $90 & those contracts don't roll over till end-2015 for the most part. They're not going to start feeling pain for a while. Prices for crude in the $60's have to hang around for a while before the crackers get hurt (and the Canadian Oil Sands) . I believe that is what the Saudis intend. There's no such thing as a 6 month price war.

Full disclosure - I am a Hedge Fund manager with a large and long-time position in AAL & DAL

[wisnon]

Exactly!

They were passing on fuel surcharges so even if all were hedging, they had the surcharge protection. In any case, even if this were so, they are facing at least stable costs, they are in the process of jacking up prices claiming that they are enhancing the flying experience. ROTFLMAO.

As to breaking the frackers, I dont really see how that is possible. Keep prices low for a year and many will fold up shop, BUT if prices start to rise again, many will simply jump back in. (Technology has created a natural ceiling). On top of that, Tar Sand production costs years ago was about $35 a barrell. I am not very up to date with these costs at the moment, but I could imagine its at about $25 a barrell now and if so, then even at $40 a barrel, they will keep producing, even if at lower volume waiting for better times.

Oil needs to go back to 2004 levels of $20 a barrell to really shake out the new guys. But then, that would kill the Russians, Nigerians, Mexicans and Venezuelans and would probably splinter OPEC irrevocably! Saudi/Gulf costs are probably like $5 a barrell. The other big variable I guess would be what currency oil will be traded in going forward. Lots of whipers that it could be SDRs.


All speculative but interesting, no?

[mep]

How did we switch topics from Raidho speakers and their awesome, problem free bass to discussing free market oil prices?? :turban:

[Bobolaclune]

Exactly!

They were passing on fuel surcharges so even if all were hedging, they had the surcharge protection. In any case, even if this were so, they are facing at least stable costs, they are in the process of jacking up prices claiming that they are enhancing the flying experience. ROTFLMAO.

As to breaking the frackers, I dont really see how that is possible. Keep prices low for a year and many will fold up shop, BUT if prices start to rise again, many will simply jump back in. (Technology has created a natural ceiling). On top of that, Tar Sand production costs years ago was about $35 a barrell. I am not very up to date with these costs at the moment, but I could imagine its at about $25 a barrell now and if so, then even at $40 a barrel, they will keep producing, even if at lower volume waiting for better times.

Oil needs to go back to 2004 levels of $20 a barrell to really shake out the new guys. But then, that would kill the Russians, Nigerians, Mexicans and Venezuelans and would probably splinter OPEC irrevocably! Saudi/Gulf costs are probably like $5 a barrell. The other big variable I guess would be what currency oil will be traded in going forward. Lots of whipers that it could be SDRs.


All speculative but interesting, no?

Wow - that's a ton of speculation. Some points:

1. Airlines are jacking up prices because...they can . For the first time in a long time. Try shopping for fares - for the most part , they are within spitting distance of each other. And planes are flying at near-record load factors.

2. Oil sands prducers , on a proper all-in cost accounting basis , allowing for amortisation, depreciation and depletion is closer to $60-70/bbl. You can't use the marginal cost of producing the next barrel and assume investors and bankers don't require a full and comprehensive accounting of all the costs (and overruns) up to that point. They don't operate for incremental cash flow.

3. Saudi costs with a rising water cut and on the same basis are closer to $40/bbl. BUT - they need $90 to balance their budgets and remember - some of the fastest consumption growth on the planet is inside oil producers at a time when the West is actually decreasing consumption. The US will never again consume as many barrels of oil as it did in 2005 due to CAFE, conservation, alternatives ,etc.

4. SDR's ? - sorry but that is so 1970's it's not even funny . $ it is and $ it will remain especially after the Euro Zone implodes in the next couple of years.

[Bobolaclune]

How did we switch topics from Raidho speakers and their awesome, problem free bass to discussing free market oil prices?? :turban:

No idea !!! :huh:

But I have a better handle on the oil markets than I do on how to tame my Raidhos....

[wisnon]

Wow - that's a ton of speculation. Some points:

1. Airlines are jacking up prices because...they can . For the first time in a long time. Try shopping for fares - for the most part , they are within spitting distance of each other. And planes are flying at near-record load factors.


That IS my point!!!

[Myles B. Astor]

Strictly speaking Myles, that's not true . Airlines, quite possibly the worst business over the last century , drove (flew?) themselves into the ground for decades with the onset of Reagan-esque Deregulation . It is only with the onset of bankruptcies and consolidation through mergers that the Industry has seen some semblance of market and price discipline . Plus the unions were brought to heel. That in turn has allowed them to pass on rising fuel costs to the consumer through fuel surcharges. However- many airlines were in such a parlous state that they lacked the cash to put up as margin collateral for futures hedging contracts . Even if they wanted to hedge out their avgas bills , they couldn't. Case in point - American Airlines - they don't hedge and pretty much never have , arguing that this was all swings and roundabouts anyway. Others , like Delta , hedged less but went out and bought a refinery - thinking that was a hedge.

