Tube vs. Solid State Pre Amp

[Msmoto]

As I slowly progress back into the realm of high end audio.... or whatever, I have arrived at the point of improvement which requires a serious decision. The pre amp I am using, which sounds really very nice, but maybe not as warm as I would like, is the Mark Levinson No. 38, purchased new in 1993. When I ask manufacturers they suggest going to a tube pre amp, even suggesting McIntosh, VTL, Acoustic Research, or Lamm.....

I have an opportunity to audition a VTL 5.5 Series II and am seeking out some thoughts regarding this, if anyone has an opinion. I have as a tentative budget somewhere less than $10,000, for sure, not over this. Also, is buying used a good idea?

And, while I am asking questions, how long do the tubes in a pre amp usually last until it is advisable to replace them. Some folks suggested replacing tubes ever 2,000 hours, another said the tubes in a pre amp last forever. Any guidelines are appreciated.

[joeinid]

Tube life depends on the preamp and design. Typically 3,000-4,000 hours is typical. Some preamp tubes will last 8,000-10,000 hours.

Depending on the amp, you can flavor the sound to complement your taste.

Are you still planning on using the ML 27.5 as your amp? Do you want balanced or is single ended ok?

[gadawg]

Another thought might be to go with a nice tube phono pre amp and tube dac. I did that and have really enjoyed the results! ARC DAC9, ARC PH8, ML No326s, MC-601's are the electronics and got exactly what I wanted with the tubes in the sources.

[Jack]

Or something like the new McIntosh 2600 will give you tubes in all three areas and you could sell off some of the spare bits. Another option and what I am using is the Modwright LS-100 preamp with the adjustable gain/loading tube phono board. MSRP is less than half of your budget. Still plenty of great NOS 6SN7 tubes out there to outfit it with.

[Mr Peabody]

My .02 as a ML owner, if you are keeping your amp, look for a more musical solid state amp, like Pass Labs, the XP10 can be had for a reasonable price used or new. If you go with a tube preamp, I'd encourage you to look for a balanced design, not just a preamp with XLR taps for convenience, balanced topology to match the ML amp. I found running my system balanced it gave a sonic improvement. I'm not saying this is always the case but it was for me and my particular gear. It wasn't just the gain, it wasn't night and day, but when the ML and Pass both using symmetrical balanced circuits made connection via XLR there was improvement and synergy and SQ.

Some time back I had both Pass power and pre, a friend brought over a ML #326 preamp for me to try. The preamp seemed to sound fine in his system but matched to the Pass amp it didn't come close to sounding as good as my XP10. It was odd with the 326, I can only describe it as sounding like I was only getting half an image, like vocals were narrow like the person was sideways or something. I know that sounds crazy. The ML pre just didn't work with the Pass power but my Pass pre is excellent with my ML power. Have to love this hobby, LOL

[Msmoto]

At present I am planning on keeping the ML 27.5, using balanced inputs from the pre amp.

A tube DAC sounds interesting, will investigate more.

Regarding balanced vs. single ended, the No. 38 is a fully balanced pre amp, actually converting single ended inputs to balanced prior to any processing by the pre amp circuits... or so I understand. For many years I was running single ended from the No. 38 to the 27.5, and upon doing some research on forums in the last year or so, I changed to a fully balanced connection between the 38 and 27.5. This single change resulted in the biggest improvement in the overall sound. Detail, volume, absolutely remarkable intimacy in soft passages, an entirely new sound, simply by eliminating what I had been sold years ago...and at a whopper of a lot of cash...LOL. I suspect I have between $1,000 and $2,000 in interconnects sitting in my closet. Nearly all interconnects are now from Blue Jeans Cable, and IMO give a "clean" sound rather than the strangely colored effects of some exotic interconnects, including the solid silver types.

I am most appreciative of all the suggestions. While the No. 38 is far from being state of the art, its overall performance based upon my listening, albeit with rather old ears, is I am nearly "home" as to getting the sound I want.

What seems to be lacking, if anything, is a sweetness, or warmth in the mid and high mid range. And, as I continue to make room adjustments, the margin for improvement is growing smaller all the time.

Especially of interest is the idea of a tube DAC, taking the FLAC files from my Vault 2 (now with 152 Gb of files) into a tube DAC then into the No. 38. For about $800 I can have the No. 38 serviced, and if I keep the No. 27.5, this can be serviced for about $2200, basically bring them both up to a "new" state. Also, a tube phono amp, I like this as well.

