What if digital had never happened?

[Mike]

An interesting topic...

https://www.stereophile.com/content/...never-happened

[rbbert]

An interesting topic...

https://www.stereophile.com/content/...never-happened

if digital had never happened, we wouldn't be having this online discussion

[Mike]

Good point, and what would all the people who said:

1) we don't need no stinkin' high res music! CD quality is all anyone needs. You can't hear beyond 16/44! Perfect sound forever. No one can hear beyond CD quality anyway.
2) rip my CD's? Put a computer in my listening room? Blasphemy!
3) we don't need no stinkin' DSD music! CD quality is all anyone needs. DSD is an archiving format, not a playback format! It's a terrible idea! (Source: https://forums.linn.co.uk/bb/showthread.php?tid=23096)
4) we don't need no sinkin' MQA music! CD quality is all anyone needs. It's a money grab! A scam! A get rich scheme for Bob Stuart!

Hell, even digital has given the hardcore vinyl guys something to bitch about:

[Dizzie]

I only got this far into the article before I realized how stupid it was and exited. Maybe the author redeemed himself later.

"How much better might LPs sound today had analog technologies of recording, mixing, and mastering continued to advance? Who knows? Had digital been a nonstarter, the 300,000,000 folks (!) who bought Apple iPods might instead have bought 300,000,000 turntables and cartridges. Omigod—with economies of scale, turntable design might have progressed so far that today's budget Pro-Ject turntables would sound like Döhmann models, and affordable cartridges surpass even the best Lyras."

I guess the writer never heard of "portability". Does he have a turntable in his car?

Uh Mike, CDs are kind of digital.

[Mike]

Oh, I forgot HDCD.


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[Phishphan]

Oh, I forgot HDCD.


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All the Grateful Dead concerts that have been released in the last number of years have been in HDCD format. But I don’t know of any other label using it.

MQA is a great idea for streaming. But that’s about it. Give me DSD downloads any day. They generally sound the best.


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[Bobvin]

I use my digits to place an album on the turntable, so what is all the fuss about.

[CPP]

if digital had never happened, I'd still be enjoying my LP's and CD's,

[rbbert]

All the Grateful Dead concerts that have been released in the last number of years have been in HDCD format. But I don’t know of any other label using it.

MQA is a great idea for streaming. But that’s about it. Give me DSD downloads any day. They generally sound the best.


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although they are labeled "HDCD" in fact they haven't used any HDCD features since 2014, and even before that many of the GD releases didn't use the HDCD features, although some did.

[Phishphan]

although they are labeled "HDCD" in fact they haven't used any HDCD features since 2014, and even before that many of the GD releases didn't use the HDCD features, although some did.

They still advertise that it’s mastered in HDCD. The branding is on the packaging. I can’t imagine they’d do that if it wasn’t still being used.


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[rbbert]

They still advertise that it’s mastered in HDCD. The branding is on the packaging. I can’t imagine they’d do that if it wasn’t still being used.


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what you imagine and what is are apparently different. Foobar 2000 is free; it has a plug-in for HDCD which can be set to indicate when and whether the HDCD features are being used. Or use the HDCD plug-in for dBPoweramp and look at the ripped files in Audacity or another audio editor.

[asindc]

what you imagine and what is are apparently different. Foobar 2000 is free; it has a plug-in for HDCD which can be set to indicate when and whether the HDCD features are being used. Or use the HDCD plug-in for dBPoweramp and look at the ripped files in Audacity or another audio editor.

If you use the Windows version of dbPoweramp, with HDCD detection selected, to rip an HDCD, it will indicate upon completion of the rip whether or not the CD truly has an HDCD layer.

[rbbert]

If you use the Windows version of dbPoweramp, with HDCD detection selected, to rip an HDCD, it will indicate upon completion of the rip whether or not the CD truly has an HDCD layer.

The issue isn't whether or not the CD has the HDCD "flag" (that can be added to any file processed in the Pacific Microsonics DAW), it is whether or not any of the HDCD features (Peak Extend and Low Level Range Extend) are used. Foobar 2000 will tell you that, but if you use dBPoweramp, you need to analyze the file in an audio editor to know.

[asindc]

The issue isn't whether or not the CD has the HDCD "flag" (that can be added to any file processed in the Pacific Microsonics DAW), it is whether or not any of the HDCD features (Peak Extend and Low Level Range Extend) are used. Foobar 2000 will tell you that, but if you use dBPoweramp, you need to analyze the file in an audio editor to know.

I don't dispute that, but I do know that in all instances when I have ripped an HDCD using dbPoweramp, the resulting file is 24 bit. In contrast, some HDCD-labeled discs trigger(ed) the HDCD indicators on some CD players even if the disc did not contain a true HDCD layer.

[rbbert]

I don't dispute that, but I do know that in all instances when I have ripped an HDCD using dbPoweramp, the resulting file is 24 bit. In contrast, some HDCD-labeled discs trigger(ed) the HDCD indicators on some CD players even if the disc did not contain a true HDCD layer.

It's a purely artificial 24 bits; at best, HDCD gives you 17 bits, but that is not a supported format, so 24 bits is the default. If Peak Extend and Low Level Range Extend are not enabled during encoding (and for the vast majority of HDCD's, they are not), you will end up (after ripping and "decoding" HDCD) with a digital file that is identical to the "undecoded" one, IOW one ripped without enabling HDCD in dBPoweramp (assuming you rip the CD to 24bits both times, or open the 16 bit file in the audio editor as a 24bit file). Try it yourself, you will see.

BTW. it is not an HDCD "layer"; there is only one fileset on the CD (that's all Redbook allows for). It is a codec, and there is a "flag" encoded in the LSB, typically once about every 5 seconds, which triggers the decoder.