Do parallel SET amps (PSET) lose any sweetness from the added power of extra tubes?

[joeinid]

I'm curious where the sweetness of SET leaves at the expense of more power.

I am SET curious (ok, obsessed) these days and not sure where to focus my attention on amps/manufacturers.

[the professor]

On the Border Patrol 300B amps I listened to. Yes, there was a slight loss of sweetness with the parallel. But it was definitely worth having the extra 8 watts for some extra headroom. That was with the Volti Vitora's.

[KeithR]

depends on the speaker?

[joeinid]

Thanks Jock.

Keith, I'm still up in the air speaker-wise. Thinking Omega Alnico to start the ball rolling at 98-99 db effficient. Maybe Avant-garde in the future.

[mhanc]

it might be worthwhile having a look at a SET with a more powerful output tube -- such as a 6c33c, 845, etc.

for the 6c33c the two names that come to mind are Almarro and Ayon -- not sure of the current US distribution for the Almarro a318-b, but that is one sweet, sweet amp! it puts out 18 wpc. Thoress makes a nice 845 SET but that one is getting up there in price. there are many others out there i am sure.

[audiophil]

Thanks Jock.

Keith, I'm still up in the air speaker-wise. Thinking Omega Alnico to start the ball rolling at 98-99 db effficient. Maybe Avant-garde in the future.

I've always wanted to hear some of those omegas.

Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk

[Jack]

Joe

This is a SE amp I have been curious about for a while.

http://www.coincidentspeaker.com/rev...i-mar2016.html

Supposed to be a new review on TAS of it too.

On the Omegas, Louis has a couple of new monitors coming using his new 8" driver. They will also be around 98db. He has already posted the floor standing versions.

[joeinid]

I've always wanted to hear some of those omegas.

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There's a lot of Omega love out there. I also like the fact that he's fairly close to me should any questions/problems arise.

Joe

This is a SE amp I have been curious about for a while.

http://www.coincidentspeaker.com/rev...i-mar2016.html

Supposed to be a new review on TAS of it too.

On the Omegas, Louis has a couple of new monitors coming using his new 8" driver. They will also be around 98db. He has already posted the floor standing versions.

I'll check that out Jack. Mike mentioned Coincident to me as an option.

[sheltie1]

Are you looking for an amp or an integrated amp?

[joeinid]

Ultimately an amp with a proper matching preamp.

Are you looking for an amp or an integrated amp?

[sheltie1]

Have you considered the Cary 805AE's? They have quite a bit of power for a SET amp.....

https://www.caryaudio.com/products/cad-805ae/

[joeinid]

I have, but ruled them out. Friends with previous Cary experience turned me off to them plus I have Cary 300B SE amps which I'll hook back up.

What got me into all this was the new Grant Fidelity/Psvane Type 50 tubes that are getting a lot of attention now.

Have you considered the Cary 805AE's? They have quite a bit of power for a SET amp.....

https://www.caryaudio.com/products/cad-805ae/

[Jack]

Joe

Have you ever looked at Dennis' hand built Inspire line of amps and preamps? They have a large and loyal following on several forums. That Conicident amp can be run both ways. As an integrated with one source or as an amp. If the room they were in wasn't so large I would try one with the Spatials.

[dimfer]

I have a custom made GM70 PSET, I like it a lot. Builder said you can remove one GM70 tube and it will deliver half the power.. I haven't tried removing one of the GM70's though

[joeinid]

Joe

Have you ever looked at Dennis' hand built Inspire line of amps and preamps? They have a large and loyal following on several forums. That Conicident amp can be run both ways. As an integrated with one source or as an amp. If the room they were in wasn't so large I would try one with the Spatials.

Yes, I was looking last night. There's one on ebay now. Looks nice.

I have a custom made GM70 PSET, I like it a lot. Builder said you can remove one GM70 tube and it will deliver half the power.. I haven't tried removing one of the GM70's though

Wow, interesting. I almost bought a Lampi GM70 a year or two ago.

[Paul]

Audio Note Joe ?

[joeinid]

Audio Note Joe ?

[Jack]

You're right, great looking amp and sold today. He's even doing SE with KT-150's. Some of the amps do as much as 20-24 wpc so would easily push Omegas and even the JBL's. I probably need to break out the RM-10 and try it with the M3's just for fun. It did really well with the KO's and the STP-SE.

[Jack]

Even Audio Note UK is a totally different price bracket. You can call Bob Neil and talk to him as he carries the speakers and the electronics. Joe a speaker I always wanted to hear but haven't and that is supposed to be low power tube friendly is Reference 3A. Paul may have experience with them.

[wklie]

In the past I googled about PSET for a while regarding whether it's good or not from a design and user experience perspective. But as with any audio debate, there is no universally accepted answer , and the best conclusion that I could find was "depend on implementation".

I think the opinion of manufacturers that offer both PSET and SET is especially noteworthy. This company top-of-the-line SET is almost 3x the cost of its 300B PSET, and they rank the former to be two levels better than the latter:

http://www.ys-audio.com/real1605mbpower.htm

http://www.ys-audio.com/ysa300bpsem.htm

This is probably not the best comparison though, because the 300B PSET here still has less power than the flagship SET.

[joeinid]

How about Ayon Crossfire?

http://www.ayonaudiousa.com/us/produ...ssfire-pa.html

[Jack]

Gorgeous amp and well received but probably overkill for the Omega's where the popular choices seem to be Decware and Inspire. Since this is at this point a test of the waters I would make the first stab less painful to unload if you decide it is not for you. If you love it then you can climb the ladder.