Don't also look to the crackers & the E&P guys in the shale space to buckle under too quickly. Those guys HAVE hedged out forward production at prices averaging $90 & those contracts don't roll over till end-2015 for the most part. They're not going to start feeling pain for a while. Prices for crude in the $60's have to hang around for a while before the crackers get hurt (and the Canadian Oil Sands) . I believe that is what the Saudis intend. There's no such thing as a 6 month price war.

Full disclosure - I am a Hedge Fund manager with a large and long-time position in AAL & DAL

So you're saying that airlines don't sign a yearly contract for AV fuel and fix the costs? That's not what I know.

[mep]

No idea !!! :huh:

But I have a better handle on the oil markets than I do on how to tame my Raidhos....

Apparently you and everybody else that owns them-except dealers of course. Dealers have a standard list of reasons why it's your fault for the bass issues to check down through just like a computer call center in India:

Excuse 1) The problem must be your room.
Answer 1) No, my room was purpose built by an acoustician with 5 degrees and it measures perfect.

Excuse 2) The problem must be with your power.
Answer 2) No, my power distribution comes from a balanced power transformer fed into 20A circuits with Furutech GTX-D(R) Rhodium Duplex outlets. We even dug up Nikola Tesla and had him check out the power and he said it was perfect.

Excuse 3) The problem must be with your grounding scheme.
Answer 3) No, I had my grounding installed by a professional electrician with 30 years of experience wiring recording studios. We dug up Nikola Tesla again just to confirm and he said it was perfect and to leave him in the damn ground.

Excuse 4) The problem must be you have resonant cables.
Answer 4) No, my cables were certified to be resonant free by the National Institute of Standards using a variety of network analyzers and spectrum analyzers.

Excuse 5) Your power amplifier has bass issues and you need a new power amplifier because our speakers are "special."
Answer 5), No, the real truth is your speakers have designed in bass problems and everybody who owns them has issues.

:weird:

[Mike]

Now that's funny.


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[JDLaudio]

Now that's funny.


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Some owners don't think so.......??

[Mike]

Some owners don't think so.......??

You need a sense of humor when you hear the excuses.

The fact is, they take a LOT of work to get right, but when you do....oh boy.


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[Alpinist]

..

[Alpinist]

Apparently you and everybody else that owns them-except dealers of course. Dealers have a standard list of reasons why it's your fault for the bass issues to check down through just like a computer call center in India:

Excuse 1) The problem must be your room.
Answer 1) No, my room was purpose built by an acoustician with 5 degrees and it measures perfect.

Excuse 2) The problem must be with your power.
Answer 2) No, my power distribution comes from a balanced power transformer fed into 20A circuits with Furutech GTX-D(R) Rhodium Duplex outlets. We even dug up Nikola Tesla and had him check out the power and he said it was perfect.

Excuse 3) The problem must be with your grounding scheme.
Answer 3) No, I had my grounding installed by a professional electrician with 30 years of experience wiring recording studios. We dug up Nikola Tesla again just to confirm and he said it was perfect and to leave him in the damn ground.

Excuse 4) The problem must be you have resonant cables.
Answer 4) No, my cables were certified to be resonant free by the National Institute of Standards using a variety of network analyzers and spectrum analyzers.

Excuse 5) Your power amplifier has bass issues and you need a new power amplifier because our speakers are "special."
Answer 5), No, the real truth is your speakers have designed in bass problems and everybody who owns them has issues.

:weird:


Uh oh, here we go. Round one....ding!

[FlexibleAudio]

Apparently you and everybody else that owns them-except dealers of course. Dealers have a standard list of reasons why it's your fault for the bass issues to check down through just like a computer call center in India:

Excuse 1) The problem must be your room.
Answer 1) No, my room was purpose built by an acoustician with 5 degrees and it measures perfect.

Excuse 2) The problem must be with your power.
Answer 2) No, my power distribution comes from a balanced power transformer fed into 20A circuits with Furutech GTX-D(R) Rhodium Duplex outlets. We even dug up Nikola Tesla and had him check out the power and he said it was perfect.

Excuse 3) The problem must be with your grounding scheme.
Answer 3) No, I had my grounding installed by a professional electrician with 30 years of experience wiring recording studios. We dug up Nikola Tesla again just to confirm and he said it was perfect and to leave him in the damn ground.

