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Thread: Top Tier Amps
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March 20, 2021, 10:05 AM #1
Top Tier Amps
I don’t know about you guys, but I see the amp market currently in basically four tiers:
Tier 1: Gryphon, Boulder, Block Audio, Soulution, CH, D’Ag, Dart, Constellation, Goldmund, FM Acoustics, Vitus, MSB, VAC, Kondo, Wavac, etc.
Tier 2: T+A, MBL, VTL, Nagra, Spectral, Esoteric, AudioNet, Rowland, Air Tight, Accuphase, etc.
Tier 3: Luxman, Sim, Pass, Naim, Classe’, Bryston, Hegel, ARC, Ayre, Mcintosh, PS Audio, Audio Arts, etc.
Tier 4: Parasound, Bel Canto, Wyred, Cambridge, NAD, etc.
The marketplace for top tier amps is more crowded than ever with newcomers like Pillium, Block and others.
What are your thoughts on the current amp market?
Will we see a resurgence from brands like Ayre, Accustic Arts (an amp/preamp I had in the store and was floored by their performance) or Zanden or Ypsilon?
Will we see newcomers like Block and others gaining interest or will the stranglehold from the big boys continue to hold?My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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March 20, 2021, 10:11 AM #2
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- 572
Re: Top Tier Amps
Tier 1 adding - Spectral , Esoteric Grandioso and Nagra
Never heard it - but, what about MSB amps?
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March 20, 2021, 10:18 AM #3
Re: Top Tier Amps
My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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March 20, 2021, 10:37 AM #4
Re: Top Tier Amps
Cue everyone on the forum who thinks they have a “giant killer” amp that should be in tier 1 in 3,2...
Morgan
NEW SYSTEM UNDER CONSTRUCTION
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March 20, 2021, 10:48 AM #5
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- May 2016
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- 572
Re: Top Tier Amps
Yes,
Spectral SV amps specifically, their highest end tier.
Although not cheap but, their value is they compete with the best Switzerland (low distortion, high resolution and extreme neutrality)
Might not be everyone's cup of tea or subjective preference.
But, when you consider in US MSRP , many of these Swiss Tier 1 monoblocks are 100k ish a pair.
Spectral is value in this regard.
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March 20, 2021, 10:52 AM #6
Top Tier Amps
I like Spectral, but I don’t consider it in Tier 1. It’s solid in Tier 2 with a great group of performers, including my own personal amps!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk ProMy Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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March 20, 2021, 11:18 AM #7
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March 20, 2021, 11:22 AM #8
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Re: Top Tier Amps
maybe based on cost, but I really think amps come down to circuit and speaker match moreso than other components. for instance, Ayre on the right speaker sounds better than amps with tons of negative feedback like Soulution/Audionet to my ears. super duper 1000w SS behemoths don't sound good on horns. in tubeland, same problem - many would argue SET sounds better than any of the massed tetrode amps from the big 3.
i also think there are very few good SS amps, so there's that.
ps. I just read that Halcro's back lolBrinkmann Bardo w/ EMT HSD-006 cart, MSB Reference DAC --> Linear Tube Audio MicroZOTL --> Ampzilla 2000, 2nd Edition --> Fyne Audio F1-12
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March 20, 2021, 11:29 AM #9
Re: Top Tier Amps
I have not had the opportunity to spend much time with several of the amps so for the most part I'll defer to your experience. I will say that in many instances the Tier an amp may fall into will depend on ther associated speaker. For example if you have MBL speakers then MBL 9 series amps would we Tier 1. With some speakers (larger Focals) Accuphase easy moves up a Tier or two in your list. The one "I" believe you missed was McIntosh. With most speakers they belong above everything besides Accuphase in Tiers 3 and 4.
Jim
D'Agostino Momentum M-400's MxV’s & HD Pre-amp
Wilson Alexandria X2 Series 2 speakers
Digital: dCS Vivaldi APEX DAC, Clock & Upsampler
Analog: SME 20/3 with Esoteric E-03 Phono
Transparent Opus Speaker Cable & Interconnects & Opus Power Cords
Power Cords on Digital: Shunyata
Power Conditioner - Shunyata Everest
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March 20, 2021, 11:53 AM #10
Re: Top Tier Amps
EMM in the top tier?