Thanks so much to all. Will be following for any other suggestions.

[Mike]

I would suggest the new VAC Renaissance V preamp. It's within your budget, has a separate power supply to reduce noise, offers the option for a terrific internal phonostage and VAC has always made great sounding tube preamps.

I have one here in the store. It's terrific.

http://www.theaudiobeat.com/newport2...rt2016_vac.htm

[Mr Peabody]

Yeah, I knew the 38 was balanced, I was suggesting if you replace it to stick with something balanced. You really have to do research due to some brands offering a XLR connection but the circuitry isn't actually balanced.

I'm glad your experience with going balanced throughout was the same as mine, then you already know what I mean.

If you decide to keep the 38 to add a DAC consider the Lampizator, even their entry piece is a strong performer at it's price. My friend has had a few, he started with one model and keeps going up the line. I'm not sure if all the models are balanced circuitry.

At present I am planning on keeping the ML 27.5, using balanced inputs from the pre amp.

A tube DAC sounds interesting, will investigate more.

Regarding balanced vs. single ended, the No. 38 is a fully balanced pre amp, actually converting single ended inputs to balanced prior to any processing by the pre amp circuits... or so I understand. For many years I was running single ended from the No. 38 to the 27.5, and upon doing some research on forums in the last year or so, I changed to a fully balanced connection between the 38 and 27.5. This single change resulted in the biggest improvement in the overall sound. Detail, volume, absolutely remarkable intimacy in soft passages, an entirely new sound, simply by eliminating what I had been sold years ago...and at a whopper of a lot of cash...LOL. I suspect I have between $1,000 and $2,000 in interconnects sitting in my closet. Nearly all interconnects are now from Blue Jeans Cable, and IMO give a "clean" sound rather than the strangely colored effects of some exotic interconnects, including the solid silver types.

I am most appreciative of all the suggestions. While the No. 38 is far from being state of the art, its overall performance based upon my listening, albeit with rather old ears, is I am nearly "home" as to getting the sound I want.

What seems to be lacking, if anything, is a sweetness, or warmth in the mid and high mid range. And, as I continue to make room adjustments, the margin for improvement is growing smaller all the time.

Especially of interest is the idea of a tube DAC, taking the FLAC files from my Vault 2 (now with 152 Gb of files) into a tube DAC then into the No. 38. For about $800 I can have the No. 38 serviced, and if I keep the No. 27.5, this can be serviced for about $2200, basically bring them both up to a "new" state. Also, a tube phono amp, I like this as well.

Thanks so much to all. Will be following for any other suggestions.

[mep]

As I slowly progress back into the realm of high end audio.... or whatever, I have arrived at the point of improvement which requires a serious decision. The pre amp I am using, which sounds really very nice, but maybe not as warm as I would like, is the Mark Levinson No. 38, purchased new in 1993. When I ask manufacturers they suggest going to a tube pre amp, even suggesting McIntosh, VTL, Acoustic Research, or Lamm.....

I have an opportunity to audition a VTL 5.5 Series II and am seeking out some thoughts regarding this, if anyone has an opinion. I have as a tentative budget somewhere less than $10,000, for sure, not over this. Also, is buying used a good idea?

And, while I am asking questions, how long do the tubes in a pre amp usually last until it is advisable to replace them. Some folks suggested replacing tubes ever 2,000 hours, another said the tubes in a pre amp last forever. Any guidelines are appreciated.

Might as well have asked people what kind of woman you should date. By the time people are finished with their recommendations, you will have either been convinced to become a nun or you will be dating a trannie. People never stick to the script-I swear. You asked for opinions on a particular tube preamp, and you have already been given recommendations to buy a tube phono section or DAC instead. Another guy is trying to point you towards another SS preamp.

So Msmoto, here is my advice for you since I have never heard the VTL 5.5 Series II outside of audio shows:You said you have an opportunity to audition the VTL and I hope that means in your system. If so, by all means bring it home, lash it up to your system, and put it through its paces. Let us know what you think of how it sounds in your system.

[Mike]

Uhm Mark, I believe Ms. Lauer is a lady and I believe in her follow up post she asked for other suggestions.


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[KeithR]

I have auditioned the VTL 5.5mk2 and its VTL's only true tube linestage (the others are hybrid). I compared it to my Valvet line stage at the time and the VTL only excelled in the bass. I found it a decent linestage, but wasn't overwhelmed - when we moved up to the 6.5, I found the VTL a lot better.