Excuse 4) The problem must be you have resonant cables.
Answer 4) No, my cables were certified to be resonant free by the National Institute of Standards using a variety of network analyzers and spectrum analyzers.

Excuse 5) Your power amplifier has bass issues and you need a new power amplifier because our speakers are "special."
Answer 5), No, the real truth is your speakers have designed in bass problems and everybody who owns them has issues.

:weird:

MEP did you trip and hit your head on a Raidho at CES? Your zealotry is relentless. Oh, and let me guess, you still haven't listened to the speakers.

;)

[JDLaudio]

I had limited exposure to Mike's D'3 speakers. His downstairs room is far from warm, IMHO. Lots of glass, hard flooring, and right side of room opens into a large kitchen area. But yet they had a very "ripe" and warm presentation playing a James Taylor album I've listened to at least 500 times. They did have an intoxicating overall quality though. To me, they seem like a fantastic speaker for the audiophile who excels at system tuning. I would imagine amazing results can be fleshed out, once the proper "loom and room" setup is found.
On the other hand, if you have a nearly impossible room like Mike does upstairs.......GOOD LUCK. Like wise, I do not think these are "set'em and forget'em" speakers for a newbie.....without dealer setup such as David would offer. David's imput would be very valuable with these speakers.

[Mike]

Well said Jerry. With my big living room and VAC phi200's - I had them dialed in PERFECT - with no bass issues. If I wasn't such a gear swapper, I may still have them.

I still think about getting a pair of C1.1's and a Devialet 200 with SAM - that would be incredible sounding I bet.


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[Alpinist]

Well said Jerry. With my big living room and VAC phi200's - I had them dialed in PERFECT - with no bass issues. If I wasn't such a gear swapper, I may still have them.

I still think about getting a pair of C1.1's and a Devialet 200 with SAM - that would be incredible sounding I bet.


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Mike,

I've often wondered why you didn't keep your D3 V2 when you had them working so well. When they are set up properly, they sound phenomenal.

Ken

[JDLaudio]

Well said Jerry. With my big living room and VAC phi200's - I had them dialed in PERFECT - with no bass issues. If I wasn't such a gear swapper, I may still have them.

I still think about getting a pair of C1.1's and a Devialet 200 with SAM - that would be incredible sounding I bet.


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I missed hearing that combo. Those speakers do have some magical qualities that escape many others.

[Mike]

Mike,

I've often wondered why you didn't keep your D3 V2 when you had them working so well. When they are set up properly, they sound phenomenal.

Ken

No reason other than I wanted to try some other gear and I still have my eye on the D5's. I would have them today, but my family room is complicated due to a pathway leading to bedrooms/office. The D5's would have to be too far out into the room.

Upstairs, they caused me no end of frustration. The D1's, D3 v1's and D3 v2's all were boom-boom city....no matter what amp, what cables, etc.

They really load the room, so the speaker/room interaction is HUGE.

That being said, the Raidho's were certainly not the only speaker to cause bass problems in my main room.

But generally speaking, the Raidho's are like the proverbial trophy wife. They require a lot of attention....but when they're right, they pay huge dividends.


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[Alpinist]

I missed hearing that combo. Those speakers do have some magical qualities that escape many others.

+1 With certain music, the sound is revelatory. Two discs that come to mind, Telarc - Copland: Rodeo & Appalachian Spring, and Capital - Classic Sinatra: Someone to Watch Over Me & In the Wee Small Hours of the Morning. I forgot I was listening to loudspeakers.

[Alpinist]

No reason other than I wanted to try some other gear and I still have my eye on the D5's. I would have them today, but my family room is complicated due to a pathway leading to bedrooms/office. The D5's would have to be too far out into the room.

Upstairs, they caused me no end of frustration. The D1's, D3 v1's and D3 v2's all were boom-boom city....no matter what amp, what cables, etc.

They really load the room, so the speaker/room interaction is HUGE.

That being said, the Raidho's were certainly not the only speaker to cause bass problems in my main room.

But generally speaking, the Raidho's are like the proverbial trophy wife. They take require a lot of attention....but when they're right, they pay huge dividends.


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Thanks for your response, Mike. Do you think you would dip your toe in the water again if Raidho came out with a D4? Basically a D5 with the top two woofers and top bass port chopped off. I think the 6 inch woofers and front bass port reduce bass issues.

Ken

[Mike]

Thanks for your response, Mike. Do you think you would dip your toe in the water again if Raidho came out with a D4? Basically a D5 with the top two woofers and top bass port chopped off. I think the 6 inch woofers and front bass port reduce bass issues.

Ken

I MIGHT and what you mention is a real possibility (shhhh....)