Sent from my iPad using TapatalkPreamp/Digital: Meitner MA3
HT Processor: Bryston SP3
Amps: Bryston 14b3, Bryston 4b3
Speakers: Kef Reference 5, Kef Reference 4c
Sub: REL Carbon Special
Power: Shunyata Denali, Bryston BIT15
Wires: Wireworld Silver Eclipse XLR & SC, Ethernet - WW Platinum USB
Other: Stillpoint Ultra SS, ISO-Acoustics ISO Pucks
-Kyle
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March 20, 2021, 12:43 PM #11
Re: Top Tier Amps
My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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March 20, 2021, 01:12 PM #12
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- 317
Re: Top Tier Amps
Mike,
Interesting list. I am in no way challenging your conclusions -- after all you have by far the most experience in terms of actual detailed audition of electronics from top notch brands and at the end of the day, this is a subjective list. I just have a couple of comments. First of all, in my opinion, some of this is driven by the advertising and the "reputation" of various brands. If it is a boutique manufacturer coming out of a small European company, it must be great -- case in point is CH Precision. I do not have much of an opinion on it since I have only heard their electronics once at RMAF but you have commented on more than 1 occasion that you think the sound is too dry and analytical. Yet, you still put the brand in Tier 1.
The second pertains to Accuphase -- we all rag on Accuphase because of the crazy US pricing strategy by the distributor (I would include myself in that category) but I have been amazed by my Accuphase A70 amp and would feel confident in putting it up against any brand on this list (not in terms of sheer power but for quality of sound). If there was a way you could have the top of the line Accupase A250 monoblocks in your store, I would be curious to see where you put them.
Anshul
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March 20, 2021, 01:34 PM #13
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Re: Top Tier Amps
Looks as if most expensive amps are on tier I so the list is based on amp cost, not necessarily on sound quality?
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March 20, 2021, 01:38 PM #14
Re: Top Tier Amps
My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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March 20, 2021, 01:45 PM #15
Re: Top Tier Amps
Have only heard them via FaceTime with Ed’s son on a pair of Wilson Alexx he had in the shop.
There was a pair here in Minneapolis at some reviewers house last year, and I was going to get connected with him for a listen to perhaps buy them after his review. Covid hit, so I never got over there, and it sounds like he decided to keep them.. so they never made the journey over to my house in route back to EMM.
We’re looking at moving back to West Palm for 6 months of the year, so I’m either going to build a 2nd system.. or create 2 smaller ones from some of my existing gear. EMM amps will most certainly come into the discussion when I start that process.
Sent from my iPad using TapatalkPreamp/Digital: Meitner MA3
HT Processor: Bryston SP3
Amps: Bryston 14b3, Bryston 4b3
Speakers: Kef Reference 5, Kef Reference 4c
Sub: REL Carbon Special
Power: Shunyata Denali, Bryston BIT15
Wires: Wireworld Silver Eclipse XLR & SC, Ethernet - WW Platinum USB
Other: Stillpoint Ultra SS, ISO-Acoustics ISO Pucks
-Kyle
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March 20, 2021, 01:57 PM #16
Top Tier Amps
Fair question. I wasn’t thinking of “what is my favorite’s and ranking accordingly”, but rather market perception. CH might not be your cup of tea, but does the market consider it a top tier brand? I think so. No? For example, to use a car analogy, I would never buy a Mercedes Benz because I can still envision my music teacher from the 1970’s driving away in her noisy, black smoke billowing out the back end power blue Mercedes. Sometimes, you just can’t those visions out of your head you know. Does this mean it’s not a “tier 1” luxury car brand? No. Which brings us to a whole other topic of FIRST IMPRESSIONS. If I had a dollar for every time someone walked in the store and said “oh, I will never consider a Magico, I heard them once 10 years ago, I think it was a Q5 and I didn’t care for it”, I would could take a nice vacation. No matter how many times you say, “but...but...but...Magico’s today have evolved tremendously”, they have that stuck in their head. It’s my job then to play them the M2’s and I have to tell you, many of those folks listened in disbelief, no kidding, some even had to get up and get the back of the speaker to make sure I didn’t put in some other brand. No kidding. And some even bought them. We are all guilty of first impression bias. Myself included.
My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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March 20, 2021, 02:01 PM #17
Top Tier Amps
I wasn’t sure on Audionet. I know their new Heisenberg is getting some attention, but maybe it’s more tier 2?
(Adjusted)My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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March 20, 2021, 02:12 PM #18
Re: Top Tier Amps
Mike,
Is this list based on prices alone or is it subjective?