At that price level, I would also be thinking Vac as Mike suggested or Nagra Jazz. All 3 will sound different, so synergy is going to be the difference but I think they will all outperform your No. 38.

[mep]

Uhm Mark, I believe Ms. Lauer is a lady and I believe in her follow up post she asked for other suggestions.


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OK-we will change woman to man in my story...

[Mr Peabody]

"not that there'd be anything wrong with that", referring to original post Hoping other Seinfeld fans might get it.

OK-we will change woman to man in my story...

[mep]

"not that there'd be anything wrong with that", referring to original post Hoping other Seinfeld fans might get it.

I just never cease to be amazed that when people ask very specific questions, they get answers that have nothing to do with their original question(s). Example: I'm interested in buying a new pickup truck. What do you guys recommend?

Answers: I think you should buy a Ferrari. They look much better and are way faster.
Have you thought about buying a crossover vehicle? I think that would be a better option for you. I love my crossover vehicle.
Mini Coopers are really nice and you can probably haul whatever you need in the hatchback and you will get better gas mileage.

You get my drift...

[Mike]

Answer: VTL preamps aren't world beaters.

Want a great tube preamp? Buy an ARC or VAC.

That direct enough?


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[Mr Peabody]

I got it the first time. The quote was referring to the dating analogy. Unless you seen the classicc Seinfeld episode it won't make sense.

I just never cease to be amazed that when people ask very specific questions, they get answers that have nothing to do with their original question(s). Example: I'm interested in buying a new pickup truck. What do you guys recommend?

Answers: I think you should buy a Ferrari. They look much better and are way faster.
Have you thought about buying a crossover vehicle? I think that would be a better option for you. I love my crossover vehicle.
Mini Coopers are really nice and you can probably haul whatever you need in the hatchback and you will get better gas mileage.

You get my drift...

[Msmoto]

I think I love you guys.... Of course there are not a lot of female audio freaks, so my presence may amaze you. But, I will audition the VTL, this is one available, and if it provides what I am looking for, most likely purchase it. But, I am also thinking McIntosh C2600, primarily as McIntosh has been used in show demos by Totem Acoustic when they demoed the Element Metal Speakers. And, I had an old McIntosh receiver which sounded great. .....until total failure after about 60,000 hours of running sometimes 24 hours per day for nearly twenty years.

But, it is all about trying this stuff in my system, my room, my ears. And, the suggestions are all appreciated. Even if I drive Porsches....

I do have a huge advantage as well.... no WAF

[mep]

I think I love you guys.... Of course there are not a lot of female audio freaks, so my presence may amaze you. But, I will audition the VTL, this is one available, and if it provides what I am looking for, most likely purchase it. But, I am also thinking McIntosh C2600, primarily as McIntosh has been used in show demos by Totem Acoustic when they demoed the Element Metal Speakers. And, I had an old McIntosh receiver which sounded great. .....until total failure after about 60,000 hours of running sometimes 24 hours per day for nearly twenty years.

But, it is all about trying this stuff in my system, my room, my ears. And, the suggestions are all appreciated. Even if I drive Porsches....

I do have a huge advantage as well.... no WAF

Ms. Tommie Lauer, I do like you because you have a sense of humor. You might really be a 90 year old man in a nursing home with access to a computer, but either way, you have earned my respect.

[Msmoto]

Here is a photo of my "nursing home room"...

Tee Ve or Not Tee Ve_01.05.2017_TFL-1 by Tommie Lauer, on Flickr


And, at present, having just measured my frequencies from about 20 - 200 Hz, I am discovering I need to bring the speakers out into the room more as I now have a huge bump at about 40 - 50 Hz. I may play with some large foam as well.

I like the heavy lower end, organ music comes alive... Like Virgil Fox Live at Fillmore East...when he says "a happening" he means it!

I am gathering in the idea of doing many trials prior to purchasing anything. As I have an old Theta DS Pro Basic II sitting around, I am going to place that in the line from the Vault 2, coaxial into the Theta, single ended into current No.38. Second trial will possibly be an old McIntosh C28 Pre amp, just to get an idea of what differences are made by changing out stuff.

What I have currently is an almost holographic sound stage, very detailed musically intimate sound from 20 - 20,000 Hz. What I am seeking is a softening, warming of the mid and highs as the "digital" sound with the current configuration is not the perfection i have in mind.