[RDSChicago]

Joe, I previously sold my Melody AN845 SET integrated and regretted doing so. I just picked up a fully restored Bel Canto SET 40 power amp. I didn't realize that Bel Canto had dabbled in tube amps in its earlier days. It uses a pair of 845's and four 12AX7's. It's a sweet sounding amp (that magical triode SET sound) and I love that it cranks out 37wpc, nearly double the power of most 845 SET's. It weighs in at 85 pounds. Huge transformers.

Here are the specs:

Continuous power output into 4 or 8 ohms • 37 wattsPeak power output • >70 wattsBandwidth•-3dB 6Hz-35kHz
Class of operation • Class A single-ended 845 triode
Input level for 37 watts output • 1.5 V rms
Signal to Noise Ratio re 1 watt out • 96 dB A weightedDistortion at 1 watt / 1 kHz • <0.1% predominantly 2nd harmonicDamping Factor • 3 across full bandwidth
Input configuration and impedance • 100K ohm single ended RCAGain at 8 ohm tap • 21 dB

[Jack]

That Melody was a really great piece. Surprised you sold it. What speakers are you using with the Bel Canto?

[RDSChicago]

Jack, you are correct. It was a great amp. I still have the Melody AN300b integrated which is also a great amp, especially since I upgraded the power tubes to Sophia Royal Princess's.

I just got the Bel Canto a few weeks ago and have been traveling out of the country the last few weeks and haven't gotten a chance to critically listen yet. So far It has driven Trenner & Friedl Art's and Evolution Acoustic MMicro One's and both sound superb. This amp will drive most speakers. Highly recommended. If anyone is interested in a source for a restored factory-authorized Bel Canto SET 40 or the SET 80 monoblocks (nothing in it for me) PM me.

[Jack]

Sounds like you are set.

[RDSChicago]

Sounds like you are set.

Pun intended?

[sheltie1]

Jack, you are correct. It was a great amp. I still have the Melody AN300b integrated which is also a great amp, especially since I upgraded the power tubes to Sophia Royal Princess's.

I just got the Bel Canto a few weeks ago and have been traveling out of the country the last few weeks and haven't gotten a chance to critically listen yet. So far It has driven Trenner & Friedl Art's and Evolution Acoustic MMicro One's and both sound superb. This amp will drive most speakers. Highly recommended. If anyone is interested in a source for a restored factory-authorized Bel Canto SET 40 or the SET 80 monoblocks (nothing in it for me) PM me.

Those Bel Canto's are really nice.

[sheltie1]

Here's one a lot of people don't realize is out there --- Manley Neo-Classic SE/PP 300B

http://www.manley.com/products/view/nsepp

Let's you run the amp in SE mode for 11 watts or PP mode for 24 watts. It's surprisingly good...... I have customer running these with a pair of 0/96 speakers and he likes the combo quite a bit (and he used to run Joseph Perspectives with them as well).

[KeithR]

I've always wanted to hear some of those omegas.

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Me too!

[KeithR]

Knowing your tastes, a Viva Solistino on the right speakers might work despite being integrated. for separates, Audion is usually my recommendation although Sophia Electric has an older set of 845 monos for sale that sound excellent for not much $.

I prefer 845s which are easy to get and roll. the Ayon, KR, etc use tubes from 1 source which always is a risk to me.

[joeinid]

The more I look, the more I get sidetracked. That's not necessarily bad, but it just makes it harder to focus. I don't want to spend a lot and trying before I buy is near impossible.

[Anatta]

http://www.unisonresearch.com/en/products/valves.html

[Devg]

The more I look, the more I get sidetracked. That's not necessarily bad, but it just makes it harder to focus. I don't want to spend a lot and trying before I buy is near impossible.

Joe, just curious as to what did you decide ? I see you already have a TRX-M845 and also a PSET design - is that not sufficient to give the tube magic or are you missing something from it ?

[joeinid]

It might be a while before I actually buy anything else for now other than speakers. My first goal/desire is to get a reasonable speaker that will be comfortable with a handful of watts. I still have my ASL wave monos that were tweaked a little and a pair of Cary 300B SE that were upgraded by Cary themselves. I need to put them back in service. I am considering a pair of Omega Alnico speakers to be feed by my low watt amps. That will get me started for not crazy money. I'll be able to decide from there what I want to do speaker or amp wise.

I have to admit that my ASL amps on my Cornwalls was a fun combo. I'd love a speaker that is a little more refined than the Cornwalls with a smoother treble. Maybe some Avant-garde speakers or Volti Rivals could be an answer.

There are are other options but I don't want to go crazy. I still think the Tektrons could be fun amps too, with the option to run different tubes.

Joe, just curious as to what did you decide ? I see you already have a TRX-M845 and also a PSET design - is that not sufficient to give the tube magic or are you missing something from it ?

[RDSChicago]

Me too!

I had a pair of Omega floor standers and monitors, both with the hemp drivers. They were very nice for the price.

A nice compromise price-wise could be the Reference 3A's. They are easily driven with tube amps and have the added refinement you're looking for. BTW, your 845's, with their large transformers, could easily drive speakers with sensitivity in the high 80db's.

[joeinid]

Hmmm. I have not looked at Reference 3A's in a long time. I'll take a look.

I've been thinking about the perfect speaker for the Triodes. I see that they are paired with Spendor and a few others at shows. I do wonder how that combo would sound. If my Triodes don't sell, I may rethink things.

I had a pair of Omega floor standers and monitors, both with the hemp drivers. They were very nice for the price.

A nice compromise price-wise could be the Reference 3A's. They are easily driven with tube amps and have the added refinement you're looking for. BTW, your 845's, with their large transformers, could easily drive speakers with sensitivity in the high 80db's.