Are subwoofers bad for music?
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  1. #1
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    Are subwoofers bad for music?

    Steve Guttenberg


    Dan

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  2. #2
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    Re: Are subwoofers bad for music?

    Been there, done that. No thank you.

  3. #3
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    Are subwoofers bad for music?

    Dan, itís definitely an interesting topic. I had REL G1 Mk2 subs and Jim and I tried integrating them with the Magico M3ís and we gave up after hours of trying. The RELís were slow and sluggish and were ďtaking awayĒ and didnít have any new technologies for room integration. Basically, move them around and hope for the best. They failed to integrate with the fast Magicoís.

    Over the years, Iíve had sunfire subs with my Maggieís and they worked great and many other subs. Some were good and some, not so much.

    Iíve heard several Magico setups with JL Audio subs and those were always awesome and wicked fast. JL Audio, like Magico and others have superb room integration technology.

    But the best subs Iíve ever heard, are the Magico Q-Subs and the Avantgarde long bass horn subs. Paradigm makes a cool looking sub too.

    Personally, I havenít found a desire to add a sub to many of my setups over the years. I know subs are more about the midrange than the bass, but Iíve still never found a need too often.


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  5. #4
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    Re: Are subwoofers bad for music?

    I definitely love my Martin Logan dual subs with my Magnepans. They are fast, musical and integrate flawlessly. They disappear and you only know that they are their if you turn them off. They have enhanced the music and my enjoyment. But not all subs match well with all speakers. I have a velodyne sub that sounds like crap with my Magnepans. However, I am not so sure that I will be using my subs when I get my PSB T3's.

    I can certainly relate to live music having too much bass. 2 or 3 years ago, Stevie Wonder came to town and we had great seats at his concert. The bass was way too loud and drowned out his voice. It ruined the concert.
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  7. #5
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    Re: Are subwoofers bad for music?

    I turned off mine just to see what happened.
    My conclusion is that, at this moment, i canīt live without the sub.
    At first seconds there is a false sensation of further detail, but after 2 or 3 minutes it is clear that something is missing. Yes, my electronics need the crutch of the subwoofer

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  9. #6
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    Re: Are subwoofers bad for music?

    The dual powered 12 inch subwoofers built into each of my Vandersteen 7 Mk2 speakers are huge winners in my opinion. Deep bass extension, perfect integration and a strong foundation for the music.

    The same goes for the outboard Vandersteen Sub Nine subwoofers that I have auditioned, which seamlessly roll over from the internal subs below 100 Hz.

    The 11 band equalization on each of the subwoofers allow them to perfectly integrate into my challenging listening room. Richard V. really has it figured out.

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  11. #7
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    Re: Are subwoofers bad for music?

    I was never a fan of subwoofers, and still not a fan to this day. My first experience was my brothers attempt to match his DQ10’s with a sub. He finally purchased the Dahlquist sub and it was horrible !!! Recently I joined two audiophile societies. Almost every member utilizes subs regardless of the hierarchy of the mains. Even speakers well over $20k are matched with subs. And some do not stop at a stereo pair. Four or more subs are commonly used. I understand why audiophiles use subs. It certainly accomplishes the goal of deeper and more robust bass. i can also understand it’s ability to enhance mids and high frequencies. But my gripe comes with trying to match dedicated subwoofer brands with other brand mains. If you want to knock yourself out, be my guest. But IMHO I have heard more situations where subs denigrate the sound rather than enhance it. In some cases they “steal” imaging, focus and soundstaging from the mains. Something the mains designer worked so hard to achieve. And why would someone want to combined a great selection of mains and amplifiers with class ‘D’ active subs, DSP, equalizers, volume pots and other hocus pocus ?
    == Joe ==

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  13. #8
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    Re: Are subwoofers bad for music?

    I'm sure subs can be integrated properly, like Joe, I've heard subs not integrated well for the most part.

    I personally choose not to go down that road.

    The best I've heard subs done, and, I honestly would have not known they were there unless I was told, the first time I heard Kinergetic with their swarm. The subs were audible, just blended the best I've ever heard, seamless.

    My friend has six JL in his 2-channel rig, they're blended pretty well, the subs have room correction, I think even with a microphone. Then he also uses a Wavelet.
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  14. #9
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    Re: Are subwoofers bad for music?

    If properly integrated, subs can give much more than low end extension and impact.

    The sense of realism increases markedly and it is almost as if you can hear the air of the recording venue.

    I'm truly happy with my pair of REL R528SEs.
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  16. #10
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    Re: Are subwoofers bad for music?

    For my needs for music soundfield recreation, subs are a must. YMMV.

    As a side note I use Foobar for my music player, which has a spectrum graphic showing exactly how deep the music goes, no guesswork. The guesswork folks might be surprised if they understood what they saw, although some sort of spin would be likely. Or not.

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