With that I will begin my exploration of various pieces of equipment and report back what my ears are telling me.
Thanks

[ashandger]

I would also suggest CAT Renaissance. Can also have a phono stage if required.

[erniejade]

How about a Cary 05 preamp? To me it has a wonderful sound, the speed of a SS but, some of the bloom tubes. The Mcintosh C2600 is a nice piece also as well as the Mcintosh C500. A person on another board has the Cary 05 and is going to be trying out a Mcintosh C500. I am kind of excited to read about that shootout. Love the nursing home room LOL looks great!

[erniejade]

"What I am seeking is a softening, warming of the mid and highs as the "digital" sound with the current configuration is not the perfection i have in mind. "

If your happy with most of the sound of your system, the Blue Sound Vault also might the issue. How about a Lumin instead? I had a Node2 on load for a little bit. The Node is basically the vault without the hard drive and ripper. When I did a shootout between my Laptop, Node2 and CD using the Node digital out to the same dac the CD and Laptop were connected to, my wife and I both put the Node2 last on sound quality, stage presence, texture, and overall sound balance. I am not trying to sound harsh but just sharing my experience.
On your signature, in my opinion the Vault would be the weak point. Also the Vault rips to flac. Not everyone will agree with this but, I have noticed uncompressed wav has more open and air to it. The gap does close quite a bit on Uncompressed FLAC vs Uncompressed Wav but you would need something like DBpoweramp software to rip it uncompressed.

Sorry to derail the preamp portion but your quote above kind of puts me in a different direction.

[Wasatch]

Tubes are definitely a very nice way to go. Buying used is also good, just know who your buying from helps alot.

[Randy Myers]

I believe her original post was tubes versus SS also. I also have been considering this since I recently picked up a vintage ARC tube amplifier to use as a change of pace to my Son Of Ampzilla II SS amplifier.

I was considering a pre-owned ARC but decided to go back to maybe the one piece that is considered the definitive term for giant killer. There is an almost universal agreement as to how amazing this pre-amplifier is... I know Joe has put it against various units priced at up to ten times it's price.

I am referring to the Wyred 4 Sound STP-SE. I know there are threads referring to this amazing unit sounding more tubey than tubes, more accurate than many world class pre-amplifiers.

Unless you have already decided 100% on tubes or the VAC for example, you owe it to yourself to investigate this piece. American made in California, 5 year warranty, fully balanced, remote, built like a tank. And only $1995, or with the full stage 2 upgrade, which will pit it against anything.... period, it is only $3749.

https://wyred4sound.com/products/pre-amps/stp-se

What you say is missing in your system is where this pre-amplifier shines. It is one of the finest pieces that the renowned audio designer EJ Sarmento has ever created.

[Jack]

Actually the Level 2 STP-SE is a very good choice in that it gives you a sonic signature to the "tube side" of SS and none of the maintenance issues of tubes. As Randy said it is built like a tank though not designed for looks first. At $3750 for the fully upgraded model you could still buy a tube phono like the Manley Chinook for $3000 and a tube DAC like the fully loaded Musical Paradise MP-D2 for $1700 or the Lampizator Amber II for $1800 and have money left for other things. Mike can help you with the Manley or the Lampizator. The STP-SE or the Musical Paradise are bought factory direct.

[Alpinist]

I've owned Pass XP-30, Soulution 520 and now ARC Ref 10. The Ref 10 is far and away my favorite due to its smooth and refined treble, midrange body and textured bass. The width and depth of the soundstage is significantly greater than the solid state units I've owned.

Best,
Ken

[Rob181]

Of course you could always go bespoke...something like this Pre I had built...took me 2 years to find all the parts...

[wklie]

"What I am seeking is a softening, warming of the mid and highs as the "digital" sound with the current configuration is not the perfection i have in mind. "

If your happy with most of the sound of your system, the Blue Sound Vault also might the issue. How about a Lumin instead? I had a Node2 on load for a little bit. ...
On your signature, in my opinion the Vault would be the weak point.

I agree with erniejade on this, to add warmth Lumin A1 / T1 can be considered - but I have a conflict of interests in this.

[Mikado463]

but maybe not as warm as I would like, .

Want a great tube preamp? Buy an ARC or VAC.

That direct enough?

IMO there's no such thing as a 'warm' ARC preamp (note the Op's wanting), I've owned them for over thirty years. Arguably one of the more neutral.