If subjective, would you mind elaborate a bit on your thought process please?
Thanks!Audiophile on paper, poor bastard in reality...
Dell desktop / JRiver / Arcam rDac / Pro-Ject Essential II Digital / NAD C 315 BEE / Totem Arro / Blue Jeans Cables
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March 20, 2021, 02:18 PM #19
Re: Top Tier Amps
I think some company's line-ups vary considerably, others might be consistent across their range
For instance, Soulution 700 series are highly regarded, the 500 stuff (which I owned) pretty pedestrian. So here 700 series Tier 1, 500 series Tier 4
Also what about DartZeel?"We all know real when we hear it"
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March 20, 2021, 02:25 PM #20
Re: Top Tier Amps
Fair point. I wasn’t thinking too much about the product (although I did split pass and one or two others), I was thinking more about perception. Soulution, I think, is perceived as tier 1. They do make the 3 series, which is maybe tier 3 level, but I think Soulution is regarded as top tier.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk ProMy Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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March 20, 2021, 02:52 PM #21
Re: Top Tier Amps
I'll just say that my personal opinion on the audio quality of amplifiers doesn't necessarily match with the perceived amount of prestige (or price).
Neko Audio
Authorized Dealer: AC Infinity, APC, Audeze, Bryston, Devialet, Elite HTS, Fortress Seating, JMF Audio, JVC, Kaleidescape, LG, LUMIN, Magico, Ortofon, RME, Samsung, Soulution, STAX, Trinnov, Vivid Audio, Weiss & more.
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March 20, 2021, 03:05 PM #22
Re: Top Tier Amps
Preamp/Digital: Meitner MA3
HT Processor: Bryston SP3
Amps: Bryston 14b3, Bryston 4b3
Speakers: Kef Reference 5, Kef Reference 4c
Sub: REL Carbon Special
Power: Shunyata Denali, Bryston BIT15
Wires: Wireworld Silver Eclipse XLR & SC, Ethernet - WW Platinum USB
Other: Stillpoint Ultra SS, ISO-Acoustics ISO Pucks
-Kyle
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March 20, 2021, 03:47 PM #23
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- La Canada, CA
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- 50
Re: Top Tier Amps
DartZeel is in Tier 1
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March 20, 2021, 03:51 PM #24
Re: Top Tier Amps
Not too long ago I spent quite a bit of time researching and pre - COVID demoing many amps on your list. Here's a few more I'd add:
Tier 1: Lamm
Tier 2: Burmester, T+A, Merrill
Also, FWIW I've heard CH Precision several times and never found them to be cold, dry and sterile sounding at all. I did find them to be the most dynamic and the fastest amps I've ever heard. They were the closest to a real band I've ever heard in terms of overall accuracy / realism on a pair of Arrakis in a well - set up system.
Finally I'd put Audionet back in the Tier one category. Their Heisenberg amps are over $100K and I can attest to them certainly competing with Gryphon and CH Precision.
My 2 cents :-)4x20A circuits | Shunyata Triton + Typhon | Source 1: HDPlex HD100 PSU -> OCX clock + EtherRegen -> Paul Hynes SR4T + HDPlex HD500 PSUs -> Music PC w/JCAT XE nic, Squeezebox, Roon, Tidal / Qobuz | TotalDAC Live PSU + D1 Twelve Mk II DAC + Mk II streamer | Source 2: Acoustic Signature Ascona TT | Kuzma 4 point tonearm | Koetsu Rosewood Signature cart | Pass XP-15 phono pre | Audionet Pre G2 preamp | Audionet Max mono blocks | Vivid Audio Giya Spirits | 4 JL Audio Fathom subs | Echole ICs /SCs / Siltech King jumpers, Shunyata/Audioquest PCs / Eth. Cs | Critical Mass CS2s -> components, Isoacoustics -> speakers + subs | Adona Altair reference and Eris II racks | Fully treated and dedicated 2 channel room
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March 20, 2021, 04:04 PM #25
Re: Top Tier Amps
so much great gear, so little rack space!
however, not nearly enough SET tube love in the list for my tastes. for example what about kondo, air tight, thomas mayer, wavac, audio tekne and similar?