But I've owned three pairs of Raidho's. They all had periods of magic followed by periods of frustration. Mark, Jock and myself, with a LOT of help from David worked harder than anyone else to tame these babies. We learned a lot - the hard way.

I would be a little hesitant to do so because of the challenges encountered. Keep in mind, the two pairs of D5's I heard did not have any speaker/room issues. The D5's amaze like few others. But that being said, Raidho with the Devilaet SAM technology could push me over the edge and see me owning a pair one day again. I have yet to hear Raidho's with Devialet SAM, but if its as affective as some are saying, I wouldn't tackle them again with out it.


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[Alpinist]

I MIGHT and what you mention is a real possibility (shhhh....)

But I've owned three pairs of Raidho's. They all had periods of magic followed by periods of frustration. Mark, Jock and myself, with a LOT of help from David worked harder than anyone else to tame these babies. We learned a lot - the hard way.

I would be a little hesitant to do so because of the challenges encountered. Keep in mind, the two pairs of D5's I heard did not have any speaker/room issues. They just amaze like few others. But that being said, Raidho with the Devilaet SAM technology could push me over the edge and see me owning a pair one day again. I have yet to hear Raidho's with Devialet SAM, but if its as affective as some are saying, I wouldn't tackle them again with out it.


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Mike,

From what I've read, Raidho has appeared to solve all bass issues with the D5. I've read no complaints about excessive or boomy bass. IMO, three things have solved the problem: six inch woofers, front bass ports and a ground up redesign of the rear baffle system.

Ken

[Mike]

You're exactly right Ken. The D5's are a big step up from the C4.1's. I've heard both. The D5's, like MBL 101 Xtremes leave you walking away scratching your head wondering how it could get any better. They are one of the greatest speakers I've ever heard. I heard D5's with Soulution, Accuphase and D'Agostino. They all sounded great.


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[Alpinist]

You're exactly right Ken. The D5's are a big step up from the C4.1's. I've heard both. The D5's, like MBL 101 Xtremes leave you walking away scratching your head wondering how it could get any better. They are one of the greatest speakers I've ever heard. I heard D5's with Soulution, Accuphase and D'Agostino. They all sounded great.


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Man, would I love to hook some Raidho D3's up to my Soulution 501's. But I have to admit, even with the proper tweaks, I do still fear having boomy bass in my room. I don't think I would have any concerns if they came out with a D4. But that speaker would probably be out of my price range.

Ken

[Mike]

Ken - if there was any way - any way - you could swing the D5's (a pair just reportedly just sold on Audiogon for under $90,000), you would be on cloud 9.

But aside from that, I do understand your concerns.

Soulution 501's are amazing sounding amps. I love the footprint too!

And let's not forget, you already have some pretty darn good speakers now!


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[kiwi_1282001]

MEP did you trip and hit your head on a Raidho at CES? Your zealotry is relentless. Oh, and let me guess, you still haven't listened to the speakers.

;)




+1.

I believe MEP earlier hinted that he had not listened to Raidho speakers and that his opinion was simply a synoptic regurgitation of the opinions of others. One can only hope that he employs a somewhat different method to constructing his own system. :sigh:

[FlexibleAudio]

+1.

I believe MEP earlier hinted that he had not listened to Raidho speakers and that his opinion was simply a synoptic regurgitation of the opinions of others. One can only hope that he employs a somewhat different method to constructing his own system. :sigh:

Actually I think (hope) MEP just likes to bug us Raidho guys for the fun of it cuz he knows we are the sensitive type. On the other hand maybe he is still upset Nola ran out of wood when they were making his KO's.

:roflmao:

[Alpinist]

Ken - if there was any way - any way - you could swing the D5's (a pair just reportedly just sold on Audiogon for under $90,000), you would be on cloud 9.

But aside from that, I do understand your concerns.

Soulution 501's are amazing sounding amps. I love the footprint too!

And let's not forget, you already have some pretty darn good speakers now!


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Mike,

I wish I could but no chance. The Salon 2's are sounding marvelous with the 501's. Very pure and neutral (just a hint of warmth) with tremendous speed and bass control. My wife says they are perfection and I'd be crazy to change them. She thinks I should get the 520 preamp and be done with it. We'll see. :)

Ken

[bzr]

Ken, if you are running your 501's from the K-01, you will freak if you put a 520 in there. The K-01 might be good, the 520 is in another post code altogether plus the synergy.... ;) come on already :D

[mep]

Actually I think (hope) MEP just likes to bug us Raidho guys for the fun of it cuz he knows we are the sensitive type. On the other hand maybe he is still upset Nola ran out of wood when they were making his KO's.