Want warmth................. here's two initials ......'CJ' , warmth galore, although I think they may all be single ended ??

[KeithR]

Would agree that ARC sounds more like SS, so going to be closer to your Levinson gear. I would choose Vac of the "American Big Four"

[Randy Myers]

As far as I have been able to determine CJ is single ended... I actually was looking into them a little bit ago.

Or again get SS that exhibits characteristics of tubes.... without the hassle of tubes....

[Msmoto]

Wonderful, now at a point of total confusion....LOL

My conclusion is this. I travel about a fair amount and will be able to hit several cities where high end audio is available for audition. My request will be to listen to something in SS and then the same set up, but with a tube pre amp. If I do this enough times, selecting out some of the suggestions I have received here, I may be able to come to a conclusion based upon my own ears' experience rather than someone else's ears.

Prior to purchasing what I have, I spent about half a year in multiple rooms, listening, attempting to evaluate, with the results being pretty good (Old Quad ESL 63's). Now, with what I have, I find I can sweeten up the sound by moving speakers around, and testing the sound stage with some reference recordings. I prefer an engulfed sound experience where on some works, the sounds are behind me. Roger Water's Amused to Death, first track is one I like as it has huge range of volume, and voices, dogs, instruments, from all around the listening spot.

Ironically, having spent most of this afternoon moving speakers around, including moving my sweet spot back about 15", I have found the sound warmed up considerably. And the sound stage remained huge. I enjoy listening to all the suggestions, this gets my mind working, and in the next few weeks I will begin the "Great Vacuum Tube Preamplifier Discovery Journey".

I will continue to follow up as I gain more actual listening experience.

Listening to Phil Woods "Here's To My Lady" at present... just like heaven... his horn sounds very sweet....

Thanks to all!

[Randy Myers]

Roger Waters is the best for checking out sound stage... my current listening room is a loft and therefore both side walls are open... when my wife and I hosted our club meeting last summer the members could not believe how open a sound stage this created...

One of our club members writes for Stereophile and he put it through it's paces... totally blown away by how not having side walls affected the sound stage... EJ was very impressed how a stand mounted speaker could fill the entire house ... (I still would rather have his KEF Reference 3's )...

I had just hooked the Ampzilla back up for a bit... was listening to Blood, Sweat, and Tears in DSD, but after reading your post I had to put "Amused To Death" in DSD on....

I have been listening to the classic ARC ever since I got it... sounds very sweet... but the SST is pretty fantastic also... just don't want to run the ARC full time... $700-$800 every 2-3 years to re-tube can get a bit pricey... but might be worth it....

See this is the SS versus tube dilemma... the Ampzilla is pretty great, and for get a together playing all day, or for cracking up (rarity for me any more), it is pretty fantastic... but the ARC just has something special about it.... so.... dammmmmm....

[Wasatch]

IMO there's no such thing as a 'warm' ARC preamp (note the Op's wanting), I've owned them for over thirty years. Arguably one of the more neutral.

Want warmth................. here's two initials ......'CJ' , warmth galore, although I think they may all be single ended ??

Another Burmeister, and SS.

[Jack]

Randy

That 2-3 years that ARC was projecting was for the power tubes and not the driver tubes. A complete set of Genelex KT-88's will run you less than $250 a quad at multiple dealers. Other brands are much less. 6550's are even less at $160 a quad so play it as much as you want. The 6922 driver tubes will more than likely last twice that long and the Gold Lions are not that much. You or many of your club members could change the power tubes with no problem. Worry about the future tube purchases when the time comes.

[Jack]

Tommie

Another option that should be fairly easy to hear in your travels is the new fully balanced PS Audio BHK preamp. With a change in a jumper on the board it will take E88CC, PCC88 and 12AU7 tubes so allowing for quite a variety. Several members on the board are using it.

http://www.psaudio.com/products/bhk-...-preamplifier/

[Randy Myers]

Thanks Jack... honestly that makes me feel a bit better.... ...

[Jack]

Randy

Keep your eyes open for a sale and put a quad away for a rainy day. Will make you feel better knowing you are covered just in case.

[Mikado463]

As far as I have been able to determine CJ is single ended... I actually was looking into them a little bit ago.

Or again get SS that exhibits characteristics of tubes.... without the hassle of tubes....

I thought so on the CJ stuff, definitely a warm character though. Another 'warm' pre came to mind ....Cary Audio

as far as 'hassle' of tubes (signal) in a preamp, non-existent IMO. power tubes in an amplifier, that's a different story

[alto]

Interesting thread.