however, to be fair this type amp most often comes from smaller, artisanal companies ...so, they are not on the radar for many.viking acoustics berlin r mk2 | air tight atc-5 + atm-300r | clearaudio concept + virtuoso v2 MM | t+a dac8 dsd + kanjiroba diy transport + roon rock
alp-tone audio analog cables | core audio designs plyKraft 3L | hifi racks ltd podium t5-iii
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March 20, 2021, 04:05 PM #26
Re: Top Tier Amps
My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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March 20, 2021, 04:07 PM #27
Re: Top Tier Amps
My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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March 20, 2021, 04:36 PM #28
Re: Top Tier Amps
Preamp/Digital: Meitner MA3
HT Processor: Bryston SP3
Amps: Bryston 14b3, Bryston 4b3
Speakers: Kef Reference 5, Kef Reference 4c
Sub: REL Carbon Special
Power: Shunyata Denali, Bryston BIT15
Wires: Wireworld Silver Eclipse XLR & SC, Ethernet - WW Platinum USB
Other: Stillpoint Ultra SS, ISO-Acoustics ISO Pucks
-Kyle
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March 20, 2021, 04:43 PM #29
- Join Date
- Aug 2014
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- east of Seattle
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- 821
Re: Top Tier Amps
i think WAVAC is top tier. been around awhile. most expensive amp ever reviewed by Stereophile.
Wavac SH-833 monoblock power amplifier | Stereophile.com
and Fremer loved it.my system on Audiogon; https://www.audiogon.com/systems/615
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March 20, 2021, 04:46 PM #30
Re: Top Tier Amps
where's' Rowland? Jeff almost single-handedly brought differentially balanced connections to high-end consumer audio in the late 80s before anyone would touch it. Jeff was also pushing the SOTA for SS designs before Ch Precision and Soulution were even a glimmer in their founder's eyes.
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March 20, 2021, 04:55 PM #31
Re: Top Tier Amps
Updated. Lamm is a weird one. Not sure where to put them. Resale is atrocious, so not sure how accurate the MSRP is of the performance. Tier 2?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk ProMy Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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March 20, 2021, 05:09 PM #32
Re: Top Tier Amps
For perception, I'm not sure I'd put Constellation and Vitus in tier 1.
Jock
If you have integrity, nothing else matters. If you don't have integrity, nothing else matters.
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House: Naim ND555/2PS, Naim 552, Naim 500, Studer A80/Doshi V3, Magico M2s, 2 Magico Q-Sub 15s, Lumina IC/SC, Shunyata Everest and Omega PCs.
Workshop: Naim ND555/2 PS, VAC Master Pre, VAC Sig 200iQ, Border Patrol pre/power, Avant Garde Duo Mezzo XD, 2 Magico Q-Sub 15s, Shunyata IC/SC, Shunyata Typhon QR/Triton V3/Sigma PCs.
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March 20, 2021, 05:09 PM #33
Re: Top Tier Amps
I knew this thread would stir the pot.
Ken"No summit worth climbing is easily attained."
--------------------------------------------
Source: MSB Select II DAC with Two Mono Powerbases and Femto 33 Clock; Renderer V2 Digital Input Module and Roon Nucleus Plus; MSB UMT V Signature Transport
Amps: Vandersteen M7-HPA Mono Amps; MSB M204 Mono Amps
Speakers: Vandersteen Model 7 Mk2
Power: Two AudioQuest Niagara 5000’s with AudioQuest Dragon and Hurricane Power Cords
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March 20, 2021, 05:19 PM #34
Re: Top Tier Amps
Vitus Tier 1 , VAC tier 2 , find that a bit backwards for me also unless Spectral has deteriorated over the years they are easily Tier 1 stuff ...!
Vitus is Tier2/3 IMO..
MSB amp look the part would love to see proper trst bench measurements for compare to Boulder ...!
Regards
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March 20, 2021, 05:29 PM #35
Re: Top Tier Amps
Also best amp is best for the load being driven ....