:roflmao:

i didn't have to own a GM vehicle with a faulty ignition switch to realize GM has a problem with faulty ignition switches. I lifted all of my Raidho excuses right from this forum. I made up the answers, but I didn't make up the excuses.

you seem to keep forgetting that I listened to Raidho speakers at RMAF 2014. All they brought were the two smallest pairs with no bass.

[Mike]

Mike,

I wish I could but no chance. The Salon 2's are sounding marvelous with the 501's. Very pure and neutral (just a hint of warmth) with tremendous speed and bass control. My wife says they are perfection and I'd be crazy to change them. She thinks I should get the 520 preamp and be done with it. We'll see. :)

Ken

Ken - I think you should listen to your wife! :) Also, the Salon 3's are being targeted for CES 2016 launch.

That being said, with a built in phonostage in the 520, you would just HAVE to add a nice table to go along with the 520.....would be such a shame not to utilize the 520's phonostage. :)

[Mike]

Ken - I would clarify that since you already have Soulution, you're already 80% of the way there of tackling any problems you may encounter with the D3/room interaction.

Tough call....I guess it would all come down to listening habits, music preference, room size, etc. If you listen to a lot of rock/pop, and even some standup bass heavy jazz, at relatively loud volumes in a big room, the D3's might not be your best bet. If you listen to classical, female vocals, etc. in a moderately sized room at a moderate level (below 90db @ 1 meter), then the D3's will be excellent.

Let's face it, their are some bad bass heavy recordings that will just give them fits. But the other 90% of the time, it's bliss! The issue is that many people focus on that 10% and it ends up driving them batty.

[Alpinist]

Ken - I would clarify that since you already have Soulution, you're already 80% of the way there of tackling any problems you may encounter with the D3/room interaction.

Tough call....I guess it would all come down to listening habits, music preference, room size, etc. If you listen to a lot of rock/pop, and even some standup bass heavy jazz, at relatively loud volumes in a big room, the D3's might not be your best bet. If you listen to classical, female vocals, etc. in a moderately sized room at a moderate level (below 90db @ 1 meter), then the D3's will be excellent.

Let's face it, their are some bad bass heavy recordings that will just give them fits. But the other 90% of the time, it's bliss! The issue is that many people focus on that 10% and it ends up driving them batty.


Thanks Mike. As always, you make some excellent points. A big part of the reason I purchased the Soulution 501's to begin with is their synergy with Raidho and their ability to tame the bass of the D3's. It almost seems silly not to get the Raidho's after making such a major change to my system. But I have to admit, the Salon 2's sound great with the 501's and it will only get better if I add the 520 preamp and some Kimber Select cables. It is a very tough call and I don't want to blow it.

As for my room, it is 21 feet long, 17 feet wide (at its widest point) and 8 feet high. My system resides on the narrower end of the room, a dedicated area 13 feet 8 inches wide and 6 feet 10 inches deep. As for my listening habits, I never ever listen above 90 db and usually at much lower volumes than that. I primarily listen to jazz vocals (both female and male), jazz piano, jazz guitar and small jazz combos. I do sometimes listen to rock (1965 to 1975) and classical (all types) but always well below 90 db.

Best,
Ken

[FlexibleAudio]

i didn't have to own a GM vehicle with a faulty ignition switch to realize GM has a problem with faulty ignition switches. I lifted all of my Raidho excuses right from this forum. I made up the answers, but I didn't make up the excuses.

Thanks for clearing that up. I feel much better now.

[Mike]

Thanks Mike. As always, you make some excellent points. A big part of the reason I purchased the Soulution 501's to begin with is their synergy with Raidho and their ability to tame the bass of the D3's. It almost seems silly not to get the Raidho's after making such a major change to my system. But I have to admit, the Salon 2's sound great with the 501's and it will only get better if I add the 520 preamp and some Kimber Select cables. It is a very tough call and I don't want to blow it.

As for my room, it is 21 feet long, 17 feet wide (at its widest point) and 8 feet high. My system resides on the narrower end of the room, a dedicated area 13 feet 8 inches wide and 6 feet 10 inches deep. As for my listening habits, I never ever listen above 90 db and usually at much lower volumes than that. I primarily listen to jazz vocals (both female and male), jazz piano, jazz guitar and small jazz combos. I do sometimes listen to rock (1965 to 1975) and classical (all types) but always well below 90 db.

Best,
Ken

Ken - that sure sounds pretty darn good. You may just have to scratch that itch. [emoji15]


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[Alpinist]

Thanks for clearing that up. I feel much better now.

Hi Paul,

Where will you place your Torus 75?