My shortlist: Mola Mola, SST Theobe, W4S STP, FM acoustics.

[Mr Peabody]

Since Tomi pretty much has a plan....

Out of tube preamps I've heard, and, shopping for myself, Octave Audio and Thrax would be at the top of the list with Jadis close. Leaning more lush, I do have a soft spot for CJ. The new Mac Ref preamp just under $10k was one of he better Mac preamps I've heard. I respect ARC and Cary but neither really appeal to my taste.

I didn't get a close look at the set up but Raven Audio sounded impressive.

[Mechnutt]

I would consider a Vinni Rossi Lio DHT preamp.

http://www.vinnierossi.com/lio-preamplifier/


Also give some thought to a BAT VK-33se

[Alpinist]

Since Tomi pretty much has a plan....

Out of tube preamps I've heard, and, shopping for myself, Octave Audio and Thrax would be at the top of the list with Jadis close. Leaning more lush, I do have a soft spot for CJ. The new Mac Ref preamp just under $10k was one of he better Mac preamps I've heard. I respect ARC and Cary but neither really appeal to my taste.

I didn't get a close look at the set up but Raven Audio sounded impressive.

I owned the Cary SLP-05 and currently own the ARC Reference 10 and they are both world class preamps.

The Cary has a warm presentation with amazing decay, delivers jaw dropping realism and places you in the venue better than any preamp I've ever heard. In my opinion, there is little that can match its performance at its price point.

The ARC Reference 10 is supremely neutral in its presentation with a huge soundstage in both width and depth, smooth and refined treble, midrange body and dimension, robust and textured deep reaching bass, wonderful detail and nuance, and incredible dynamics.

Ken

[Devg]

I am using a Cary slp-05 as well - very involving presentation. To get the most out of Cary, you really need to get some good tubes in there - the brighter the tubes, the better (Sylvania's are great but RCA will be too warm).

[Mikado463]

oh what the heck, since we're all going nuts with recommendations and given Tommie's budget of 10k or less here's one I've listened to that might be the best sub 10k pre I've ever heard .................

http://www.rogueaudio.com/Products_Hera_Front.htm

I think there's a used one on the 'Gon' right now

[Mr Peabody]

I respect ARC and Cary, notice I said, "to my taste", some like chocolate, some strawberry. Not a slam, just an opinion.

Vintage ARC I come closer to liking than newer models. To me, and by comparison, ARC seems stripped of tonal textures, or colors, colors in a positive sense. Back in the 90's I heard an ARC set up, VT100 drving Martin Logan Requests, can't remember which preamp, and a Wadia front end, this was the best I've heard ARC sound, the presence and imaging was incredible. Most ARC since has been complete systems with B&W, maybe the synergy isn't great. Based on that experience I actually brought home an ARC pre/power to audition at a time I was looking for a change. I was using Dynaudio speakers at the time, I didn't like the result.

I have a friend who actually carried Cary, hasn't officially dropped the line. He had the solid state, both tube preamps, single and dual chassis, I forget the model numbers, had a big tube Cary power amp, and a couple of their DAC's. He didn't do much tube rolling except to put kt120's into the Sly-80. I notice the gear tends to require a long break in period. I just favor other brands of tube gear over Cary, from what I've heard so far.

If you use either brand and happy, that's great. I don't believe I've seen anyone else hear with Levinson as I do, so we buy our gear to please our ears. Hopefully

[Randy Myers]

I have not had the opportunity of listening to current generation of ARC amplifiers, however the vintage VT50 that I just added to my system as a change of pace has been very impressive. I was actually surprised at how much I enjoy this amplifier as a change from my other amplifier, the Son Of Ampzilla II, which I really enjoy also!

[Mechnutt]

Another preamp to consider is the Atma-Sphere MP-3. It has a beautiful mid range. I preferred it over the more expensive ARC LS 27 in head to head listening. While not in the $10K range it competes well with preamps in the price group.

[Mechnutt]

Another preamp to consider is the Atma-Sphere MP-3. It has a beautiful mid range. I preferred it over the more expensive ARC LS 27 in head to head listening.

The Atma-Sphere MP-1 is a step up but I haven't heard one. It sells for about $10K.

[bonzo]

I would suggest the Berning. It has the best qualities of SS - linearity and transparency, with the harmonics of tubes, without the colorations and distortions.