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March 20, 2021, 06:06 PM #36
Re: Top Tier Amps
4x20A circuits | Shunyata Triton + Typhon | Source 1: HDPlex HD100 PSU -> OCX clock + EtherRegen -> Paul Hynes SR4T + HDPlex HD500 PSUs -> Music PC w/JCAT XE nic, Squeezebox, Roon, Tidal / Qobuz | TotalDAC Live PSU + D1 Twelve Mk II DAC + Mk II streamer | Source 2: Acoustic Signature Ascona TT | Kuzma 4 point tonearm | Koetsu Rosewood Signature cart | Pass XP-15 phono pre | Audionet Pre G2 preamp | Audionet Max mono blocks | Vivid Audio Giya Spirits | 4 JL Audio Fathom subs | Echole ICs /SCs / Siltech King jumpers, Shunyata/Audioquest PCs / Eth. Cs | Critical Mass CS2s -> components, Isoacoustics -> speakers + subs | Adona Altair reference and Eris II racks | Fully treated and dedicated 2 channel room
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March 20, 2021, 06:06 PM #37
Re: Top Tier Amps
My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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March 20, 2021, 06:23 PM #38
Re: Top Tier Amps
To me, Vitus, Aavik, Naim etc all have a vocal following. But that does not mean that the general perception of the brand is tier 1 or even tier 2.
If somebody came and asked me what to definitely listen to with a "money no object" attitude. None of those would be on my list, even tho for example the Naim Statement pre/power is truly amazing - $250,000 they better be, and certainly rivals any other tier 1 pre/power. But ... if we are going with perception. Nope - not tier 1.Jock
If you have integrity, nothing else matters. If you don't have integrity, nothing else matters.
---------
House: Naim ND555/2PS, Naim 552, Naim 500, Studer A80/Doshi V3, Magico M2s, 2 Magico Q-Sub 15s, Lumina IC/SC, Shunyata Everest and Omega PCs.
Workshop: Naim ND555/2 PS, VAC Master Pre, VAC Sig 200iQ, Border Patrol pre/power, Avant Garde Duo Mezzo XD, 2 Magico Q-Sub 15s, Shunyata IC/SC, Shunyata Typhon QR/Triton V3/Sigma PCs.
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March 20, 2021, 06:24 PM #39
Re: Top Tier Amps
One or two great products does NOT make a brand.
Jock
If you have integrity, nothing else matters. If you don't have integrity, nothing else matters.
---------
House: Naim ND555/2PS, Naim 552, Naim 500, Studer A80/Doshi V3, Magico M2s, 2 Magico Q-Sub 15s, Lumina IC/SC, Shunyata Everest and Omega PCs.
Workshop: Naim ND555/2 PS, VAC Master Pre, VAC Sig 200iQ, Border Patrol pre/power, Avant Garde Duo Mezzo XD, 2 Magico Q-Sub 15s, Shunyata IC/SC, Shunyata Typhon QR/Triton V3/Sigma PCs.
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March 20, 2021, 06:51 PM #40
Top Tier Amps
How about this: No Boulder product on the latest Stereophile recommended A list, but the new Classé Delta Monos are?
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk“Life’s too short to listen to bad audio.”
Big rig: Brinkmann Taurus DD TT + 12.1 arm + Lyra Etna Lambda SL MC + HRS M3X2/ Cardas Clear Beyond phono/ Stillpoints LPI/ Brinkmann Edison mk2 phono + RöNT II Tube PS/ Synology NAS with Roon + HD Plex linear PSU + Shunyata HD/ AQ Vodka RJ45 + Aqvox Network Switch SE + AQ Diamond RJ45 into DAC/ Brinkmann Nyquist mk2/ Audionet Humboldt/ Cardas Clear Beyond ICs/ Kharma DB9-S 1.1 LS/ Inakustik Reference LS 4004 AIR/ Audioquest Niagara 5000/ Shunyata Alpha power (HC, Analogue, Digital)/ Finite Elemente Pagode Rack/ Stillpoints Ultra SS/ Vicoustic panels + Stillpoints Aperture II.
Small rig: Naim UnitiServe/ Curious USB/ Tidal/ Linn Klimax DS3/ Shunyata Power cable/ Pass Labs INT-60/ Acoustic Zen Silver Reference II/ HiD Diamond 8/ Harbeth 30.2 40th Anniversary/ Shunyata Venom EU7 & Venom 3 HD.
HP rig: MacBookAir/ Tidal/ Auralic Gemini 2000/ Sbooster LPSU/ Audeze LCD-2 Classic + WyWires Red/ Shunyata HD/ Shunyata Hydra 2/ Shunyata Venom.
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March 20, 2021, 07:02 PM #41
Re: Top Tier Amps
My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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March 20, 2021, 07:32 PM #42
- Join Date
- May 2016
- Posts
- 572
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March 20, 2021, 07:33 PM #43
- Join Date
- May 2016
- Posts
- 572
Re: Top Tier Amps
Where's McIntosh ? :-)
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March 20, 2021, 07:59 PM #44My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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March 20, 2021, 08:12 PM #45"No summit worth climbing is easily attained."