Ken

[Alpinist]

Ken - that sure sounds pretty darn good. You may just have to scratch that itch. [emoji15]


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Mike,

You may have to come over and lobby for me...LOL.

Ken

[FlexibleAudio]

Ken - that sure sounds pretty darn good. You may just have to scratch that itch. [emoji15]


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++1 A match made in heaven.

[FlexibleAudio]

Hi Paul,

Where will you place your Torus 75?

Ken

My listening room is in my basement and I have a utility room behind the wall my components will be on that holds the main power line into the house. I plan to tap into the power ahead of the main panel and run about 20 feet to my Torus which will be in the utility room about about ten feet from the equipment wall. Transformer hum only carries about 3 feet, even for a 75 amp unit. I am then running five 10 foot runs of Furutech Alph-3 cable to five GTX-R receptacles.

[Alpinist]

My listening room is in my basement and I have a utility room behind the wall my components will be on that holds the main power line into the house. I plan to tap into the power ahead of the main panel and run about 20 feet to my Torus which will be in the utility room about about ten feet from the equipment wall. Transformer hum only carries about 3 feet, even for a 75 amp unit. I am then running five 10 foot runs of Furutech Alph-3 cable to five GTX-R receptacles.

Paul,

Wow, sounds excellent and well planned out. Your system is going to be a power champion!

Best of luck,
Ken

[MDP]

Thanks Mike. As always, you make some excellent points. A big part of the reason I purchased the Soulution 501's to begin with is their synergy with Raidho and their ability to tame the bass of the D3's. It almost seems silly not to get the Raidho's after making such a major change to my system. But I have to admit, the Salon 2's sound great with the 501's and it will only get better if I add the 520 preamp and some Kimber Select cables. It is a very tough call and I don't want to blow it.

As for my room, it is 21 feet long, 17 feet wide (at its widest point) and 8 feet high. My system resides on the narrower end of the room, a dedicated area 13 feet 8 inches wide and 6 feet 10 inches deep. As for my listening habits, I never ever listen above 90 db and usually at much lower volumes than that. I primarily listen to jazz vocals (both female and male), jazz piano, jazz guitar and small jazz combos. I do sometimes listen to rock (1965 to 1975) and classical (all types) but always well below 90 db.

Best,
Ken

After reading what you just said, the D3's would most likely be a step up from the great Salon2's. If I never played my music louder than you are, I wouldn't have sold mine. And remember Ken, I went from Salon 2's to D3's.

[Alpinist]

After reading what you just said, the D3's would most likely be a step up from the great Salon2's. If I never played my music louder than you are, I wouldn't have sold mine. And remember Ken, I went from Salon 2's to D3's.

Thanks Mark! Actually, you are the perfect person to ask, as you have owned both the Salon 2 and D3. Considering my music tastes, listening habits and room, do you think the D3 V2 will be a significant improvement over the Salon 2? Also, and this is a little tougher question, did you ever get the D3 to the point where you were fully satisfied with how they sounded in your room?

Thanks so much,
Ken

[MDP]

Thanks Mark! Actually, you are the perfect person to ask, as you have owned both the Salon 2 and D3. Considering my music tastes, listening habits and room, do you think the D3 V2 will be a significant improvement over the Salon 2? Also, and this is a little tougher question, did you ever get the D3 to the point where you were really content with how they sounded in your room?

Thanks so much,
Ken

Yes, I had them sounding excellent , but when I went over 85-90db with Rock music the bass would be a little too much on some albums, but perfect with most.
With your volumes,and especially your music tastes, I think you would love them. And yes, I think they are an upgrade from Salon 2's in your case.

Ken, I loved the Salon 2's very much ! So much so, that whenever they come out with Salon 3's, I'm buying them.

[Alpinist]

Yes, I had them sounding excellent , but when I went over 85-90db with Rock music the bass would be a little too much on some albums, but perfect with most.
With your volumes,and especially your music tastes, I think you would love them. And yes, I think they are an upgrade from Salon 2's in your case.

Thanks Mark, your feedback is greatly appreciated. You have had some fine speakers grace your listening room with even more to come. :)

Ken

[FlexibleAudio]

See below.

[FlexibleAudio]

Ken,

I don't want to in any way indicate anything negative about Mark's Hegel (they are absolutely phenomenal), but I think your 501's will control the D3's bass even better than the H30's given the 501's voicing, damping factor, and slew rate. See if you can get David at Design Audio to opine, I believe he has directly compared the two extensively with Raidho. The amp decision with the Raidho is probably most critical IMO.