--------------------------------------------
Source: MSB Select II DAC with Two Mono Powerbases and Femto 33 Clock; Renderer V2 Digital Input Module and Roon Nucleus Plus; MSB UMT V Signature Transport
Amps: Vandersteen M7-HPA Mono Amps; MSB M204 Mono Amps
Speakers: Vandersteen Model 7 Mk2
Power: Two AudioQuest Niagara 5000’s with AudioQuest Dragon and Hurricane Power Cords
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March 20, 2021, 08:14 PM #46
Re: Top Tier Amps
Amplification: DartZeel 468 (2) // DartZeel NHB18NS Mk. II
Tuner: MagnumDynalab 108T/SE
Table/Cart: J.Sikora Reference // Integrity HiFi Tru-Glider - DSAudio GrandMaster EX // Integrity HiFI Tru-Glider - Ortofon A Mono
Equalizer/Phono Pre: DSAudio Master3
Speakers: TAD R-1 MkII, REL Six Pack of REL Carbon Specials
Power: Nordost QBase8 Mk3, QX4, Qkore1, 3 and 6 (chassis), QK1 (2), QV2 (2), Chord GroundAray (signal), Chord Line Aray (3), Chord Professional, AddPOWR EAU2 (2)
DAC/Serv-stream: LampiZator Horizon/ Taiko Extreme
Elrod Master Statement Diamond SE Speaker Cables
Elrod Master Statement Diamond PCs (7), Evolution Acoustics 50 ohm (Zeel Connection), Nordost Odin2 IC (2), Nordost Valhalla II USB, CH Acoustic X20 IC, Final Touch Audio Elara PCs (6)
AudioDesk Systeme RCM
CMS Ultra 2.0 Footers TT (2) and TD (2), Revopods (2) and SortKones and EVPs where they work
Critical Mass Systems Ultra-Q Rack > Silence Focus Amp Stands
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March 20, 2021, 08:15 PM #47
Top Tier Amps
I think it was stated here before, you must admit the list looks more like price tiers list than a an actual SQ tiers list.
Anyhow I’m not sure I agree with the tiers list. Besides, MSB advertises a lots in Stereophile, but yet they’re nowhere to be found. Classé does not, and still their Delta Monos are rated class A. So the advertising point does not really appear to apply.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk“Life’s too short to listen to bad audio.”
Big rig: Brinkmann Taurus DD TT + 12.1 arm + Lyra Etna Lambda SL MC + HRS M3X2/ Cardas Clear Beyond phono/ Stillpoints LPI/ Brinkmann Edison mk2 phono + RöNT II Tube PS/ Synology NAS with Roon + HD Plex linear PSU + Shunyata HD/ AQ Vodka RJ45 + Aqvox Network Switch SE + AQ Diamond RJ45 into DAC/ Brinkmann Nyquist mk2/ Audionet Humboldt/ Cardas Clear Beyond ICs/ Kharma DB9-S 1.1 LS/ Inakustik Reference LS 4004 AIR/ Audioquest Niagara 5000/ Shunyata Alpha power (HC, Analogue, Digital)/ Finite Elemente Pagode Rack/ Stillpoints Ultra SS/ Vicoustic panels + Stillpoints Aperture II.
Small rig: Naim UnitiServe/ Curious USB/ Tidal/ Linn Klimax DS3/ Shunyata Power cable/ Pass Labs INT-60/ Acoustic Zen Silver Reference II/ HiD Diamond 8/ Harbeth 30.2 40th Anniversary/ Shunyata Venom EU7 & Venom 3 HD.
HP rig: MacBookAir/ Tidal/ Auralic Gemini 2000/ Sbooster LPSU/ Audeze LCD-2 Classic + WyWires Red/ Shunyata HD/ Shunyata Hydra 2/ Shunyata Venom.
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March 20, 2021, 08:29 PM #48
Re: Top Tier Amps
My Systems: http://www.audioshark.org/showthread...481#post158481
"We can hear everything we measure, but we can't measure everything we hear. Let your ears be your guide."