[Alpinist]

Ken,

I don't want to in any way indicate anything negative about Mark's Hegel (they are absolutely phenomenal), but I think your 501's will control the D3's bass even better than the H30's given the 501's voicing, damping factor, and slew rate. See if you can get David at Design Audio to opine, I believe he has directly compared the two extensively with Raidho. The amp decision with the Raidho is probably most critical IMO.

Thanks Paul,

I am very happy I purchased the 501's regardless of whether or not I ever purchase Raidho speakers. Their speed and bass control is absolutely stunning. And you make an excellent point, if I do purchase Raidho speakers, especially the D3's, I'll be way ahead of the game in tailoring the bass to my listening room with the 501's voicing, damping factor and slew rate. I really do appreciate your feedback and others who own or have owned these components. It is invaluable.

Best,
Ken

[MDP]

Ken,

I don't want to in any way indicate anything negative about Mark's Hegel (they are absolutely phenomenal), but I think your 501's will control the D3's bass even better than the H30's given the 501's voicing, damping factor, and slew rate. See if you can get David at Design Audio to opine, I believe he has directly compared the two extensively with Raidho. The amp decision with the Raidho is probably most critical IMO.

Paul, I couldn't agree more. On the D3's, the Solution gear is superior, no doubt about it.

[Myles B. Astor]

Thanks Paul,

I am very happy I purchased the 501's regardless of whether or not I ever purchase Raidho speakers. Their speed and bass control is absolutely stunning. And you make an excellent point, if I do purchase Raidho speakers, especially the D3's, I'll be way ahead of the game in tailoring the bass to my listening room with the 501's voicing, damping factor and slew rate. I really do appreciate your feedback and others who own or have owned these components. It is invaluable.

Best,
Ken

Soulution drove the YGs pretty well too. :)

[wisnon]

The Kaiser Kaweros will be here this week and the Chiaras will be here either later this week or next week as well.

I Hope Socfan was able to get over there and hear these speakers.

A little birdie whispered and told me that Telos amps drive these exceptionally well, even without using the built in DSP tech like Proteus and Leonardo!

My buddy is about to get some 352 amps and I will follow up to hear what difference these techs make to his system...

[Rhapsody]

The Kaweros have been here all week at Rhapsody, I think we did 15 demos. They were driven by the Kondo Kagura amps, the Absolare SET amps and a complete Goldmund system. We sold three pairs of Kaisers this week, one pair of Chiara and two pairs of Kaweros. The Kaweros that are here now are being packed up on Sunday and are leaving for their trip to CES, on Monday, along with the Kondo Kagura amps. All will be available to see/hear in our Kondo room at CES (30th floor/Venetian). The Kondo Ginga TT, which will be front ending the Kagura/Kawero combination will be coming back to Rhapsody post CES and will be our permanent demo TT. We have another pair of Kaweros and Chiaras coming in early next week, which will be our permanent demos as well.

Cheers Norman:)

For anyone that hasn't heard the Kaiser speakers whenever/wherever they do they are in for a treat!

[Perfect Sense]

We received the Kaiser (http://perfect-sense.se/varumarken/kaiser) Chiara speakers about two weeks ago. I'm just starting to get to know them, but I can tell you right now that these are very, very special. All together one of the most musically fulfilling speakers I've experienced so far. The tone colour/timbre is beautifully natural in the most organic way. Texture, body and density are all reference grade. I would put them in the same category as Nola and Raidho - all three offering a solid three dimensional presentation which is utterly convincing and realistic focusing on the hole rather than invidvidual bits and pieces. Some might find them a tad dark in balance and perhaps a bit soft in the treble compared to some dome equipped speakers. From my point of view, this is what real music sounds like on a good day...

[Rhapsody]

The most significant aspect of having especially the Kaweros in our showroom is that they have a 92db sensitivity rating with a 6 ohm nominal impedance and don't dip below 4 ohms at any point in the frequency spectrum. We have had the Kondo 50 Watt SET's and the Absolare 52 Watt SET's in our studio for the last year and really never had a speaker that they were matched with properly. All I can say things have changed drastically!

Anyone that heard either either the Kagura amps or the Absolare SET's at Rhapsody prior to the Kaweros arrival have never really heard the Kaguras or the Absolare SET's properly. No need to say anything eles about the sound because the Kawero/Kagura combo will be at CES and available for audition at Rhapsody from now on and into the future. I will let other people discuss the sound once they hear it for themselves.

[wisnon]

Yup Kaiser makes good speakers. Let me know what you think of them with full Goldmund regalia, ie with the DSP deployed. Dr Adam knows what she is doing!