Dealer for: Aqua Hi-Fi, Aurender, AudioQuest Cables & Power Products, Berkeley Audio, Block Audio (distributor), Boulder Amplifiers, Bowers & Wilkins (B&W), Bryston, Clarisys Audio Loudspeakers (distributor), Classe’ Audio, Degritter Record Cleaning Machines, Esoteric, Finite Elemente, FirstWatt, Focal Loudspeakers and Headphones, GigaFoil, Harbeth Loudspeakers, Hegel, HiFi Man, Innuos, ISO Acoustics, Keces Power Supplies, Kharma Loudspeakers and Electronics, Kuzma Turntables, Lumin, Luxman, Magico Loudspeakers, MBL Speakers & Electronics, MSB Technologies, MySonicLabs Phono Cartridges, Nordost Cables, Ortofon, Pass Labs, Quadraspire, Rega Turntables and Electronics, Shunyata Research, STAX, Stein Music Products, Stillpoints, Soulution, VAC, Vicoustics, Viva Audio, VPI Industries, WireWorld Cables.
https://suncoastaudio.com/
Phone: 941-932-0282
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Suncoast-Au...1105178279194/
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March 20, 2021, 08:29 PM #49
Re: Top Tier Amps
I would move esoteric grandioso to tier 1 and luxman to tier 2. Would add thrax at tier 1
Fyne Audio F1-12, Octave RE 320, Aries Cerat Incito S, Aries Cerat Kassandra II ref, Aurender N20
Townshend supertweeters, Sotm SNH 10G ethernet switch, Nordost QKORE 3 grounding
Skogrand Tchaikovsky, Skogrand Wagner, Triangle-art Isis, hemingway Z core beta, ansuz C2, Echole omnia, Audience frontrow, SR sigma 2, Combax Hijiri million, PAD diamond, Sablon.
Torus RM 20 power conditioner, furutech wall socket
Vicoustics and GIK acoustics, Solid tech rack of silence, Adona zero GXT-3, Iso-acoustics Gaia1, Townshend platform, Alto extreme, Stillpoints, Symposium
Secondary system: B&W 702 S2 with Naim Uniti atom.
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March 20, 2021, 09:44 PM #50
Re: Top Tier Amps
It's about perception and MBL is tier 2? Really?
My perception is that Nagra is definitely, definitely, definitely tier 1... and Gryphon would be tier 2...
We all have a voice, don't we?
Audiophile on paper, poor bastard in reality...
Dell desktop / JRiver / Arcam rDac / Pro-Ject Essential II Digital / NAD C 315 BEE / Totem Arro / Blue Jeans Cables
AudioShark - The Best High End Audio Discussion forum.
AudioShark forum is a leading forum site for High End Audio Discussion, Stereo System Discussion, Home Theater System Discussion, Best Home Stereo System Discussion, Home Theater Installation Discussion etc.
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Audioshark is a community of like minded individuals. Audioshark welcomes participation from all manufacturers and owners of all brands and products. It is our belief that online forums provide a community of like minded audiophiles and music lovers to encourage the growth of this wonderful hobby.
Sincerely,
The Audioshark.org Team
AudioShark forum is a leading forum site for High End Audio Discussion, Stereo System Discussion, Home Theater System Discussion, Best Home Stereo System Discussion, Home Theater Installation Discussion etc.
The AudioShark forum was created for sharing the passion of high-end Audio. We have Audiophiles from all over the world participating and sharing their knowledge. From novice to experts, you will find a friendly environment for discussing about High End Audio, Stereo System, Home Theater System, Home Stereo System, Home Theater Installation, Amplifiers, Speakers, Subwoofers, Integrated System, Acoustic treatments & Digital Room Corrections and many more.
At AudioShark, we also have incorporated an exciting Marketplace where members can peruse terrific buys on used gear, as well as meet dealers and discuss the purchase of new gear.
We are as crazy about this hobby as you are! So come on in and join us! Audioshark.org the Friendliest Audio Forum!
Industry Participation Disclosure : The owner and administrator of Audioshark is the owner of Suncoast Audio LLC in Sarasota Florida. Suncoast Audio has a full brick and mortar presence in Sarasota with several great show rooms with many world class brands. More information can be found at http://www.suncoastaudio.com
Audioshark is a community of like minded individuals. Audioshark welcomes participation from all manufacturers and owners of all brands and products. It is our belief that online forums provide a community of like minded audiophiles and music lovers to encourage the growth of this wonderful hobby.
Sincerely,
The Audioshark.org Team
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