[Rhapsody]

We have one pair of Kaweros that are being delivered in mid January and Dr. Veronique (Vero) is going to be making a customer Leonardo/Proteus configuration for the Kaweros that will run on the Goldmund processor/amps. Will let you know in Feb. how it all sounds. Even without the Leonardo/Proteus room correction, the Goldmund electronics do sound especially good on the Kaweros. Several of our clients liked it as much as with the SET's....comes down to personal preference. The client that is doing the Goldmund with the Kaweros plays his system 12+ hours a day, everyday, so tubes really don't make a lot of sense.

[wisnon]

Drooling! Let me know how that config sounds. I am imagining not just a home run, but the ball being hit out of the Park and landing 2 city blocks away! LoL

I saw a Chiara being primed up for special treatment...

[socfan12]

I Hope Socfan was able to get over there and hear these speakers.

A little birdie whispered and told me that Telos amps drive these exceptionally well, even without using the built in DSP tech like Proteus and Leonardo!

My buddy is about to get some 352 amps and I will follow up to hear what difference these techs make to his system...

Hey Norman,

Unfortunately, no. I've been swamped at work. Maybe after the CES show in the new year I'll make it out to Bob's to give them a listen. I recently purchased a pair of S5s from Bob, so I'm actually worried about hearing the Kaiser speakers so soon! But I will definitely make a trip to hear them!

[Perfect Sense]

A couple of shots from our showroom in Stockholm for those interested:

https://www.facebook.com/PerfectSenseAudioMatters/photos/a.373259796165538.1073741835.175376815953838/393761180782066/?type=1&theater

https://www.facebook.com/PerfectSenseAudioMatters/photos/a.373259796165538.1073741835.175376815953838/393759024115615/?type=1&theater

[wisnon]

Hey Norman,

Unfortunately, no. I've been swamped at work. Maybe after the CES show in the new year I'll make it out to Bob's to give them a listen. I recently purchased a pair of S5s from Bob, so I'm actually worried about hearing the Kaiser speakers so soon! But I will definitely make a trip to hear them!
I see…Given that, stay far away from temptation.

[Rhapsody]

The only problem is that if Allen comes over then I am going to tempt him with the new Absolare 85 Watt Push Pull amps that will be debuting at CES. They will sound crazy good on the S5's! We are now set up with the 52 Watt Absolare SET's with the Kaweros and the 85 Watt PP Absolares for the Magicos. Our Raidhos sound best with the Absolare pre and Goldmund amplification.

Norman, love the pics of your set up! Also like the white Chiaras in Hyperions room!!!

[socfan12]

You're killing me, Bob...!:P

[Rhapsody]

You're killing me, Bob...!:P

You already have a world class, great system...enjoy! And happy holidays!!!

[dlb2]

Bob, are there any pics of the new Absolare amps floating around? Would love to see them.

[Rhapsody]

Bob, are there any pics of the new Absolare amps floating around? Would love to see them.

Hi Doug,

Not yet, not until CES I think, but if they are available prior I will post them. They will look VERY similar to the SET amps, (basically the same build and aesthetics) but will be PP at around 100 Watts.

[dlb2]

Hi Doug,

Not yet, not until CES I think, but if they are available prior I will post them. They will look VERY similar to the SET amps, (basically the same build and aesthetics) but will be PP at around 100 Watts.

Thanks Bob. Happy Holidays.

[socfan12]

You already have a world class, great system...enjoy! And happy holidays!!!

Thanks, Bob, and same to you! Speak to you in the New Year!

[Rhapsody]

I have had a few pm's asking about the Kaiser Chiaras specifically. They are now in the studio along with the Kaweros and available for demo. They will get better with hours on them, but they put some hours at the factory specifically with the Chiaras. The drivers are burned in at the factory but the Dueland components in the Xovers need 200-300 hours, but they are totally demonstrable right now. Happy Holidays!

After playing the Chiaras in our studio we have found that the Absolare 50 Watt SET's drive the Chiaras VERY WELL, no issue whatsoever. As a matter of fact driving the Chiaras with 50 Watts and adding a sub(s) crossed over at around 35-40Hz sounds very similar to the Kaweros. Quite surprising to us but Rainer, the designer has shown the Chiaras with 30 Watt SET's at shows, so I guess it should not have been surpising.

[wisnon]

I have had a few pm's asking about the Kaiser Chiaras specifically. They are now in the studio along with the Kaweros and available for demo. They will get better with hours on them, but they put some hours at the factory specifically with the Chiaras. The drivers are burned in at the factory but the Dueland components in the Xovers need 200-300 hours, but they are totally demonstrable right now. Happy Holidays!
Very nice speakers…I recall making a note of that at the Warsaw show.

[vertigen]

i've heard then in Warsaw too but nothing special, everything wasok but not nirvana:) not my cup of tea